The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

AI Sales Agents That Get You Signed Contracts On Autopilot: https://objectionproof.ai/yt-bacMaximize Your Tax Returns AndGet Clarity On Your Financials With Our Tax Guyshttps://beccfo.com/To Access Your Houses Equity For Capitalhttps://www.midwestlending.group/r/disruptorsBONUSGET 10% OFF ON INVESTORLIFTUse promo code DISRUPTORS.https://get.investorlift.com/disruptors/WANT TO BE A 100 MILLIONAIRE OR ARE ONE?Click here: https://objectionproofselling.com/millionairePat Grace HELOChttps://patgraceheloc.comPat Grace of Pat Grace HELOC flew in from Kansas City to sit down with Steve Trang on the Disruptors Podcast and share the house hack most people have never heard of: using a first lien line of credit on the properties you already own to pay off debt faster while keeping your money accessible. Pat is a Kansas City real estate investor and licensed mortgage loan officer who owns 250 houses, a $70 million portfolio with a $40 million line of credit, and about $175,000 a month in net rent, along with a vertically integrated group of companies that includes a brokerage and a construction company. He started in his early 20s working with kids in juvenile detention centers with a sociology degree while buying real estate on the side, lived in the worst unit of his first multi unit property before anyone called it house hacking, and went on to work with hedge funds on almost 400 homes through the recession.Pat and Steve cover how a trip to Australia changed everything, when his friends there told him Americans are the only ones taking 30 year mortgages, and how he came home and replaced his mortgage with a first lien line of credit and swept his money into it; why a $250,000 mortgage can cost about $300,000 in interest over 30 years; how sweeping your income into a line of credit pays debt down faster while your access to the money never goes away; the story of a client whose $500,000 mortgage was gone in 30 days and who now has access to $1.7 million; why he insists on a fi

Prefer audio?

Full Transcript

21516 words

Speaker 0: And in thirty days, I got his $500,000 mortgage gone, and he's got access to $1,700,000. Every bank has

Speaker 1: it. Mhmm.

Speaker: Nobody sells it. Nobody talks about it. I literally paid their house off in thirty days.

Speaker: Mhmm. You know, like...

Speaker: And they still have access to the $500. Like, I don't have any amortized mortgage, not one. And I always have access to capital. You know, I don't need partners. I don't need to underwrite.

I got a $3,000,000 line on this beach house that appraised for $5,000,000, and so you literally pay no money until you draw. You don't have to raise capital. The capital's in your portfolio. It's right there. And then once you see it, you can unsee it.

Speaker: Welcome, and thank you for joining us for today's episode Disruptors, where millionaires are made. Today, we have Pat Grace with Pat Grace Helock. And Pat flew in from Kansas City. Talk about the house hack the ultra wealthy are using that you have not heard of. Guys, I'm on a mission to create millionaires.

Information on this show alone is enough is enough to help you become a millionaire in the next five to seven years. If you take consistent action, you will become one. And last episode, we had George Anton here talking about understanding how money works is one of the fastest ways to become wealthy. And here we got Pat talking about the hack that he's used to... Was it 250 doors?

250 houses paid off? Yep. Yep. Stupid crazy numbers. Right?

But before we get to all that, alright, before we get to all that, let's talk about what we just... What was your life like actually before you got into real estate?

Speaker: Oh, man. Good question. So that was twenty five years ago. I was 21, 22 years old, and I, had my degree in criminology sociology. So I was doing juvenile case work.

Mhmm. And so my job was to get the kids ready to get out into the streets, and so I had to find them housing. And so I ran into these real estate investors in Kansas City back in two thousand, two thousand one. And that's when I figured out, shit. You could buy houses for $20 in Kansas City at that time.

Speaker: So you were working, with, involved with the juvenile detention centers?

Speaker: Yeah. And so you're getting

Speaker: those kids ready for real life.

Speaker: Right. And so I had to find them housing. And so I'd be putting... Looking for group homes, and I ran into a bunch of real estate investors that were buying these five, six bedroom homes right off Paseo and, like, turning them into group homes. And then the county was renting them for $700, and these guys was telling me they was all in 100,000.

Speaker: I was like, man,

Speaker: that's the numbers I need to

Speaker: So very quickly Yeah. Your college degree

Speaker: Did not work.

Speaker: And your your your job and working with the juveniles

Speaker: It's not the same. My wife my wife went to nursing school and did the nursing thing for literally two years and quit.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. So it didn't take very long.

Speaker: For sure.

Speaker: I mean, how long from when your eyes were opened to how these real estate investors... How much cash flow are they making until, like, you're like, you know what? I'm gonna change careers.

Speaker: You know what? I got a funny story about that because I sat there and my job was out in the streets. Mhmm. And so I feel bad about it now, but not really. But, so I had to get these kids jobs and,

Speaker: you know, all this stuff. So while I was out

Speaker: in the streets, I was doing my real estate. So I was doing real estate for almost a year and a half Mhmm. Two years collecting a w two from, you know, the company, but I was starting this... So by the time they called on and was like, hey. This guy ain't really doing shit.

I had I had, like, 20 homes already.

Speaker: So This guy's not putting in his whole 40. This guy ain't doing anything, man. All his kids are recidivism rate was like a hundred percent. Oh, that's okay. You gotta make up for that now.

Speaker: And so that was the one thing I hated about that job was like, you put all the effort into the kid and then you set them back to the same home, Mhmm. You know? And it's the same... They they just... It's tough, man.

Yeah. And so it was real hard to... You know? Like, out of 10 kids, maybe three would do alright. The rest would do more crimes and do do the same shit they did when they came in.

So it was So

Speaker: you're saying, like, going through juvy, you help them get relocated Yeah. Was more often than not, they're going right back into the system.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. 100%. Like, because you're sending them back to the same neighborhoods, the same houses, the same Oh, the

Speaker: same influencer.

Speaker: The same... Yeah. The same environment. Mhmm. And so they're gonna go back to what they know.

Mhmm. And the little seven months, eight months, ten months they spend with you goes out the door in literally a week. Mhmm. And so

Speaker: They go back to the old ways.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And so that that was tough for me and not, you know, like, not

Speaker: So not seeing fruits of your labor.

Speaker: Right. Like, no And

Speaker: then seeing these other guys making a lot of fruit from their labor. Yeah.

Speaker: And so my first my first deal, I went to a Donald Trump seminar.

Speaker: So it's Donald Trump, Trump University. Trump University. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Okay.

Speaker: So he... And, I got me a mentor Mhmm. And I paid him... I was broke. I paid him, like, I got onto the one where you could pay, like, a thousand dollars a month or whatever.

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: so I jumped on that, and that guy actually helped me to buy my first, flip.

Speaker: And Okay. So my first... Yeah. It paid off?

Speaker: And I did, like, an FHA loan. I bought a fourplex. That was the strategy that I learned from them.

Speaker: We literally talked about that in the last episode. That was a bad idea. But anyway, continue.

Speaker: That was a great idea for me. So, like, no. I bought this fourplex. I had three units. I lived in one.

I took the worst one.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And I kept that thing for, I don't know, maybe a year and a half before I moved out of it. Mhmm. And then I kept the property for five, ten years, and I end up selling it for, like, $300, and I bought it for 80. Yeah. And it was a cash cow for me.

Like, it... I was cash flowing when I lived there.

Speaker: And so So the first property you bought

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Was to keep. Right. There's no wholesaling, and you're in this in this vision at the moment. No. Right?

So you were house hacking 2001 before even anyone called it house hacking. Yeah. You were house hacking. Yep. Right?

So so you had that fourplex. So that's a good deal. Mhmm. You got you got your w two because you didn't get fired yet. Yep.

Speaker: Right? And then And I was working at Olive Garden.

Speaker: Oh, okay. I'd work at Olive Garden

Speaker: Friday, Saturday, Sunday Yeah. At night. Mhmm.

Speaker: And

Speaker: then all the money I made there would go for my cash for the week. Mhmm. And then all the money I made on my w two and my wife's w two would go toward investing. And then all the rents, we would keep and Mhmm. Or the sales or whatever we was doing.

So, like, I worked at Olive Garden. Man, I had probably 30... I used to wait on my tenants.

Speaker: So you got your tenants coming to Olive Garden? Yeah.

Speaker: And so

Speaker: Did they recognize you?

Speaker: Yeah. Of course. I mean,

Speaker: I was their landlord, and I would work at Olive Garden at night, and

Speaker: that was just my cash money for the week for me and my wife. And that's kinda how we bootstrapped this whole thing. Starting was crazy.

Speaker: That's incredible. That's awesome. Right? So that means this is a true origin story. Like Oh, yeah.

You had no... You had nothing, like, handed to you.

Speaker: No. Zero. Yeah. No. I had to borrow $10 from my mom on my first rehab loan so I could show assets.

Speaker: You know? Like,

Speaker: I said, I promise I won't spend it. Yeah. I'll just keep it in there. And she's like, sounds kind of fishy.

Speaker: Yeah. Did she believe me?

Speaker: Of course. Yeah. That's my mom.

Speaker: But, you know, I ended up giving her back, I think, like, $12

Speaker: or or something. But, yeah, she, she had to borrow me some money so I could get my first... Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay. So you did your first deal. You got it. What...

How how did the second deal come about?

Speaker: So the second deal is where I got host. That was my first, like, I guess, horror story Mhmm. Where I did a rehab loan. I was playing arena football at the time in Kansas City.

Speaker: And what were you not doing?

Speaker: I tore my ace... I tore my ACL. And in the middle of the rehab, the first draw I gave the contractor, and that's when I learned to always do labor only, you know, but I gave this guy $15 to do the roof and a whole bunch of other Materials. Yeah. And I never seen them again.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so I had to eat that, and then I tore my ACL. And, like, everything went wrong in the rehab, and I had six month rehab loan. I had extend. I couldn't pay the interest because I didn't have it. I would've had to dip into my mom's money, and I couldn't do that.

Speaker: And so I was like...

Speaker: So I asked for a three month extension, and it took me nine months, and I screwed up the whole deal. And I still made $12. Yeah. You know? And I was like

Speaker: You're all 15, and you still made 12.

Speaker: Yeah. And my job was making $3 a month Mhmm. Doing casework. You know, I'd make, like, $100, $150 back then at night doing Olive Garden. And so I was like, man, if I was a focus on this,

Speaker: I

Speaker: think I would crush this.

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: it's easy. You know? And so that's my... And my wife just got her nursing degree Mhmm. That year.

And right out the gate, she got, like, $80 a year, which was a lot for a nurse back in that time Mhmm. Because she spoke Spanish and some private blue, Blue Cross Blue Shield hired her to do home health.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: So she was running around speaking Spanish, and they needed that. They didn't have any Spanish speaking nurse. So they paid her a lot of money. And so when she was making that much money, way more, like, more than double I was making, and I quit. I I quit my job.

That's when I quit, and I said, I'm not gonna do this no more. And I, I went into real estate full time. And then in two years, I had her quit her job because it didn't make sense no more.

Speaker: So you went in to flip it. So you had the vision to flip that one? Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker: That was a flip.

Speaker: Alright. Yeah. I mean, how did you even find that deal?

Speaker: Man, probably MLS. I was always an agent, and I know I used to find... You know, I used to I used to run that whole strategy where, like

Speaker: You said you were also a realtor? Yeah. Man, you're a hustler. You mean you... So you're you're arena football, Olive Garden, Juvy.

Yeah. I have my real

Speaker: estate license.

Speaker: Alright. So you know you know how to hustle.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and, you know, I kinda read that, you know, it's like in that rich dad, poor dad and that whole, like, just multiple streams of income.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so, like, that's kind of the way... That was one thing that I caught on to really quick, like... And that whole pattern of having multiple streams coming in and not just relying on one source of money. You know? And so...

And I kinda just took that in the real estate game over twenty five years and just developed, like, the the better I did and the more money I made, I would reinvest and own the companies that was taking my money. And so that's kinda mean? So, like, the first thing I did was cut out the agent. Mhmm. I got my real estate license.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? The second thing I did was get into the mortgage game. And I don't know if you probably remember back then, 2000 to 2005, I mean, I'm selling 400 credit score, 100% finance stated. You know what I mean? I was like

Speaker: Those are not good loans. They were not good loans.

Speaker: If you couldn't make money back then, you're an idiot. Right? Just like Man, it was so easy.

Speaker: Credit scores. I I still remember, like, one of my most traumatizing episodes, right, was, like... This is back when I was a realtor. This is o seven. And I had, like, this couple, and it was husband and wife.

Yeah. And they're both truckers. Right? And they're, like, we're looking to buy our first home. You know, we don't have any credit history.

I'm here as a realtor. I know a little bit about mortgages. And I was, like, you know what? It's no big deal. Right?

Like, FHA, we just need trade lines.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Like, if you got, proof of the lease you've been paying, you got a cell phone bill, and you got, like, electric bill. Yeah. FHA, we're good. Right?

If you got no credit, we're good. And, like, they seem like the nicest, genuine, authentic couple. Right? And so... And this is back when we still use fax machines.

Right? So I I fill out all the stuff, the the Social Security number, the date of birth, blah blah blah, and I send it to my guy. I faxed it to him. And he calls me up, my loan officer. He's, like, laughing.

Like, why are you laughing? Right? Like, I just stayed late till, like, 07:00 on a Friday night to do this this buyer consult in my office. Like, why are you laughing? He's, like, Steve, these guys have a four fifty credit score.

Speaker: Yeah. I was,

Speaker: like, no. No. You're you're looking at it wrong. Like, they said they've got no credit. He's, like, Steve, they got credit.

And that was the first time I was like, to get a 400 credit score is hard. Oh. It it takes, like, diligent effort Yeah. To not

Speaker: pay your bills.

Speaker: To not pay your bills. To to get credit, screw up on it, get more credit, screw up on that, and get credit a third time Yeah. And screw that up. And you were still a 100% stated in them.

Speaker: You could you could do loans for anybody back then. I mean, it was the craziest time.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay. So you were doing

Speaker: That's when I started really getting heavy into it was when... So my second deal happened like that. My third deal, I got screwed on seven homes, and my... So I was looking for more rehab loans Mhmm. And nobody would give them to me because I had no experience.

And my first one kinda messed up, and I ran into this fraud guy who was running this Ponzi scheme in Kansas City back in the day. And he took me for, like, seven homes. Basically, like, I'd...

Speaker: He would

Speaker: pay me he would pay me $30 each house, and then he would manage all the properties, and then he would sell the properties within the year. Mhmm. And, you know, and I was like, hon, that might be a good way for me to get started and get going. I'll have properties. I'll have sales.

I'll have Mhmm. History. And, shit, within sixty days, dude, I was getting late notice that, like, my... The mortgages weren't getting paid and this and that.

Speaker: And it's What do you mean? Yes. What was the arrangement?

Speaker: So the arrangement was he would buy them, he would remodel them, he would rent them, he would manage them Mhmm. And then he would sell them within the year.

Speaker: But he would buy them, he'd borrow money from you, he'd borrow money from someone else.

Speaker: He was using my name to to borrow the money. I was like a straw borrower. Oh. And so I didn't know I didn't know all these terms, you know, in the '22.

Speaker: Yeah. You're you're you're a straw buyer.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And so, you know, they're putting these homes in my name, and then they're paying me $30 a house to do it, or they're getting these homes to appraise for. I didn't know they had all this fraud or they had appraisers. They...

It was a ring. It was a racket. So, anyway

Speaker: Oh, it was it was a complete scam. We saw all the mechanics.

Speaker: Yeah. And then... So, like, I'm I'm a... I'm in real estate school, and the only attorney I know is the guy who's teaching the class. Mhmm.

So I go to him, and I'm like, hey. I think I'm getting screwed here blah blah. He's like, Pat, I need paperwork. So I go to get my paperwork. They didn't give me my paperwork.

So I went down there

Speaker: Oh, you went to the guy? Yeah. To get any paperwork?

Speaker: My files. Mhmm. He wouldn't give them to me. And so I came back with two big Italians and a hand trucked three file cabinets out of his office and took all that to the

Speaker: So you're resourceful? Yeah. And we took... I took that

Speaker: to the attorney, and we found, like, 385 homes and over 50 investors. And so we called them all. We all hired the same attorney. We all went after the banks. So we sued

Speaker: the banks. Banks?

Speaker: Yeah. There was, like, three or four banks that was doing all the loans. Mhmm. And so we went after those banks. And, basically, we asked them to just set set our stuff aside, like, act like the transaction didn't happen.

Mhmm. My 750 scores went to five fifty. My wife was ready to leave me. She... It was a bad situation.

Yeah. And so I had my license. The second thing I did, I was like, man, this mortgage guy fucked me over, dude. I need to go I need to go figure this out. Mhmm.

And so I went to a mortgage company and got hired there, and I learned the whole money game and how you package up paper and how you, you know, get lenders' approvals and Yeah. Everything for... On the finance side. And because I was doing rehab loans and I knew a lot of investors, I ran into this niche.

Speaker: Well, hang on before I get to this niche. What do you mean you went after the banks? Like, what were what were the banks liable for?

Speaker: Okay. So the bank's underwriting division allowed... So when it... So what what I end up... We end up finding out...

Because I remember nobody wanted to give me rehab loans. I was like, how's this guy getting me approved for seven loans where I didn't know is he was, like, redoing all my w twos, all my taxes were

Speaker: They got

Speaker: what I submitted. And then when the FBI came, what was submitted to the bank was totally different. And So they

Speaker: were committed

Speaker: to was, like, it was the same appraiser, the same title company, the same two, three loan officers, the same guy who ran the scheme. It was like... And the same banks. And so it was like a whole So,

Speaker: like, the banks should have known.

Speaker: Right. And so we went after the banks. Right.

Speaker: And

Speaker: then we let the banks go after them guys. Mhmm. So all those guys got five to ten years

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: In jail. And now they're out, and I see them at auction again. How about that? Yeah. I just seen one of them the other day at the real estate auction.

I was laughing. I was like, what you doing here? Yeah.

Speaker: So... Alright. So, so you got, your debt with those things settled.

Speaker: Your Everything got set aside.

Speaker: Like, it didn't happen. Score and score.

Speaker: Went back up.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: And now I got access to homes. Mhmm. And I got access to money. Yeah. Yeah.

I can do my own loans. And back then, you didn't have this 10 limit FHA rule. You could have 30.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, and get 3% rate, whatever, 30.

Speaker: For context, what year is this approximately?

Speaker: So this is probably, like, 2003 to maybe 2002 to 2004.

Speaker: You found a lot of trouble really fast in in in in, in this journey.

Speaker: Yeah. No. I mean, it happened. Like, the first one first one was good.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: The Trump University Yeah. And the mentor. The second one was trash. The third one is even more trash.

Speaker: Cat traffic. Yeah.

Speaker: When I look back at it now, it was like the best things that ever happened to me because

Speaker: It forced you.

Speaker: Yeah. And it and it gets you to the lowest of the lows where you... After that, I was like, fuck. What can... Like, what what else can happen?

You know? Yeah. Because I remember getting hit with a fire.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. You know, but just throughout the journey, I mean,

Speaker: you know, and getting started, I mean, nothing's easy. You know? You're always gonna run into stuff you don't know, You know? And and so it was... I kinda experienced, you know, all that in the beginning.

And then... But like I said, it all happened within a year to a year and a half. And then from that point on, you know, things got really good. Mhmm. And, So

Speaker: you got into this lending thing, and you see you got a niche.

Speaker: What was the niche? So the niche was I had all the banks that would pay off the six month rehab loan using the appraised value. Mhmm. No seasoning on title. And so back in the day, not too many lenders would do that loan.

Mhmm. And so I was getting rehab loans, and I was paying my loans off in three months. And all my banks and my rehab lenders was like, hey, Pat. How the hell are you paying these loans off in three months? And I was like, shit.

If I told you that, you wouldn't need me. Just send me all your guys. And so... But my mortgage business went to, like, 30 loans a month. You know, just...

I had... Every investor in Kansas City was sending me deals.

Speaker: So is this, what is it? Is it rate and term refinance?

Speaker: Yeah. And cash out.

Speaker: Okay. I could go up to 90 rate and term and cash out?

Speaker: At... In that time, I could go to 95 option one. I still remember the lender. Remember option one? They would do 90 to 95% cash out refi non owner.

Wow.

Speaker: They were giving money away that year. Yeah.

Speaker: Okay. And I was selling 10 rate

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: On that loan, and people was doing it. Like, investors were doing it. And and so, I had the 80% or the 75%, you know, like, Fannie Freddie product.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: But a lot of people wanted more money.

Speaker: Yeah. Of course.

Speaker: Is there. They're gonna take it. Yeah. And so, and I I I had that niche, and so I had to hire, like, three processors. And from then on was, like, the first time I actually started making, you know, 30 to $50 a month

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, from finance. And then I took all that money, and I would wrap it back right into my real estate. You know? And then the third thing I started was the contracting company.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? And, like, not using for for construction.

Speaker: I know.

Speaker: But, like,

Speaker: it's because you're trying to cut down your rehab costs? Yeah. So you're still... You're you're doing $30.50 k a month in mortgages, and you're still flipping.

Speaker: Yep. Okay. Still flipping. And then I start the construction company. We get that going.

So I don't have these contractors in the middle, you know, taking all this money. And it forced me to develop a system, which I think was one of the biggest moves I made, throughout the career Mhmm. Of doing this. You know, for one, now you're only looking for labor only bids, so the roofer can't skate on you with all your money. Yeah.

You know? And so that was one big thing. And then the second big thing it did for me was it forced me to get, the accounts in my name, which I think... I don't think a lot of people think about that. But, like, I now can negotiate a contract with Sherwin Williams because I pay for all the paint.

It's on my... I can go to Goodman. I can go to Lenox. I can negotiate the price of machines for furnaces and ACs because I buy all the machines. If I just hired you, you would give me a labor and material bid now for $8,000, and you get all the credit.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so I quickly got all the credit so that this whole time I've been doing this, I always got cheaper paint than everyone. I had cheaper ACs than everyone. I had cheaper material by 10, 15% just because I controlled all of

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: The purchases. And so that was... You know? And then all a margin that I could make, you know, and really at that point, I was just doing my own houses. You know?

It's just Patrick and Marta Grace.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And we was buying the Northeast where all the Hispanics was living. I was buying them, remodeling them, and then my wife was putting all the families in them, and we was doing all owner finance.

Speaker: Oh, owner finance?

Speaker: Yeah. That's all we did. Like, we would get, like, $5 down, $10 down. We'd hold the paper, and we'd put all these Hispanics in there. They pay the taxes, the insurance, the maintenance, and we was just, like, bankrolling, and we got up to about a 100 homes.

Wow.

Speaker: So the the savings here, though, is 10 to 15% on paint, machinery, whatever. Yeah. And then not paying a contractor. Right. Right?

I mean, how much is that difference?

Speaker: Well, a contractor is usually on a 30% margin.

Speaker: 30% margin there. And any other savings? Or

Speaker: Well, and then I didn't have no middleman between me and mortgages. Mhmm. You know? So I was popping off 3% rate, thirty year term, paying nothing for... In fees because I was the mortgage guy.

Speaker: Yeah. So...

Speaker: And I would get 3% paying my own... I would not...

Speaker: So you save 3% here? Yeah. Points here on the mortgages.

Speaker: I'll get paid to buy a house on MLS, then I would... I wouldn't have to pay 6%. So I'd save 3% selling that house. And then I'd do all my own loans, and then I'd... Would...

I had my own contracting company. Yeah. And so... And the only thing I was focused on

Speaker: Only thing left here is a title company.

Speaker: Right. And property management.

Speaker: Property management. Yeah. Okay. So that That that leads to the next story. So what's the next step here?

Speaker: So the next story. So then And

Speaker 2: by the

Speaker: way, we're not even getting to the good stuff yet. This is just like a story. Well, you wanna just get to the good stuff? No. No.

No. No. I I I think it's impressive to hear. Right? Because, like, I mean, would you be the one that's gonna be walking...

Because we met a boardroom. Right?

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Like, would you be the one walking around as, like, guys, I'm the smartest person in the room? No. No. You wouldn't be bragging about that. Right?

No. But you hustled. You willed your way through. You powered your way through to, like, all the success you have. And I think there's a lesson here.

Right? Like, if you're willing to put in the work Yeah. Right? If you're willing to fight... Struggle and fight through it

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Like, you can have these crazy Yeah. Yeah. Crazy success.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: Yeah. So let's go to... So what's the next Okay.

Speaker: So then, like... So everything's going great, and then, boom. Like, I get... I run into this hedge fund that wants to buy my 100 homes.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so the way we structured it up was thirty thirty thirty. Right? So the last they... So they bought the first two packages of 30, and then they said they wouldn't buy no more homes because they couldn't find Spanish speaking property managers. So boom.

Speaker: Another opportunity.

Speaker: Yeah. Let's open up this management company so we could sell these last 30 homes. Yeah. And so that's what birthed our property management company was out of necessity to make a sale... To finish the sale.

The la... The 30 homes closed in January 2007.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I think Lehman Brothers goes out of business in August.

Speaker: That was good good timing.

Speaker: Yeah. And so I sold a 100 properties in basically the inner city of Kansas City. And all my mistakes, all my first five to seven years of real estate investing, which is all your mistakes. You know what I mean? Bought a wrong house, foundation, bad sewer, you know, all the drama.

And so... And these are nineteen hundred nineteen twenty, like, not even good neighborhoods. Mhmm. Not, you know, just old shit. Yeah.

And so sold all that.

Speaker: Placed late.

Speaker: Yeah. And then I've got all this cash. Mhmm. And now I've got all these companies, and that's when I moved up to the Northland Of Kansas City. Mhmm.

I went north of the river, and I just started buying shit all through the recession. And, like, those properties

Speaker: cash rich at the best time.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. And then I just took all that money and all the network and all the services that I could provide, and I went up north, and I started buying these homes for... Instead of $10, $15, I was paying $60.70. And these homes are now worth $3.50.

Speaker: Yeah. You

Speaker: know, rent was $800 back then. It's 2,500 now, and I got hundreds of them now.

Speaker: How liquid were you in that in that transition?

Speaker: Oh, I probably had, I don't know, maybe $3,000,000

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, and and after that sale. Yeah. And so that was a good... Like, I was able to take all that money, and I was able to leverage it. You know, I was still doing mortgages, and banks were still giving loans in the recession.

Mhmm. You just had to go fold out. And that was one thing I always did, man. I always paid taxes.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: That's the one thing I learned in boardroom. That was the biggest thing I learned in boardroom is people like, why are you paying taxes? And so... But I had an advisor always tell me, so all these guys was doing all this stated stuff Mhmm. And all my investors that I was financing.

I was doing bank statement loans back then. Like, I got $500,000 bank statement, but they got no money on their tax return. Mhmm. And so when, you know, the recession hit and they went back to a no stated, all full doc Mhmm. All those guys lost their job.

They lost all their homes. I had guys lose 300 houses because they couldn't finance no more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: So you said you moved north of the river, and I'm terrible at geographies. I'm guessing this is this is just better.

Speaker: Better. Yeah. To the burbs.

Speaker: To the burbs? Yeah. And so

Speaker: you move up and better schools, you know, just bet... Everything's better. The the property values, the rents, and and so, you know, and then I quickly figured out, like, a real quick underwriting. Kansas City is like... And I don't know how it is here, but, like, if you buy homes in Kansas City where all your neighbors have two car garage

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: It's a good neighborhood.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, there's not too many shitty neighborhoods where all your neighbors got two car garage. So I've kind of figured that out in Kansas City. I was like, I'll just stick with these two car garage neighborhoods. I'll be good. Yeah.

And so that's kinda what I did. You know?

Speaker: So did you pivot strategies, like acquisitions? Or were you still buying off the MLS?

Speaker: No. I was buying off the MLS. I was going to the auctions and, like... And then, you know, in the recession, these hedge funds started coming to Kansas City. Mhmm.

And because I had the bandwidth to do 15, 25 homes a month, I quickly became their go to guy in Kansas City. And so... And they loved South Of The River stuff. So it was perfect because I could go out, buy any 25 homes I wanted that month. The cherries, I would keep.

Shit, I didn't want, I would sell to them. You know? And just It was

Speaker: a great situation.

Speaker: Yeah. And I would just... And I and I I got up to almost 400 homes with this hedge fund.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And that took me to... That took me all to the recession. So all the investing I was doing plus all my companies, you know, and I was crushing it. I mean, I was closing 20, 25 homes a month. I was making real estate commissions.

I was making construction commissions, property management commissions.

Speaker: Mortgage.

Speaker: Doing my... Yeah. And doing my own stuff on the side. And then that took us to about 2010, maybe '11. Uh-huh.

And they stopped buying. You know? Yeah. The the take wasn't good no more. Yeah.

So then I had

Speaker: I was like, I think probably Blackstone.

Speaker: Yeah. Right? Started coming in, buying... I... People just...

They they stopped buying because, the... It was priced out. Like, people was... It was played out already. Everybody was doing it.

All the hedge funds was in at that time. Yeah. You know? And so I don't know if you remember that,

Speaker: but it

Speaker: was big. And then after the hedge fund community came the educationers.

Speaker: You know? Educators. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: You know, the the

Speaker: New Irish?

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And the fan builders. Fan Morrell, Fortune Builders. Yeah.

All those guys was coming through. That was the next big wave of people that came in. And So

Speaker: before we get there, right, it's a lot of companies. And I remember... So we're gonna talk about how we worked together and how you fired me. That's the... That's later on there in the show.

Right? It's later on in the show. But I wanna talk about, you know, and when we first started working together, right, it's later on the story, but it's it's relevant, I promise. Right? I had you take the predictive index.

Uh-huh. Right? And then you test it as a maverick. And, like, I remember I had you on the phone. Right?

I was like, hey. Like, I'm looking at this thing, and you're, like, an extreme maverick. It's like, what does that mean? It's like, well, like, you're really independent. You're really strong minded, probably stubborn, and probably quick to anger.

You're like, yeah. I was like, and probably no attention to detail. People like you, but you're grossly impatient. Oh. And you're like, are you reading my palm right now?

Like, what's going on? Sounds like me. Yeah. It's like... These all sound exactly like......

Speaker: Me to a t.

Speaker: Yeah. And so as I'm saying all these things, we go back to, like, you've got, like, five super lucrative things going on. Right? I think it's a realtor, mortgage, construction, rehab. Right?

And probably some property management.

Speaker: Property management.

Speaker: You have five things going at the same time, but you're supposedly disorganized. How are you managing all these things?

Speaker: Well, that's where my wife comes in.

Speaker: So she's left. So...

Speaker: Yeah. So she's like she's like the godsend. Right? I mean, so my wife is total opposite for me.

Speaker: So... And we haven't got to the brokerage yet.

Speaker: Yeah. And I'll... So I'll come to show... So my wife kinda handles the the... All of the books, the office, the staff, the people, the process.

You know, I just... My whole job was to put homes into the pipeline and handle the investments.

Speaker: Right. Right.

Speaker: You know? Yeah. And then she kinda just would handle all the staff and all the people. I mean, we had so much staff. We had so much people.

Yeah. Like, it was... Honestly, it burned us out, you know, and for later on in the story. I mean, it's kinda like... That's, you know, it kinda like...

I mean, when you're sitting here and you've got thousands of homes you're managing, And, I mean, there's fires and problems that Got some. Literally fires and problems every day.

Speaker: Real fires? Yeah. It's just like drama. You know? Just Yeah.

Speaker: And then you're living in Kansas City where you got the extremes. I mean, you've got 100 degree and then you've got negative 10. You know? And so pipe in a bust, and then basements are flooding, and, you know, just always drama. And so, you know, and doing all this work for...

I mean, it was good, and it was lucrative, but imagine if I just woulda stayed focused on just my portfolio.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, how much less stress and how much,

Speaker: But you can't stay still. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So Marta really is the is the hero here.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. 100%. I mean, she's like... I mean, you can't do anything by yourself. You always gotta have people around you.

And another thing is, I mean, my wife, I I know she wouldn't steal from me. She went... You know, like, everything was... Like, we just had this perfect thing where, everything worked out. I mean, we're direct.

I wouldn't say opposite. Like, in life, like, our religions and our way of thinking and this and that is the same. Mhmm. But in terms of personality, we're

Speaker: total style up.

Speaker: Yeah. We're, like, the whole opposite. Like, I'll fire you and you'll sue me. She'll fire you and you'll be best friends.

Speaker: Yeah. You know, I'm just like... So, was she managing all five things or she was managing the people? Like...

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. So she managed all the the the people, the processes, the employees. You know, I might hold some meetings, once a week or whatever and, like, you know, my... I would find new crews.

I would find new homes. I would find just... You know, I was putting all the deals together, finding all the clients for the real estate. And, like, the good thing when you have this vertically integrated model

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Is really you just need one house. One house fed every company.

Speaker: Mhmm. You

Speaker: know? So if I found one buyer or one investor who wanted to buy 10 homes, that was 10 deals for my real estate company, my mortgage company, my construction company, my property management company, and there's that multiple streams with the vertical setup Yeah. That, we kinda did, you know, really well with. Right. So we ran that for years.

I just stopped doing that literally, like, five years ago.

Speaker: Yeah. Alright. So so talk to me about... So you guys started a property management company. Yeah.

How hard was that?

Speaker: That was the hardest company.

Speaker: Of the... Of all the companies, that's the hardest.

Speaker: That's the hardest by far. Why? Staff. Nobody... Imagine a property...

Nobody ever calls their property manager and says, bro, you did a good job today.

Speaker: No one? Fuck. No. All you get is

Speaker: you get completed. As a property manager, you get the shit from the tenant Mhmm. The owner, your boss, because, yeah, it's like, everything's always wrong. Like, people only call you when shit's wrong.

Speaker: Yeah. No one's ever called you. It's like, man. And

Speaker: when when the rent's being collected and there's no maintenance and there's no nothing, nobody calls and says, hey, man. Just wanna let you know. Yeah. Doing good.

Speaker: Thank you for leasing my property. Yeah. Like, all all...

Speaker: As soon as the property is vacant, eviction, what... I mean, you stink... And then, like, everybody's yelling. So, like, to me, that's... The turnover on the staff was just, like, crazy on the property management.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then the fact that you're dealing with everybody at their worst times.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, like, either getting evicted, you know, they have maintenance issues. You know, it's like... It's just... I don't know. That was the worst company in terms of, like, even your mental state.

You know? It's like What

Speaker: I'm hearing here is I need to send a thank you card to my property manager.

Speaker: For sure. Yeah.

Speaker: Especially if they're doing good and you got no noise

Speaker: and nothing's happening, that's when you need to reach out to them and say, hey. Thank you.

Speaker: Yeah. I mean, I got an email last night from the property manager, and they're like, hey. Like, the sprinkler head needs to be replaced. It's a $125. And in my mind, it's like, approve.

Like, the first thought was like, approve. And second is like, they only charge me a $125. Like, this is a steal. Like, I'm used to getting ripped off. Yeah.

Right? As a landlord. So... Yes. Okay.

So department management, so that's taken care of.

Speaker: Yeah. And

Speaker: then you said, like, so the the the the the hedge funds came away, and then the next big rush was all the educators coming to the space.

Speaker: So same thing as the hedge funds. The education companies would come in. They, you would be a property provider. Basically, you would handle everything for their students that just paid them $50 to get educated. Mhmm.

And then they would introduce them to you, and you would provide properties for them and management and, like, white glove service.

Speaker: You know? So this is... Yeah.... Care of them. So now this is...

At this point, you've evolved into a turnkey operator.

Speaker: Right. And so we're getting properties from And

Speaker: so just real quick for everyone. Like, what what is so... Not everyone knows. What's turnkey?

Speaker: So turnkey is, I'm basically selling the investor the house rented.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: It's done, remodeled. So I would go out, buy all the homes for cheap. I would remodel them. I would put tenants in them, and then I'd sell them

Speaker: With a long term lease.

Speaker: With a long term lease to an investor

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And probably get their loan too. Yeah. And so, you know, we were... We did that for... Until COVID.

Speaker: Yeah. You know, and then COVID. Yeah. So for, like, nine years,

Speaker: you were doing turnkey. Doing that. I was doing a bunch of that for a long time. Yeah. Because...

And I had so many... There's so many different people. You know what I mean? Like, you look back, you know them all probably, but, like, you had rich dad, poor dad selling education for a long time. Mhmm.

Fortune builders for a long time. I mean, all these guys were coming through. And Trump University. Yeah. Jason Hart.

All these guys would come through, and you just have, you know, these big outfits and everything. You know? And so we became... We quickly became that Kansas City

Speaker: You're the source.

Speaker: Yeah. And so we had... We were still doing 20, 30 homes a month Mhmm. At that time for a long time. And then COVID came and they couldn't meet.

You know? When the companies can't do the seminars, they can't bring the people in. Yeah. It's done. You know what I mean?

Speaker: So nine years, a really solid run, selling turnkey homes.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: I mean, we kinda jumped straight. Like, nine years is a big leap here. Anything else interesting happened in those nine years? Or it's just

Speaker: Oh, I mean, the whole time, I mean, I've got three kids. All my kids are grown. I mean, I've got a 25, a 22, and a 20 year old. So the whole time this is going on, I'm coaching football. I'm the cheer dad.

I'm the gymnastics dad. I'm taking... Running my kids to practice, doing this and that. I mean, life is life in

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: At that time. You know what I mean? That was like... We were nonstop traveling. They were all on competitive teams, so, like, you know, cheer, travel for competitive cheer, football, wrestling, just baseball.

I mean, it was just one thing after the next.

Speaker: So this is like you're hustling. You're going hard doing all the turnkey homes. You're still rehabbing this whole time, flipping your own homes at the time?

Speaker: Yep. Still building the portfolio and keeping all the cherries and keeping the homes up north, all a two car garage, all the split level

Speaker: You're just stacking homes.

Speaker: All the split level, two car garage, 1,500 square foot, three bed, two bath. I was just... I was a collector Yeah. Of that. You know?

And I just was... I collected

Speaker: So you're you're you're acquiring these other deals, selling them, on a cap rate.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Because this is their retirement plan.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: You're keeping the best properties, and getting paid a whole bunch on every spot.

Speaker: Everybody to manage the portfolio. And then, like, five years ago, I end up selling the property management piece. Well, not... I I sold the contracts. Mhmm.

I didn't sell my property management company because I needed to manage my Mhmm. 250 homes and all my commercial buildings and my multifamilies, but I sold the the contracts for the property management to a big national firm.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And they put me on a noncompete for four years, which kinda threw me. And that's when I joined Boardroom.

Speaker: Yeah. And So was that, because you're saying the stress of running apartment management. Right? Everyone hates you all the time. No.

So was that was that a relief?

Speaker: Yeah. It was. But it was also, like, crazy because it was, like, the... How do I say it? Like, the, it made me feel lost.

I didn't have my vertical system anymore. Mhmm. That was the major piece of the puzzle is property management. I mean

Speaker: Why was it the major piece?

Speaker: Because nobody's gonna buy shit unless it's managed right. And if they don't have faith in your management and what you're doing and you don't have... Like, the owners love me. The tenants hated us.

Speaker: Mhmm. You know

Speaker: what I mean? You only can serve one master. And so we had to be owner facing with our management. Mhmm. And so we did such a good job, and we had all these five star reviews that all these educators would bring more people to us because

Speaker: They knew that they were performing.

Speaker: Because of property management. Yeah. And when you lose that piece and you can't manage all of a sudden... And you've been doing it for twenty years, your identity is like, holy shit. What am I gonna do right now?

Mhmm. Like, I can't sell this system because I can't manage, and I'm giving it to other people, and they're not doing it the way I do it. Mhmm. You know? And they don't do things the same.

And so sure. It was like, I was lost for a bit. I mean, that's where boardroom kinda came in and, like, kinda how... Where we transformed everything. And the biggest part for me was more of a mental transformation than, you know, the money was there.

That wasn't a problem, but it was more mental for me getting over this obstacle in my head that I'm not right because I'm not selling a 150 homes a year.

Speaker: Okay. Because, it's... You were the hustler.

Speaker: Yeah. I'm not, yeah, I'm not sitting here doing the volume I was doing. Mhmm. And when you go from doing a 150, 200 homes a year to doing 50, you feel, like, empty or you feel slow. You just feel like you're not

Speaker: Well, it's like up

Speaker: to your potential.

Speaker: I know, you know, when, you're driving on the... Across The States or whatever and you're going, you know, a 100 the whole way Yeah. And then you pull into a city and you're going 55 Yeah. It just... Why is everything so slow?

Speaker: Slow. Yeah. Yeah. And you don't... You know?

And then you're used to making... I mean, back then, I was making $4,500 a month. Mhmm. You know? And then you're not making that anymore.

You feel like

Speaker: So why do you do it?

Speaker: Because it was starting to affect my family. My wife didn't wanna manage no more. She was adamant about not managing for other people and getting rid of that piece. You know?

Speaker: Where'd that come from?

Speaker: What I explained to the anger. Yeah. Just a a way, you know, just the stress and the amount of staff we had to have and the amount of turnover and the amount of we couldn't travel. We couldn't enjoy our kids. We

Speaker: couldn't Really? It was a strict travel.

Speaker: Do anything. Like, you're, I mean, you're traveling, but you're on the phone all the time.

Speaker: You're you're Dealing with nonsense.

Speaker: Yeah. It's like, it wasn't... And so we had a... That was the biggest reason was the fact that my wife didn't wanna do it.

Speaker: It was just leaking in the family. Yeah. Yeah. What, how many doors did you guys have at the time?

Speaker: Oh, probably a thousand.

Speaker: You're managing a thousand doors.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, like, we wouldn't manage anything that we didn't sell. You know?

So those were all homes that... And the whole time I'm selling homes too. You know? As investors want out, I'm selling, like, the the the hedge fund that bought the 400 homes, I sold all 400 of those homes when they wanted to sell. Mhmm.

And so it created that revenue stream as well. And so we, but when I sold the management... Yeah. And so I I got out of that. And at this point now, we got couple 100 performing assets.

My debt's low. I've been doing this line of credit strategy for fifteen years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: I've got low basis. I've got access to tons of capital. Mhmm. And, you know, I run into boardroom and Right. Some coaching I did with Kent and

Speaker: Did you know when you sold the property management company, how much of a hit it was gonna be on the rest of the business?

Speaker: Yeah. I knew. I kinda knew. And that was my biggest, like, hindrance of doing it, you know, when you

Speaker: sold opposed because

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: This was the part that made sure everything else happened.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Yeah. Couldn't you sell, like, half the houses or half the contracts?

Speaker: No. I mean, at that point, it was... It wasn't about that. It was about, like, they didn't want half the houses. They wanted it.

And what they loved about my portfolio was that I had 200 investors. It wasn't one investor strong. You know what I mean?

Speaker: Like, I had so many diverse.

Speaker: I had so many mom and pop investors that, you know, if one guy left, the operation wouldn't be shaken. You know? And so they love that, and so they gave me premium for that. Mhmm. And so we got a big piece on the management sale.

And the only problem was that a lot of my customers got mad because the place I sold it to didn't perform. You know? And so I had to deal with that as well. You had to do with

Speaker: the fallout from that.

Speaker: Yeah. And so that was, you know, kinda sticky. But How

Speaker: that how that all play out?

Speaker: I mean, it was all good. I mean, nothing... I mean, no lawsuits or anything like that, but just more like, Pat, you bought us to the dance, and you left us there. Yeah. You know?

And I was like, man, I've been dancing with you for ten years. Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? Like Yeah.

Speaker: I need to move on. Like... And and my life changed. You know? Things changed.

I mean, shit. All my kids was going to college. I didn't have kids at the house. You know? And, you you become this, like, this empty nester that I've been for the last, like, four years now, and, like, you can travel.

I got money.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: I got... You know, I don't need to sit here and worry about a 150 fucking toilets a day. You know? I mean Yeah. My snake guy, my drain and snake guy would get, like, almost 10, 15 jobs a day from our portfolio.

Speaker: Just the snake.

Speaker: Yeah. Just snake and drains.

Speaker: That's the only thing.

Speaker: I could start companies, plumbing, HVAC, drain. I could start companies just off of the volume that I had that I was given these guys. They could hire new employees, two of them, and I could keep the the new employees busy so they could grow their businesses and scale their businesses.

Speaker: You really account they all wanted?

Speaker: For sure. Yeah. So when we sold, man, a lot of people were affected by that because we... You know, like, a lot of people that I worked with for years, I'm a real loyal person. Like, I've...

I got the same CPA at... You know, since I was 20. You know what I mean? Just like a lot of the guys in the network and end up, you know, in in our circle, I've been working with for a long time. Yeah.

Well, I

Speaker: can see that's impacting you.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's been... But, honestly, it's been better now.

And the fact that

Speaker: So you were lost?

Speaker: Yeah. I know. We were lost. We... You know, I wasn't lost.

I just wasn't happy. I guess I was, like, I wasn't... I didn't feel like I was living on my full potential.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: But I... What I didn't know is I had to change what the potential is.

Speaker: Yeah. Well, I think the... Because it's funny. Right? Like, we get into real estate.

Right? Whether it's rich, I pour it out, whatever else. And it's like, man, like, one of these days, I'm gonna have this. And you got it. Yeah.

And you don't feel you're not happy.

Speaker: Yeah. And that's what... That was the biggest, like like, it took me almost... It took me probably a good year to... You know?

And I remember my first meet. I never had a, like, a business coach this whole time either. You know? And so

Speaker: I would just hustle all the way.

Speaker: Yeah. And so, you know, I finally get this coach, and he's like like, I forbid you

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: To get back into that business. And, like, you'd... I'm not gonna tell you don't do it, but don't do it. Mhmm. Like, don't remodel homes for...

Don't buy homes for... Just focus on the Grace Family Trust and the assets for you guys. And we quickly came up with a plan

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: On, you know, that I wanted another $50,000,000 in my portfolio in five years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so we kinda worked our way backwards from that. So it was like, okay. If you invest five to six million bucks at a 20% IRR for five to six years, you'll get $50,000,000. Yeah. And so that's kinda what I'm doing now.

Speaker: So that reset your perspective. Yeah. So you said it took a year. So what were you doing that year, and how did you get... I mean, obviously, you

Speaker: That year, I mean, I was just... Honestly, I was relaxing. I was traveling. I was... You know?

And then and then it really sunk in. Like, I guess, because of this line of credit strategy

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That I run, I don't have a checking account.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: So I don't have... I just know I got access to a lot of capital, but when it's in your line of credit, you don't feel it like it's yours. You know? I don't know how to explain it, but, like, you know, I don't have, like, fat checking accounts.

Speaker: You don't see a lot of money in your bank

Speaker: account Right.

Speaker: Because they're all

Speaker: Because it's all swept into the line. And so I never... Honestly, I I I never knew I was... And my stuff was kinda messed up. Like, I had, like, my taxes all in one place.

I had my insurance all in one place. I had my property management software, but nothing was, like, cohesive. Mhmm. And so that was the first thing. And then when I figured out, oh, man, I'm making $200 a month after I pay all my bills and rent.

Like, I kinda makes things a little different. Softening

Speaker: the blow. Yeah. You're like, So I don't need it.

Speaker: And then I thought it was wrong. I was like, say it right. Yeah. Like, hey. We gotta check this.

Like, make sure that, like... And we started... We we checked it twice, and I was like, maybe that is correct.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: That we are making this kind of money, and it's passive. You know, I don't need to sit here and do all this work.

Speaker: I think it went live I think it went live, like, technically Saturday. So it's a lead that's been in our CRM over a year and it reached out Tuesday, so it's a couple days ago, set an appointment, do the, follow-up cadence, and, signed contract yesterday. So four or five days in, it's already working, like literally a contract from a year old lead. Should be 20 to 25,000. It's a cheaper home, but, you know, $20 on a $80,000 house would be nice.

Well, one, our team is horrible at following up with old leads. And obviously, with the AI, there's no fatigue. They follow a cadence, like, perfectly 10 times out of 10. One, just listen to one of the thousands of calls that are recorded from the AI. Like, we have overseas employees, and I think the AI sounds more human than some of our overseas employees.

Yeah. I mean, it's it's legit.

Speaker 3: What's the situation with the property? Living there, vacant, or rented?

Speaker 4: What is my age? I'm a... I'm 75 years old, and the property is approximately 200 miles away. And it's stressful trying to drive that distance every time something breaks down.

Speaker: I hear you. That sounds like a lot to manage from that far. How's that been wearing on you?

Speaker: Well, it's just the last couple years. You know, after I've turned 73, I got a little... The 70 seem to give you a newer outlook on what you can and cannot do and what your limitations are.

Speaker: Got it. So at least you'd wanna see what options are out there. Would you be open to a quick conversation with one of our specialists to map that out for your situation?

Speaker: I would.

Speaker: And if you wanna hear for yourself exactly what this sounds like, text AI caller to the phone number 33777. So let's talk about this. So I meet you and Marta, right, at at at Boardroom. And I remember when we met, like, you were still, like, you're still doing this wholesaling thing and and and so on, and you were flipping in Florida. And I remember you guys talking about this deal in Florida that completely fell apart.

Yeah. Right? And so I worked with you guys. I was working with your team. We were doing the sales training deal, and then I get a call.

Actually, I think it was an email. I gotta pick a fight with you. I think it was an email. I don't know. But we talked from you.

Right? Me? Not from me.

Speaker: It was from my wife. But we talked.

Speaker: But we talked. We talked. Right? And you're like, yeah. We don't need this anymore.

I was like, what do you mean you don't need this anymore? Like, sales is sales. Like, this is important. And you're like, Steve. Like, we just sat down with Kent.

And, you know, like, we're we're cash flowing 200,000 a month right now. We don't need a big team anymore. It's like, alright. Like, I can understand that point of view. Uh-huh.

Right? You don't need to run a... You don't have to deal with a headache running a big sales team Right. When you're cash flowing $200 a month Yeah. Of your assets.

Yeah. Right? So I wasn't mad. Right? I bring this up because I think it's funny.

Yeah. Right? Because you didn't even know how well you were doing.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Yeah. Yeah. And it's because you happened onto this strategy. You didn't, like, hey, this is what we're gonna do, and we're gonna create this much cash flow.

You're, like, hey, like, I learned about this thing.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Let's do it. And then one day you look back, it's like, holy crap. Yeah. We're doing really well.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So let's talk about the strategy that you figured out or you picked up.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: What was what was the strategy that you... When you first heard about it, what was the strategy?

Speaker: Okay. So I've... I learned about this in Australia. Mhmm. So I had went to Australia for three weeks with United Real Estate, the owner, Dan Duffy.

Speaker: Mhmm. And Which is, like, brokerage.

Speaker: Yeah. The brokerage. The real estate brokerage. And, we, I quickly figured out after hanging out with those guys that everything they do is line of credit. They don't have any, you know, thirty year amortized debt.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And that, like

Speaker: Everyone in Australia. Everyone in Australia. Yeah. So Not not your friends here.

Speaker: No. Not my friends here. I'm in Australia.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And they're like, yeah, mate. We gotta go, deposit this money into our line of credit. And I'm like, deposit? What do you mean deposit? Like, fucking America, we make payments to our

Speaker: You pay

Speaker: the payment bank. Right. And so

Speaker: I was like, deposits, and he...

Speaker: They started explaining to me. He's like, yeah. Our house, our car, everything is in our line, and then we just deposit all our money into the line, and we pay our shit off in ten years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I was like, That's that's not how we do it over there. And they're like, yeah. You bloody Americans. They're only idiots that take thirty year debt, you know, and this and this and that.

Speaker: And So that's their perspective. Yeah. Yeah. And so

Speaker: after I learned that, like, I learned that in the first week, and then I was... I just kept asking them questions and stuff. And I was like, man, why aren't we doing this? Mhmm. And so while I was in Australia, I called my wife on a building that I own at 511 Delaware in Kansas City.

I still own it. And, at that point, the building appraised for, like, a million bucks, and I, I owed 300 on the mortgage. And so I got a line of credit for $750, and at closing, the first draw was the 300 to pay the mortgage. Yeah. You know?

So with that, I untrapped all this equity. I had 450,000 in this line of credit that I have access to now, and I have a $300,000 basically loan or the line was, you know, borrowed out at $300. And then I had a $150 sitting in the checking account just rents that I collected. So the second thing I did was sweep that $150 into that 300,000.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And what that did is it took my available credit up to 600,000, and all I owed was a 150, and I never lost the money. And I was like, man, this is what those Australians was talking about. Yeah. Everybody knows the line of credit. What people are missing is the sweep.

Right? It's the sweep, and it's the the fact that your line of credit also creates a checking account for you. Mhmm. And so right now, people are living this life where everything's not coordinated. You know?

They have a checking account, a savings account, a mortgage, and nothing's working together.

Speaker: You know? And then Well, it's working together. It's... But it's working together for the bank.

Speaker: For the bank. Right? The bank's making all the money on Yeah. You know, you've got money sitting in there. Some guys, I mean, they've got $500 sitting in a checking account Mhmm.

And they have a $500,000 mortgage. And I literally paid their house off in thirty days.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, like... And they still have access to the $500.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: And so that's the crazy part when I was like, It's the debt structure that Americans are taking Mhmm. That's really fucking everybody over. It's like the worst thing you can do is, like, take the the thirty year mortgage. You know? And, like, you're paying almost double.

If you got a $250,000 mortgage, you probably pay $250 in interest.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so you gotta get away from that. And so if you can just save hundreds of thousands of dollars on interest alone and you do it over and over and over multiple times, all that money is coming to you, makes a huge difference in Well your cash flow.

Speaker: So you wore the realtor hat and the loan officer hat. So maybe you remember the most terrifying moment at a signing is when Pat is my client buying a house for the mortgage, and we have to do that disclosure. Was it Truth in Lending Act? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Right? And it says, hey....

Speaker: PR comes out. The APR

Speaker: comes out, but it says, hey. You're buying this house for 250,000. Yeah. And by the time the loan's paid off, you would have paid 300,000 in interest.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: And that's the part as the realtor. You hold your breath so I can make sure they don't, like, hold that on for your account when they see that. Yeah. Right? Do you remember that?

Right. Do you remember those moments?

Speaker: I remember that. Right. And and so... But I I knew this other strategy.

Speaker: What I'm saying, like, this strategy, you don't have this 300,000

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Because you're not the one that's the... On the hook for paying this interest for the next thirty years. So when... It's interesting to hear the Australian perspective as I've never heard that perspective. What I've always heard was, like, basically, The US is the only country, if not the only, we're one of two or three countries that allows a thirty year mortgage.

Speaker: Right. Right? Forty year now.

Speaker: I mean, they've talked about it. Is it is it official?

Speaker: Yeah. They got a forty year product out there now.

Speaker: Alright. Alright. Forty years. So we're the only country that allows us to benefit at the bank.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? And so when the the Australian perspective, which I think is accurate, right, is like, why are you guys doing this? Because you... It takes longer to pay down the debt. And, like, every other country in the world, like, that's a bad thing.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Here, we brag about it.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And I just don't... I mean, and so... And the the interest is so heavy upfront.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then what do almost every American guaranteed in the next five years, they're gonna refinance.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And they reset the debt.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: They reset the thirty year.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: They reset the heavy interest, and then they own the hamster wheel just running, figuring why can't I pay this shit off?

Speaker: Mhmm. You

Speaker: know? You ever stop to think how you pay off a $100,000 escalate in five years, but you can't pay a 100 to your mortgage in five years? How come? Because there's... The the debt structure.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Simple interest, and this amortized interest is not... It's just different. And so at closing, they give you an amortization schedule

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That shows you that was even the worst document, your first payment.

Speaker: Well, they didn't understand that document. The first payment of $2, only $80 went

Speaker: to principal, and you're like... And it shows all this interest that you're paying. It breaks it down monthly, and you're like, holy crap. Like, this is... I mean...

And and so that that was, like, an eye opener as well, I would say.

Speaker: If you understand it. Yeah. But I think most people look at it like, I don't know what this means. They just kinda go past it. I was never worried about that one because I knew they didn't understand that one.

It was always that, like, 300,000 interest on a $250,000 loan. So, like, at the end of this, you're paying 550,000 for this house. Yeah. And so so you happened to this. You did it on your commercial property.

Speaker: That was the first one I did it on. It was a commercial building. Yeah. And I I quickly figured out, you know, kinda like... Just like any pattern.

You know? Like, once you kinda go through it Mhmm. You're like, Let me duplicate this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so the same way BiggerPockets sells the burr. Mhmm. I just got burr lock. It's like, you know, I do the same thing. Buy, refinance, remodel, rent, and...

But when I refi, it's line of credit

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then repeat. And so I just kinda do the same thing, and I figured out how to do it. And I did all my commercial buildings. And then once I had all my debt getting paid down... You know?

So, like, back to the story, I I I put the 150 cash in. Now I got a $150 left to pay on that commercial building. Well, I get $15 a month in rent. I swept all that in there. I paid the building off in ten months.

I got $750 to work with that I never... You know, like, I didn't lose any of that money. And so Yeah.

Speaker: It's all accessible.

Speaker: Right. And and that's the whole part of

Speaker: the why you don't pay down debt is because it's it's locked equity.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So with this, you're no longer locked equity.

Speaker: And then you never have to sell. Yeah. If you have access to 75% of your investments, why would you sell it and pay taxes? You know? Like, at this point, I'm the biggest buy and hold guy out there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I'm taking all my debt and line of credit debt, and I've got access to 75% of the value of all my assets. I leave 25% in there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I never sell anything.

Speaker: And

Speaker: I always have access to capital. You know? I don't need partners. I don't need to underwrite. If I wanna go to Florida and buy some land and build a beach house, line of credit.

I don't have to go through construction loan. I don't have to go through underwriting. I don't have to do any of that. You know? It's just the money's there, and I can make the investments that I want, you know, with that with that capital.

Speaker: So you shared a strategy for a while. Right? You were spoke... You're you're speaking... We were competing Boardroom.

Right? I'm over here in the AI Room. That's right. Pat's over here in the Velocity Banking Room. Right?

And I'm looking around, like, where is everybody? It's like, well, a bunch of people are in Pat's room. Right? The good thing was, you know, I had a good talk. Everybody's in your room.

Well, I had a good talk, so everyone came back on day two to my room. Right? And I think people in my room probably went to your room. Yeah. Right?

But you you you've been talking about this for a while. So I'm curious because I've talked about this strategy for years. I've taught it to, I don't know, 25, 30 people. And I think of all the people I've talked it to, like, two people have done it.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? And it's crazy to me because, like, this is how I was able to pay off my houses so fast with this exact strategy.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So I'm curious with you, what has been the objections when you tell people, like, hey. You could do this. Why do they tell you it won't work for them?

Speaker: So

Speaker: Or why do they

Speaker: one is my rate's 3%.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? I'm fixed at 2.75.

Speaker: You

Speaker: know? And so that's probably the biggest one that I get is that they're locked in and that the line of credit is variable. Right? So when this guy raises rates, it's directly affecting our rate.

Speaker: You

Speaker: know? And so, but that's just dumb money speaking. You know? And so, like, you gotta educate people. It's not about the rate when you got so much cash flow that you can put in.

You know? I'm basically... I mean, if you've got $5 extra, after you pay all your bills and you got $5, you're sliding into a checking account somewhere

Speaker: Doing nothing for you.

Speaker: Doing nothing. Or you could put your debt in a line of credit. And if you had a 100,000 and you slide the 5 in tomorrow, your payment's based off of 95. Mhmm.

Speaker: You know

Speaker: what I mean? And then another $5 to the next month, your payment's based off of 90. And then 5... And it... With $5, you can have that whole thing paid off in twenty months, less than two years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And and if you need the money, it's there. Right. You can go draw it back out, and so you don't lose it. Your line of credit becomes your checking account Mhmm. And all the money's there.

And so it's the best strategy to pay things off, and I was just really diligent with it. You know? Like, I swept all the money into my lines. Like, I don't have any amortized mortgage, not one, in my portfolio. And my personal checking account is one checking account that I might have $20 in.

All the other business checking accounts have pegs on them where if there's over $5 at the end of the day, it automatically sweeps into my line. You know? And so all my money is housed in my line. And the other good thing that does, it makes me feel broke. You know?

Like, I mean, I

Speaker: know I got access. You need motivation. I look at I look at... Like I said, like, peep...

Speaker: And it's the shift. You know, the mind shift. People like logging online, looking at their checking account. They say $250 in there, and they're like, ah, I feel comfortable. I can go to oh, sorry.

I can go to sleep. Yeah. And when... You know, I look at my available credit Mhmm. And I sleep even better because I got access to so much capital way more than you'll ever have in a in a checking account.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: You know? But if you're out there listening and you got, you know, hundreds of thousands sitting in a checking account and you got this mortgage sitting here that you can't pay extra to and all your equity is trapped Mhmm. This strategy is for you. Right? I mean, that's the that's the person.

You gotta have cash flow.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Right? You gotta make money. If you upside down, this ain't gonna work. Yeah. If you have no equity in your property, this ain't gonna work.

Mhmm. And when I say equity, you gotta know I only can get 75%. So if your house is worth a $100 and your mortgage is 75, you have no equity even though you have 25,000 in equity. Yeah. You know, in my game, we we can't loan you a 100%, so we only can access you $75.

So, usually, if you're at, like, 50%, you know, if if you got a million dollar house and a $500,000 mortgage and you got $15 extra sitting around every month Mhmm. You need to be on this. This is a game changer. Like, it'll completely change your life. And then once you see it, you can unsee it.

Once you live it, you're not... You're gonna you're gonna think so different. It's like once you know you're not gonna go back.

Speaker: Well, you look at it. It's, the objection. Right? I got a 2.75. I got a three.

Right? And they're failing to see the effective rate. Right? Right. Because, like, yeah, you might be paying...

I don't know what it is today. Seven, 8% with prime plus whatever or whatever it is. What is it today?

Speaker: So right now, all my rates are between, I'd say, 6.757%.

Speaker: So let's just

Speaker: say prime... I'm at... I got I got banks at prime minus three quarter, and I got banks at prime plus a quarter. Yeah. And so that's kinda where I'm at right now.

Speaker: So let's just call it prime. Let's just say it's about seven. Right? So you're at seven, but what's going on is you're paying your loan down so fast that you're paying 7% on a lower principal Right. Every month.

And that 2.75, you gotta pay that interest for thirty years. And, like, I remember, you know, this is before I got into real estate. You know, I got a car loan. Like, I'm gonna make some extra payments. I'm gonna pay this down faster.

Right? And so for a few months, I'm gonna make double payments. But then I was like, I don't wanna do this anymore. Yeah. And so what happened?

We ran the whole amortization and I paid all of that interest. So even making double payments for a few months or for six months, it actually doesn't benefit you paying more No. When it's amortized.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? But if it's... And it's stuck. Yeah. And it's stuck.

You can't get it back.

Speaker: Yeah. That's the worst part.

Speaker: But the line of credit, you're paying it down faster and, you have access to it. That's the biggest thing. It's like your your access to it never goes away. The other thing too... So what I talked about to other people when I was trying to tell them to do it, and again, like, the only two or three people ever listened to me, was that I was...

I took... A lot of people look at it, the line of credit, as it has to be, like, the second position. Right. Right? And for me, from day one, I always had it as the first position.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So how do you do that? It's like, well, I would take, let's say I owed 300,000 on my house, and I would go get a line of credit for 500,000, but that 500,000 is exactly like you said. That 500,000 paid off the 300,000.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So now it's a first lien. It's not a second lien. Right. And because it's a first lien, I could just pay it all down as fast as I want Right. And have access to all the available credit the whole time.

Yep. So I think that's the part that a lot of people... I I think a lot of people are familiar with the concept of a HELOC in second position.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: People are not using concept of HELOC

Speaker: In the first position. First position,

Speaker: which you could just pay off your mortgage with the HELOC.

Speaker: Right. And if you have extra cash flow every month Yeah. Instead of it sitting in a checking account making no money Mhmm. You put it into your line, you're paying off 7% debt, and you're paying... Every time you make a payment, it goes straight to principal, and your payment the next month is based off of that principal.

Exactly. And so... And you have access to it. If you need the money, you can go get it. That's the most powerful part about this strategy

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Is the accessibility, the untrapping of the equity, and the pain of a 100. I'm not talking thousands. I'm talking hundreds of thousands of dollars. You know? Even if it was just your primary, if you're not an investor.

If you're an investor, we're even packaging up. So now I got to the point where I'm packaging up 25 homes, taking that to the bank. And here's how I started. Life insurance was actually my first big line of credit. Right?

So I put my life insurance policy up, and I got a line against that. And I would buy properties, rehab properties. And because you're buying it with a line, there's no lien on title. Mhmm. There's no mortgage.

So I could get five, 10 homes and no lien. I take it to my lender, and I say, hey. I wanna package up these five, 10 homes. They're free and clear, and I wanna first lien line of credit. Mhmm.

And they try and talk me into a refi, a cash out refi, and I'm like, I don't want that. I want a first lien line of credit. Right. And I was just stern with that. And it was like, why?

Even my bankers wouldn't understand what I was doing at first. Mhmm. And then once they see it, they can't unsee it. Now they all do it. And so even even the bankers that are friends of mine at these small local banks are now doing this strategy and running this strategy on their personal stuff, and they own the bank.

Mhmm. You know what I mean? They're doing stuff with their portfolios now similar to what I'm doing. And so packaging up the properties was the next big thing that I figured out how to do and getting, like, 25 homes, whatever, $5,000,000, $7,000,000 valuation, and then getting a 75% line on that, and then using that money to go buy more homes, rehab more homes, and then I got more free and clear homes. So I put that package up, and then I just started running that whole strategy.

And then if I sold a home... Say I bought a home for 200, put 50 in it, I sold it for $3.50. All $350, I would sweep into the line. You know? And you do that 10 times a year, that's four, five million bucks that you're sweeping right into the line of credit.

You know that... And you're almost paying off. Like, if I sold 10 homes on a 20 home package, it would almost pay off the entire line of credit.

Speaker: Yeah. You Well... And I think, like, the the part that we were saying, like, you know, as your primary, you're saving a $100, $200 over the life of the loan. Oh, yeah. But, like, if you're an investor, you got a portfolio.

Like, this is a million dollars easy. Oh, yeah. You're saving in interest.

Speaker: Easy millions. Yeah. Easy millions. Right?

Speaker: So I think that's what people are are missing out on.

Speaker: Oh, yeah.

Speaker: And I'm gonna do a quick plug here. Right? So, like, this is what I've done. Right? So I got Scotts Community Bank.

It's a bank that I invested in. And so, like, I'm doing this with them. So I'm gonna figure out how, like, how to get my bank on your list, right, to do this with.

Speaker: Yeah. I can get it done. So we've got... So that's kinda what I did is I... So I I honestly thought everybody, like, bigger investors was doing this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? So No.

Speaker: Like, the title is, like, that you never heard of. Like, people don't know about this and they... Or they look it up and they look velocity banking. Oh, it's a scam or it doesn't work. It's like, you're just doing it wrong.

Speaker: No. And the biggest thing, what you said about the first lien Yeah. That's a big one. The biggest thing is they don't sweep. Yeah.

People have lines right now. There's listeners out there. I guarantee it that are listening right now. They've got a house. They've got a line of credit.

They've got a checking account and a savings account with hundreds of thousands of dollars in it, and they're not working it right.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: If they would just close those accounts out Mhmm. Put the money into the line, pay the line down, and if you need the money is there, you can draw it out. It's changed your life.

Speaker: Right. It's the sweep. And your monthly payment goes down.

Speaker: Goes down every single month. Yeah. Every sing... As soon as the cash hits, your payment next month goes down. And if you can hit cash twice, big...

It goes way down. And so every month, your payment goes down that you make the payments, that you make these big deposits. But the sweep and actually sweeping the money and having all back... I I talked about it. Uncoordinated accounts all over the place.

With a line of credit, it coordinates everything. You have one instrument now. That's your debt vehicle and your checking and savings account. And if you just load it up, I promise you, you'll pay your shit off in seven to ten years. Yeah.

Speaker: I mean Versus thirty.

Speaker: Versus thirty. And then look at how much interest you save on that twenty years.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Especially that you're saving it in the first ten years. Mhmm.

Speaker: You

Speaker: know, like, in ten years, I'm paying it off. And so that's the most heavy interest years on an amortized mortgage. Most mortgages, you take almost fifteen to seventeen years before you actually pay more principal than interest. Yeah. You're on year 17.

And so if you can eliminate all that upfront interest

Speaker: have it paid off before then. Right. Yeah. I think, like, it's a sexy idea to buy a bunch of houses right now and have it paid off in thirty years. It's an even better idea to have a bunch of properties and paid it off in seven to ten years.

Speaker: Yeah. I mean, it's like the difference between, I don't know, Wagyu steak and hot dogs.

Speaker: Well... And that's the reason why, like, when we were when we were connected last, at at board, I was like, Pat, like, you had come on and talk about it because I've talked about it. Right? I... I've talked about how it's benefited me.

Yeah. But for whatever reason, it just doesn't resonate. I was like, alright. We're gonna have Pat come on and talk about it. Right?

Because you can you can bring a lot more energy into it. And, like, you've got proof in the pudding. Right? Like, you paid off way more houses than I paid off. Yeah.

And so I think just your experience, how how you've done it, how it's worked out for you, I think a lot of people can learn from your experience in doing it. Yeah. What, what are the other objections? So besides rate, why why why else does someone say, Pat, that's a cool idea, but that's not gonna work for me. So

Speaker: either they don't have a lot of equity. Mhmm. They don't have cash flow. You know, they're not, you know, they're not making maybe $500 more, a thousand dollars more. They're not making a lot of money.

Mhmm. Trying to think, like, what else people would object to. Really, it's more... And, you know, another thing, this is an a paper loan. You know what I mean?

We can't do 500 credit. Yeah. 550 credit or something like this. You know what I mean? And so you gotta have good tax returns.

You gotta have, you know Really?

Speaker: You can't do it asset based?

Speaker: No. I mean, there is. In fact, I just talked to a guy today Mhmm. Just today who told me they have a DSCR, non owner, and owner occupied purchase money line of credit. Yeah.

So now you can purchase. Mhmm. You don't even have to refi. I've been refi ing this whole time

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And using my lines to purchase. Now I can just put 10% down, purchase money, line of credit

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: get the line straight from the beginning on a purchase money loan.

Speaker: There you go.

Speaker: So they have that now. And the guy said that... So I told him, hey. Send me that flyer.

Speaker: Mhmm. Because I

Speaker: don't know too many banks doing the DSCR non owner. Yeah. And so I'm gonna I'm gonna expose that one when I get it. You know? And so there's not too many banks that'll do that, with the DSCR.

And so that's kinda where I struggle. If I had one weakness, it's that. Like, I got people that... A lot of agents, most real estate agents, they... They're not showing all this income.

You know? There's a lot of people in the service industry.

Speaker: Yeah. You know? It's all right off.

Speaker: You're ten ninety nine. Yeah. And so they got good business. They know how to run something, but they don't have good taxes.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so the DSCR was something that I was struggling with in terms of finding people money for, so when I heard about that, I was like, dude, that's awesome.

Speaker: Some more more opportunities. More And I mean, just like another case in point. Like, you know, we're in this condo right now. It's it's an office condo in Scottsdale, but, like, I bought this with my HELOC. Yeah.

Right? So this is free and clear. I can, at any point, go get a HELOC on this one and go do something else.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? It's a very repeatable Yeah.

Speaker: Process. And it's very... You can implement this in literally thirty days. Yeah. Like, this isn't something...

It's not like becoming an agent Mhmm. Where it's gonna take you years to develop a pipeline or a mortgage guy or a... You know, I mean, honestly, you could knock this out and literally... Like, if you call me today, I'll have you done in thirty to sixty days depending on how many assets and how many appraisals I gotta deal with. But that, it's super actionable.

You know? And, like, right now, if you've got 500 sitting in your house in equity, Even if you don't need it, that's the best time to go get it. Yeah. When you need something, they usually question you. The best time to go get money and get the loan is when you don't need it.

Speaker: When you don't

Speaker: need it. Just let it sit there. If you don't use it, you don't pay.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Because you're not... It's not like a cash out refinance where you refinance the property, and day one, you're making payments because you got all the money at closing. Yeah. It doesn't work like that. And so you literally pay no money until you draw.

You know what I mean? Until you draw out of the line. And so you can get lines. I just closed one on my beach house, just a week ago. You know?

And I got a $3,000,000 line on this beach house that appraised for $5,000,000. And the only draw out of that line was the $30,000 in fees Mhmm. That I had to pay for, you know, Florida, man. It's expensive of stat tax and all this bullshit. I know.

We don't deal with that in Kansas City, but, like, heavy on the fees, the title fees, and the the bank's origination fee and this and that. And so... But my line is sitting there with... That's the only draw out on that line, and it's Airbnb. I mean, it's probably paid off already.

My first deposit, I'll pay that off. Yeah. You know, and I'll have zero balance on that line. And so that's just one more line that I have access to capital. And so my life right now is really comfortable.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, I've got access to capital that

Speaker: Which we're we're gonna talk about next. Okay. Yeah. So segue. Yeah.

So, again, I can't emphasize this product enough because I've done it for myself over and over again, and, the people I've taught it to are doing really well. Yeah. Right? The ones that listened. Yeah.

Yeah. The ones that listened are doing really well. So we're gonna put the link inside the show notes. So something interesting has happened in Missouri. Right?

There's, like, this thirty day right of rescission. There's this... I don't know. What's happening in Missouri?

Speaker: So right now, they've implemented two laws that... Okay. The first one is really to eliminate wholesalers. Right? And so

Speaker: You can't eliminate.

Speaker: Well, I mean, it's to eliminate wholesaling, not to eliminate wholesalers.

Speaker: But Okay.

Speaker: You know, that's been a hot topic over there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so it's for the guy that's, like, assigning shit. You know? Like, they don't have the money to buy it. They got the time to go look, and they put in all the effort, but they don't have the capital to buy. So they usually find somebody like us Mhmm.

Who has the money, and they wholesale it to us. And so, this law makes... Gives... They have to... First, they have to disclose, and you should read the disclosure on what they have to say.

Speaker: I mean, it's like, I don't think any homeowner... After you read that, like, you'd

Speaker: be an idiot to continue. Like, I mean, it's basically telling them, hey. I'm gonna buy your house for... I'm gonna assign your... I'm gonna get your house under contract for $10, and I'm gonna turn around and sell it for 20.

Speaker: Mhmm. And you

Speaker: have to put the numbers in there. And it's like, why would you do that? You know? Or

Speaker: you have to put the numbers in there.

Speaker: They have the... They have this whole example in... So, like, there's a certain thing you have to say in the disclosure, and it basically says you have to... Like, it gives an example of what they're gonna do. Mhmm.

But I don't think a lot of people knew that.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay.

Speaker: So, that's one.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: And, and the fact that they're assigning the loan, They're not buying your property. You know, it's like a whole bunch of stuff where, you know, people would talk to wholesalers, and then wholesalers would have good buyers like us and everything would close. And then, like, afterward, they'd be like, hey. I see them around. They're like, hey.

You know, they didn't even know I bought the house. You know what I mean? They just knew I went and looked at it. Mhmm. Like, they didn't know I was the buyer.

Yeah. And so this crazy, disclosure now that you... And it's basically making it tough for wholesale, which is good for me. You know? Like, I'm loving it because Yeah.

I buy everything. Like, I'm not a wholesaler. So if I come meet you at your table, my biggest competition were the wholesalers.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? Because they they would pay a little bit more. They would make these promises, and they wouldn't care and just, you know, problems. And so, that's one thing. The second thing is, there's now even disclosures for foreclosure, and this one directly affects me.

So I used to be... I'm that guy that would go to you seven, ten days before the foreclosure and be like, hey. What's... Get the payoff. I'll pay the bank off, and I'll lease you back the house.

And I'm a big buy and hold guy. I don't need to flip everything. And so if I could get a good deal on a house, give you some cash, everybody wins, and I own the house and you can stay in there, or some of these guys would have equity, $100 sitting in the house. You know, I would take three years of payments from the closing and have them stay in the house for three years, no payments.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? And and give them $20. And just however you struck... Well, you can't do that anymore. So now you need...

There's a fourteen day period, a fourteen day disclosure, and then a thirty day period Mhmm. Where... So you have fourteen days where you have to disclose on the lease option or the lease back, the sale lease back, and you have, thirty days before you can sign a sale leaseback.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so, those are the two new big laws that hit Kansas City that's affecting a lot of people out there Yeah. Right now.

Speaker: Well, it's a city or or it's a state?

Speaker: Well, shit. I don't even know if it was a state. Yeah. I thought it was

Speaker: a state. Yeah. That was It

Speaker: could be. I know for sure Kansas City. I know it, but it might be the state. You might be right. I'm I'm not sure on

Speaker: that. So I know, like, you know, Doug Hopkins is the gorilla in Phoenix. Right? Like, the guy is everywhere. And I've told him it's not a threat.

It's really just a notice. Right? Like, if they ever do anything crazy like this in Arizona, I'm getting back in the game.

Speaker: Oh, yeah.

Speaker: Because right now, I don't have the energy

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: To play against all the hustlers in the... In in Phoenix.

Speaker: No. I made it good. Like, all I did was really turn back on my meta ads and, like, you know, I called REI Print Mail

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And just started sending shit out again because

Speaker: As you can buy it.

Speaker: Yeah. And a lot of the a lot of the the fly by night guys are gone. You know? Like, they they can't do it no more. And even, like, really big companies in Kansas City, sad to say, some of my really good friends, are out.

Like, they they they can't do it no more. Yeah. And so, you know, it's sad sad for them, but it's really good for

Speaker: people who

Speaker: have cash. Like, if you have cash and you can actually buy the home, that that part didn't affect me.

Speaker: Well, let's just say, like, everything we talked about right here, where you have access to a ridiculous amount of capital Yeah. You are perfectly positioned for this. It's almost like that situation where you had that big exit in 2007. Yeah. He got $3,000,000 just, like, I don't know north of the river.

The perfect setup. Now they pass this law. I was like, man, like, Pat's looking pretty good right now because you can you can buy as much as you want, and you got... You've got some competition. But instead of competing against five or seven wholesalers, you're competing against maybe two, three other Cash buyers.

Speaker: It's it's almost like the auction at the courthouse steps. You know? Like Yeah. It's like that. Like, I love the auction because you have to have cash that day.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: There's no finance. There's no thirty day close.

Speaker: Yeah. You

Speaker: know? It's cash that day by 02:00.

Speaker: And so By 02:00? Yeah. Is there... See, we get we get the next day. Oh, yeah.

In Arizona, we got, like, I'll give you 10,000 today. I can give you the rest by 5PM tomorrow, or at least by ten thousand. Oh. But I get a whole day.

Speaker: We wire... We gotta wire the funds that day by the end of business. And, I mean, there's been days where I couldn't get it out, and they let you go the next day. But most times, they want it day. You know?

Like, that's what they say. We want it that day. Mhmm. And so we did... I did a lot of...

I still do auctions all the time because of that. You know? Because I go there, and usually, there's, like, five, 10 guys there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? MLS, holy shit, man. Everybody on MLS trying to buy a house. Yeah. I mean, it's...

And so that's a tough strategy on MLS. So we do a lot of, I'm doing a... I'm doing... It's funny you say that because, like, I just turned that back on, like, within the last, like, literally month.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: I'm just now seeing it. Like, right before the show, I had a lead. Like, I'm getting all these leads now coming through, like, you know, from Facebook Yeah. On these ads that I'm running and that I'm testing and trying to figure out which one hits and, you know, this and that. And so Oh,

Speaker: we gotta set you up on our AI appointment center now.

Speaker: You should do that. Yeah. I would do that.

Speaker: They're gonna have a conversation.

Speaker: Thing I hate.

Speaker: We're gonna have a conversation.

Speaker: That's the one thing I'm not good at. It's the... So you got AI that can answer the phone Mhmm. For the foreclosure or whoever the probate

Speaker: Whoever's calling.

Speaker: Whoever's calling, and then what? They set an appointment for me?

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That would be great.

Speaker: Yeah. We're gonna talk about that. Now that you're now that you're back in it. Yeah. I'm back in that.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Cool. So, I mean...

So, obviously, you know, this whole velocity banking thing's done really well for you, and you're you're excited to get back in the game. Yeah.

Speaker: That's the big strategy that's honestly separated me from... I feel like if I look back on everything that I've done

Speaker: Bigger than the property management?

Speaker: Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Biggest thing. I mean, imagine all the properties and all the interests you save.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And the more you buy, the more you save. And the volume that I done millions Mhmm. Of dollars of interest that I haven't paid that has came back to

Speaker: It's in your pocket.

Speaker: Yeah. That's that's my family money. Yeah. That didn't pay the bank. You know?

And then... So that is the the biggest thing when I look back at my twenty five years of doing this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: It was that strategy that's literally separated us and basically next leveled us compared to other... There's other investors out there with, you know, 250 home portfolios and apartments and... But they're not doing what I'm doing. Their debt structure is not the same, and their... It's not the same.

Yeah. And so I know them. I meet them. You know them. Yeah.

And so, they're not living the same and filling the freedom and having access to the capital. That's the biggest thing.

Speaker: Yeah. The access to that.

Speaker: 200 field, when you got a lot of assets and you got them tied up in mortgages and you got all this stuck money over there and you don't have access rich

Speaker: cash poor.

Speaker: Yeah. You don't have you don't have access to your capital. That's fucking crazy.

Speaker: Like Yeah.

Speaker: I wouldn't even... I can't even comprehend that right now, but that's what a mortgage is. Right? It's stuck capital.

Speaker: Yeah. It's locked in the capital.

Speaker: Here and sweep 20 a month to your mortgage No. You'll lose it. It's gone. You... Yeah.

You can't get it unless you refi or sell. Where the line of credit, I can sweep all my money into their... I can... The wholesale. I make $500 profit on a property into the line of credit, just paid on the debt.

Yeah. You know? And... Yeah.

Speaker: Obviously, you've been talking about this for a while. Has there been anyone else... Has there been anyone you worked with where, like, you've seen... You've already seen, like, a dramatic change in their finances?

Speaker: Yeah. There's guys in boardroom who I've... And you know what's funny is I never really talked about this and where it's really got, I guess, some legs Mhmm. Is... Wasn't...

And the funny part is... So I went to that billionaire boardroom, and they asked me to speak about my business. And I'm like, I am not trying to go into this billionaire boardroom and talk about flips and, you know, shit that like this. You know? I mean, there's guys in there who are killers.

You know? And it's like... And so I was like, talking to my wife, and I'm like, you know what? I wanna talk about this line of credit strategy. And she's like, Pat, these are the top 3% of investors in the country.

They know that.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I'm like, well, I'd rather talk about that. I don't wanna go in there and talk about my 200 homes and blah blah.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: So I was nervous going into this presentation. And then I had such an overwhelming response of holy shit. Like, huge business guys. Like, one guy told me I save him a million dollars a month. Yeah.

Speaker: A million a month?

Speaker: A month. You know who, Mark in Boardroom, the oil guy from Okay. Oklahoma Mhmm. Just joined. That guy's business is so big, and he makes so much money

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That, his son... And I was just with his son in Montana. 1,000,000 a month in what they do. Another guy had... He was the one I was telling earlier.

He had a $500,000 checking account, 500,000... $2,000,000 house, $500,000 mortgage.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And in thirty days, you know, he just took his 500 and transferred it into the right account Mhmm. And paid off his mortgage. You know? He still has access to the 500, but we're just using the right accounts and using the right money and just paying. So he's not paying interest no more on that money.

You know? And so, and he's got access now to almost $1,500,000.

Speaker: Mhmm. Or

Speaker: he didn't have that before. He had a 500...

Speaker: You know what I mean? He had a

Speaker: $500,000 mortgage, and he had 500 sitting in a checking account. And in thirty days, I got his $500,000 mortgage gone, and he's got access to $1,700,000. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, dramatic change.

Like, that's what I... When I said millions, it's millions, dude.

Speaker: Sleep good.

Speaker: Yeah. Sleep way better. If you sleep good with $500, you'll sleep like a baby with 1,700,000 in your available credit right now. I mean, that's the difference in having the right debt structure and this right product, and it's there. Every bank has it.

Mhmm. Nobody sells it. Nobody talks about it. The banks don't like it because they don't make as much interest on it.

Speaker: That'd be great.

Speaker: And so they want you on a three and a half percent down, FHA 6.875, 7%. You know, right now, that's what they wanna sell you. 97% money at 7%. They lock you in for thirty years, and then you refinance every five years.

Speaker: They love you more when you refinance.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. Hey. We'll do it cash out. Free. No no no no fee cash out refi.

Yeah. You know, when rates drop.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: They'll pay they'll pay your fee for you and lock and and lock you back down for another thirty years. You know, it's reset the interest clock Yeah. Upfront.

Speaker: And I think this is... Again, that's the reason why, when you talked about it, because again, I remember you told me a couple years ago, but I was like, man, like, we gotta get we gotta get this message out there.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Like, it's it's it's... There's not enough people talking about it. So I'm glad. I'm grateful you're able to come on.

For sure. Anything... As we're wrapping this up, is there anything that you want to talk about, share about, let people know that we haven't touched? No. Yeah.

I mean, I think I think it's an incredible journey.

Speaker: Yeah. I can't

Speaker: believe you hustled all the way through all of that with no coaching. It's it's incredible. So, like, Kent was the first one you hired?

Speaker: Kent Clothier. Yeah. He was my first, like, business coach

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And my first coach after twenty five years. Like Yeah. You know? And and really, it was, like, perfect timing for me because it was, like, really more mindset

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And having somebody tell me, Pat, you made it. Like, I coach thousands of people, and, like, you're up there, bro. Like, you don't know if you're good or not. I don't know. You know?

And so... But when when you have somebody like him who's coached all these billionaires and just people who make all this money and he's, like, confirms, hey, man. You're there, dude. You don't need to do this no more. Why are you doing this?

This makes zero sense. Like, just focus on you, your family. You don't have to sit here and do this. And I was like, I really didn't believe him. Honestly, the first, like, couple...

Like, first two months of the coaching, I was like, man, I was trying to start property management again. I was trying

Speaker: to do all this stuff again.

Speaker: And Yeah. And, he had to talk me out of it. So... Yeah. But the coaching was probably some of the the best, you know, and enjoying, like, the mastermind group

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Meeting other entrepreneurs, helping them. Like, I met so many great guys who now they're going next level. You know? Like, so many guys that we've helped out where, you know, I got investors. I got 10 guys trying to raise capital in boardroom.

He's got 10 free and clear properties in California.

Speaker: I'm like, bro, let's get a line of credit on all of these. Let let me package up 10

Speaker: of these. We'll get a line of credit done. You don't have to raise capital. The capital's in your portfolio. It's right there.

Yeah. No. He's got a primary and 10 free and clear properties in LA.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: I'm like, bro, come on, man. This is...

Speaker: Yeah. Well, this is awesome. Like I said, it's an important message, and I think it's a perfect follow-up to, you know, our last episode with George Antone talking about, like, understanding how to make money is how you get wealthy. And here, you're giving a very specific strategy for our audience of real estate investors Yeah. How to leverage your actual assets in your portfolio to get there faster.

So thank you.

Speaker: Sure. No rush, brother. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate you, Steve. Thank you, man.

Speaker: You're welcome. You're welcome. Thank you guys for watching.

Speaker: See you

Speaker: guys next week.

Speaker: Out to Steve train. Jump on the Steve train. Disrupt us.

The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

Prefer audio?

Full Transcript

21516 words

Speaker 0: And in thirty days, I got his $500,000 mortgage gone, and he's got access to $1,700,000. Every bank has

Speaker 1: it. Mhmm.

Speaker: Nobody sells it. Nobody talks about it. I literally paid their house off in thirty days.

Speaker: Mhmm. You know, like...

Speaker: And they still have access to the $500. Like, I don't have any amortized mortgage, not one. And I always have access to capital. You know, I don't need partners. I don't need to underwrite.

250 houses paid off? Yep. Yep. Stupid crazy numbers. Right?

But before we get to all that, alright, before we get to all that, let's talk about what we just... What was your life like actually before you got into real estate?

Speaker: Oh, man. Good question. So that was twenty five years ago. I was 21, 22 years old, and I, had my degree in criminology sociology. So I was doing juvenile case work.

Speaker: So you were working, with, involved with the juvenile detention centers?

Speaker: Yeah. And so you're getting

Speaker: those kids ready for real life.

Speaker: I was like, man,

Speaker: that's the numbers I need to

Speaker: So very quickly Yeah. Your college degree

Speaker: Did not work.

Speaker: And your your your job and working with the juveniles

Speaker: It's not the same. My wife my wife went to nursing school and did the nursing thing for literally two years and quit.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. So it didn't take very long.

Speaker: For sure.

Speaker: I mean, how long from when your eyes were opened to how these real estate investors... How much cash flow are they making until, like, you're like, you know what? I'm gonna change careers.

Speaker: you know, all this stuff. So while I was out

I had I had, like, 20 homes already.

Speaker: So This guy's not putting in his whole 40. This guy ain't doing anything, man. All his kids are recidivism rate was like a hundred percent. Oh, that's okay. You gotta make up for that now.

Yeah. And so it was real hard to... You know? Like, out of 10 kids, maybe three would do alright. The rest would do more crimes and do do the same shit they did when they came in.

So it was So

Speaker: you're saying, like, going through juvy, you help them get relocated Yeah. Was more often than not, they're going right back into the system.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. 100%. Like, because you're sending them back to the same neighborhoods, the same houses, the same Oh, the

Speaker: same influencer.

Speaker: The same... Yeah. The same environment. Mhmm. And so they're gonna go back to what they know.

Mhmm. And the little seven months, eight months, ten months they spend with you goes out the door in literally a week. Mhmm. And so

Speaker: They go back to the old ways.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And so that that was tough for me and not, you know, like, not

Speaker: So not seeing fruits of your labor.

Speaker: Right. Like, no And

Speaker: then seeing these other guys making a lot of fruit from their labor. Yeah.

Speaker: And so my first my first deal, I went to a Donald Trump seminar.

Speaker: So it's Donald Trump, Trump University. Trump University. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Okay.

Speaker: So he... And, I got me a mentor Mhmm. And I paid him... I was broke. I paid him, like, I got onto the one where you could pay, like, a thousand dollars a month or whatever.

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: so I jumped on that, and that guy actually helped me to buy my first, flip.

Speaker: And Okay. So my first... Yeah. It paid off?

Speaker: And I did, like, an FHA loan. I bought a fourplex. That was the strategy that I learned from them.

Speaker: We literally talked about that in the last episode. That was a bad idea. But anyway, continue.

Speaker: That was a great idea for me. So, like, no. I bought this fourplex. I had three units. I lived in one.

I took the worst one.

Speaker: Yeah.

Like, it... I was cash flowing when I lived there.

Speaker: And so So the first property you bought

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Was to keep. Right. There's no wholesaling, and you're in this in this vision at the moment. No. Right?

So you were house hacking 2001 before even anyone called it house hacking. Yeah. You were house hacking. Yep. Right?

So so you had that fourplex. So that's a good deal. Mhmm. You got you got your w two because you didn't get fired yet. Yep.

Speaker: Right? And then And I was working at Olive Garden.

Speaker: Oh, okay. I'd work at Olive Garden

Speaker: Friday, Saturday, Sunday Yeah. At night. Mhmm.

Speaker: And

So, like, I worked at Olive Garden. Man, I had probably 30... I used to wait on my tenants.

Speaker: So you got your tenants coming to Olive Garden? Yeah.

Speaker: And so

Speaker: Did they recognize you?

Speaker: Yeah. Of course. I mean,

Speaker: I was their landlord, and I would work at Olive Garden at night, and

Speaker: that was just my cash money for the week for me and my wife. And that's kinda how we bootstrapped this whole thing. Starting was crazy.

Speaker: That's incredible. That's awesome. Right? So that means this is a true origin story. Like Oh, yeah.

You had no... You had nothing, like, handed to you.

Speaker: No. Zero. Yeah. No. I had to borrow $10 from my mom on my first rehab loan so I could show assets.

Speaker: You know? Like,

Speaker: I said, I promise I won't spend it. Yeah. I'll just keep it in there. And she's like, sounds kind of fishy.

Speaker: Yeah. Did she believe me?

Speaker: Of course. Yeah. That's my mom.

Speaker: But, you know, I ended up giving her back, I think, like, $12

Speaker: or or something. But, yeah, she, she had to borrow me some money so I could get my first... Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay. So you did your first deal. You got it. What...

How how did the second deal come about?

Speaker: So the second deal is where I got host. That was my first, like, I guess, horror story Mhmm. Where I did a rehab loan. I was playing arena football at the time in Kansas City.

Speaker: And what were you not doing?

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so I was like...

Speaker: So I asked for a three month extension, and it took me nine months, and I screwed up the whole deal. And I still made $12. Yeah. You know? And I was like

Speaker: You're all 15, and you still made 12.

Speaker: Yeah. And my job was making $3 a month Mhmm. Doing casework. You know, I'd make, like, $100, $150 back then at night doing Olive Garden. And so I was like, man, if I was a focus on this,

Speaker: I

Speaker: think I would crush this.

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: it's easy. You know? And so that's my... And my wife just got her nursing degree Mhmm. That year.

Speaker: Yeah.

That's when I quit, and I said, I'm not gonna do this no more. And I, I went into real estate full time. And then in two years, I had her quit her job because it didn't make sense no more.

Speaker: So you went in to flip it. So you had the vision to flip that one? Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker: That was a flip.

Speaker: Alright. Yeah. I mean, how did you even find that deal?

Speaker: Man, probably MLS. I was always an agent, and I know I used to find... You know, I used to I used to run that whole strategy where, like

Speaker: You said you were also a realtor? Yeah. Man, you're a hustler. You mean you... So you're you're arena football, Olive Garden, Juvy.

Yeah. I have my real

Speaker: estate license.

Speaker: Alright. So you know you know how to hustle.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and, you know, I kinda read that, you know, it's like in that rich dad, poor dad and that whole, like, just multiple streams of income.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Those are not good loans. They were not good loans.

Speaker: If you couldn't make money back then, you're an idiot. Right? Just like Man, it was so easy.

Yeah. And they're both truckers. Right? And they're, like, we're looking to buy our first home. You know, we don't have any credit history.

I'm here as a realtor. I know a little bit about mortgages. And I was, like, you know what? It's no big deal. Right?

Like, FHA, we just need trade lines.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Like, if you got, proof of the lease you've been paying, you got a cell phone bill, and you got, like, electric bill. Yeah. FHA, we're good. Right?

If you got no credit, we're good. And, like, they seem like the nicest, genuine, authentic couple. Right? And so... And this is back when we still use fax machines.

Speaker: Yeah. I was,

Speaker: like, no. No. You're you're looking at it wrong. Like, they said they've got no credit. He's, like, Steve, they got credit.

And that was the first time I was like, to get a 400 credit score is hard. Oh. It it takes, like, diligent effort Yeah. To not

Speaker: pay your bills.

Speaker: To not pay your bills. To to get credit, screw up on it, get more credit, screw up on that, and get credit a third time Yeah. And screw that up. And you were still a 100% stated in them.

Speaker: You could you could do loans for anybody back then. I mean, it was the craziest time.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay. So you were doing

And my first one kinda messed up, and I ran into this fraud guy who was running this Ponzi scheme in Kansas City back in the day. And he took me for, like, seven homes. Basically, like, I'd...

Speaker: He would

I'll have Mhmm. History. And, shit, within sixty days, dude, I was getting late notice that, like, my... The mortgages weren't getting paid and this and that.

Speaker: And it's What do you mean? Yes. What was the arrangement?

Speaker: So the arrangement was he would buy them, he would remodel them, he would rent them, he would manage them Mhmm. And then he would sell them within the year.

Speaker: But he would buy them, he'd borrow money from you, he'd borrow money from someone else.

Speaker: He was using my name to to borrow the money. I was like a straw borrower. Oh. And so I didn't know I didn't know all these terms, you know, in the '22.

Speaker: Yeah. You're you're you're a straw buyer.

It was a ring. It was a racket. So, anyway

Speaker: Oh, it was it was a complete scam. We saw all the mechanics.

Speaker: Yeah. And then... So, like, I'm I'm a... I'm in real estate school, and the only attorney I know is the guy who's teaching the class. Mhmm.

So I go to him, and I'm like, hey. I think I'm getting screwed here blah blah. He's like, Pat, I need paperwork. So I go to get my paperwork. They didn't give me my paperwork.

So I went down there

Speaker: Oh, you went to the guy? Yeah. To get any paperwork?

Speaker: My files. Mhmm. He wouldn't give them to me. And so I came back with two big Italians and a hand trucked three file cabinets out of his office and took all that to the

Speaker: So you're resourceful? Yeah. And we took... I took that

Speaker: to the attorney, and we found, like, 385 homes and over 50 investors. And so we called them all. We all hired the same attorney. We all went after the banks. So we sued

Speaker: the banks. Banks?

Mhmm. My 750 scores went to five fifty. My wife was ready to leave me. She... It was a bad situation.

Yeah. And so I had my license. The second thing I did, I was like, man, this mortgage guy fucked me over, dude. I need to go I need to go figure this out. Mhmm.

Speaker: Well, hang on before I get to this niche. What do you mean you went after the banks? Like, what were what were the banks liable for?

Speaker: Okay. So the bank's underwriting division allowed... So when it... So what what I end up... We end up finding out...

Because I remember nobody wanted to give me rehab loans. I was like, how's this guy getting me approved for seven loans where I didn't know is he was, like, redoing all my w twos, all my taxes were

Speaker: They got

Speaker: what I submitted. And then when the FBI came, what was submitted to the bank was totally different. And So they

Speaker: were committed

Speaker: like, the banks should have known.

Speaker: Right. And so we went after the banks. Right.

Speaker: And

Speaker: then we let the banks go after them guys. Mhmm. So all those guys got five to ten years

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: In jail. And now they're out, and I see them at auction again. How about that? Yeah. I just seen one of them the other day at the real estate auction.

I was laughing. I was like, what you doing here? Yeah.

Speaker: So... Alright. So, so you got, your debt with those things settled.

Speaker: Your Everything got set aside.

Speaker: Like, it didn't happen. Score and score.

Speaker: Went back up.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: And now I got access to homes. Mhmm. And I got access to money. Yeah. Yeah.

I can do my own loans. And back then, you didn't have this 10 limit FHA rule. You could have 30.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, and get 3% rate, whatever, 30.

Speaker: For context, what year is this approximately?

Speaker: So this is probably, like, 2003 to maybe 2002 to 2004.

Speaker: You found a lot of trouble really fast in in in in, in this journey.

Speaker: Yeah. No. I mean, it happened. Like, the first one first one was good.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: The Trump University Yeah. And the mentor. The second one was trash. The third one is even more trash.

Speaker: Cat traffic. Yeah.

Speaker: When I look back at it now, it was like the best things that ever happened to me because

Speaker: It forced you.

Speaker: Yeah. And it and it gets you to the lowest of the lows where you... After that, I was like, fuck. What can... Like, what what else can happen?

You know? Yeah. Because I remember getting hit with a fire.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. You know, but just throughout the journey, I mean,

And then... But like I said, it all happened within a year to a year and a half. And then from that point on, you know, things got really good. Mhmm. And, So

Speaker: you got into this lending thing, and you see you got a niche.

If I told you that, you wouldn't need me. Just send me all your guys. And so... But my mortgage business went to, like, 30 loans a month. You know, just...

I had... Every investor in Kansas City was sending me deals.

Speaker: So is this, what is it? Is it rate and term refinance?

Speaker: Yeah. And cash out.

Speaker: Okay. I could go up to 90 rate and term and cash out?

Speaker: At... In that time, I could go to 95 option one. I still remember the lender. Remember option one? They would do 90 to 95% cash out refi non owner.

Wow.

Speaker: They were giving money away that year. Yeah.

Speaker: Okay. And I was selling 10 rate

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: On that loan, and people was doing it. Like, investors were doing it. And and so, I had the 80% or the 75%, you know, like, Fannie Freddie product.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: But a lot of people wanted more money.

Speaker: Yeah. Of course.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, from finance. And then I took all that money, and I would wrap it back right into my real estate. You know? And then the third thing I started was the contracting company.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? And, like, not using for for construction.

Speaker: I know.

Speaker: But, like,

Speaker: it's because you're trying to cut down your rehab costs? Yeah. So you're still... You're you're doing $30.50 k a month in mortgages, and you're still flipping.

Speaker: Yep. Okay. Still flipping. And then I start the construction company. We get that going.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: The purchases. And so that was... You know? And then all a margin that I could make, you know, and really at that point, I was just doing my own houses. You know?

It's just Patrick and Marta Grace.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Oh, owner finance?

Wow.

Speaker: So the the savings here, though, is 10 to 15% on paint, machinery, whatever. Yeah. And then not paying a contractor. Right. Right?

I mean, how much is that difference?

Speaker: Well, a contractor is usually on a 30% margin.

Speaker: 30% margin there. And any other savings? Or

Speaker: Yeah. So...

Speaker: And I would get 3% paying my own... I would not...

Speaker: So you save 3% here? Yeah. Points here on the mortgages.

Speaker: I'll get paid to buy a house on MLS, then I would... I wouldn't have to pay 6%. So I'd save 3% selling that house. And then I'd do all my own loans, and then I'd... Would...

I had my own contracting company. Yeah. And so... And the only thing I was focused on

Speaker: Only thing left here is a title company.

Speaker: Right. And property management.

Speaker: Property management. Yeah. Okay. So that That that leads to the next story. So what's the next step here?

Speaker: So the next story. So then And

Speaker 2: by the

Speaker: way, we're not even getting to the good stuff yet. This is just like a story. Well, you wanna just get to the good stuff? No. No.

No. No. I I I think it's impressive to hear. Right? Because, like, I mean, would you be the one that's gonna be walking...

Because we met a boardroom. Right?

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Like, would you be the one walking around as, like, guys, I'm the smartest person in the room? No. No. You wouldn't be bragging about that. Right?

No. But you hustled. You willed your way through. You powered your way through to, like, all the success you have. And I think there's a lesson here.

Right? Like, if you're willing to put in the work Yeah. Right? If you're willing to fight... Struggle and fight through it

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Like, you can have these crazy Yeah. Yeah. Crazy success.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: Yeah. So let's go to... So what's the next Okay.

Speaker: So then, like... So everything's going great, and then, boom. Like, I get... I run into this hedge fund that wants to buy my 100 homes.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Another opportunity.

The la... The 30 homes closed in January 2007.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I think Lehman Brothers goes out of business in August.

Speaker: That was good good timing.

And so... And these are nineteen hundred nineteen twenty, like, not even good neighborhoods. Mhmm. Not, you know, just old shit. Yeah.

And so sold all that.

Speaker: Placed late.

Speaker: Yeah. And then I've got all this cash. Mhmm. And now I've got all these companies, and that's when I moved up to the Northland Of Kansas City. Mhmm.

I went north of the river, and I just started buying shit all through the recession. And, like, those properties

Speaker: cash rich at the best time.

Speaker: Yeah. You

Speaker: know, rent was $800 back then. It's 2,500 now, and I got hundreds of them now.

Speaker: How liquid were you in that in that transition?

Speaker: Oh, I probably had, I don't know, maybe $3,000,000

Speaker: Mhmm.

Mhmm. You just had to go fold out. And that was one thing I always did, man. I always paid taxes.

Speaker: Yeah.

They lost all their homes. I had guys lose 300 houses because they couldn't finance no more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: So you said you moved north of the river, and I'm terrible at geographies. I'm guessing this is this is just better.

Speaker: Better. Yeah. To the burbs.

Speaker: To the burbs? Yeah. And so

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: It's a good neighborhood.

Speaker: Yeah.

And so that's kinda what I did. You know?

Speaker: So did you pivot strategies, like acquisitions? Or were you still buying off the MLS?

Speaker: No. I was buying off the MLS. I was going to the auctions and, like... And then, you know, in the recession, these hedge funds started coming to Kansas City. Mhmm.

Shit, I didn't want, I would sell to them. You know? And just It was

Speaker: a great situation.

Speaker: Yeah. And I would just... And I and I I got up to almost 400 homes with this hedge fund.

Speaker: Mhmm.

I was making construction commissions, property management commissions.

Speaker: Mortgage.

Speaker: Doing my... Yeah. And doing my own stuff on the side. And then that took us to about 2010, maybe '11. Uh-huh.

And they stopped buying. You know? Yeah. The the take wasn't good no more. Yeah.

So then I had

Speaker: I was like, I think probably Blackstone.

Speaker: Yeah. Right? Started coming in, buying... I... People just...

They they stopped buying because, the... It was priced out. Like, people was... It was played out already. Everybody was doing it.

All the hedge funds was in at that time. Yeah. You know? And so I don't know if you remember that,

Speaker: but it

Speaker: was big. And then after the hedge fund community came the educationers.

Speaker: You know? Educators. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: You know, the the

Speaker: New Irish?

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And the fan builders. Fan Morrell, Fortune Builders. Yeah.

All those guys was coming through. That was the next big wave of people that came in. And So

Speaker: before we get there, right, it's a lot of companies. And I remember... So we're gonna talk about how we worked together and how you fired me. That's the... That's later on there in the show.

Uh-huh. Right? And then you test it as a maverick. And, like, I remember I had you on the phone. Right?

You're like, yeah. I was like, and probably no attention to detail. People like you, but you're grossly impatient. Oh. And you're like, are you reading my palm right now?

Like, what's going on? Sounds like me. Yeah. It's like... These all sound exactly like......

Speaker: Me to a t.

Speaker: Yeah. And so as I'm saying all these things, we go back to, like, you've got, like, five super lucrative things going on. Right? I think it's a realtor, mortgage, construction, rehab. Right?

And probably some property management.

Speaker: Property management.

Speaker: You have five things going at the same time, but you're supposedly disorganized. How are you managing all these things?

Speaker: Well, that's where my wife comes in.

Speaker: So she's left. So...

Speaker: Yeah. So she's like she's like the godsend. Right? I mean, so my wife is total opposite for me.

Speaker: So... And we haven't got to the brokerage yet.

Speaker: Yeah. And I'll... So I'll come to show... So my wife kinda handles the the... All of the books, the office, the staff, the people, the process.

You know, I just... My whole job was to put homes into the pipeline and handle the investments.

Speaker: Right. Right.

Speaker: You know? Yeah. And then she kinda just would handle all the staff and all the people. I mean, we had so much staff. We had so much people.

Yeah. Like, it was... Honestly, it burned us out, you know, and for later on in the story. I mean, it's kinda like... That's, you know, it kinda like...

I mean, when you're sitting here and you've got thousands of homes you're managing, And, I mean, there's fires and problems that Got some. Literally fires and problems every day.

Speaker: Real fires? Yeah. It's just like drama. You know? Just Yeah.

I mean, it was good, and it was lucrative, but imagine if I just woulda stayed focused on just my portfolio.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, how much less stress and how much,

Speaker: But you can't stay still. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So Marta really is the is the hero here.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. 100%. I mean, she's like... I mean, you can't do anything by yourself. You always gotta have people around you.

I wouldn't say opposite. Like, in life, like, our religions and our way of thinking and this and that is the same. Mhmm. But in terms of personality, we're

Speaker: total style up.

Speaker: Yeah. We're, like, the whole opposite. Like, I'll fire you and you'll sue me. She'll fire you and you'll be best friends.

Speaker: Yeah. You know, I'm just like... So, was she managing all five things or she was managing the people? Like...

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Is really you just need one house. One house fed every company.

Speaker: Mhmm. You

I just stopped doing that literally, like, five years ago.

Speaker: Yeah. Alright. So so talk to me about... So you guys started a property management company. Yeah.

How hard was that?

Speaker: That was the hardest company.

Speaker: Of the... Of all the companies, that's the hardest.

Speaker: That's the hardest by far. Why? Staff. Nobody... Imagine a property...

Nobody ever calls their property manager and says, bro, you did a good job today.

Speaker: No one? Fuck. No. All you get is

Speaker: Yeah. No one's ever called you. It's like, man. And

Speaker: when when the rent's being collected and there's no maintenance and there's no nothing, nobody calls and says, hey, man. Just wanna let you know. Yeah. Doing good.

Speaker: Thank you for leasing my property. Yeah. Like, all all...

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then the fact that you're dealing with everybody at their worst times.

Speaker: Mhmm.

You know? It's like What

Speaker: I'm hearing here is I need to send a thank you card to my property manager.

Speaker: For sure. Yeah.

Speaker: Especially if they're doing good and you got no noise

Speaker: and nothing's happening, that's when you need to reach out to them and say, hey. Thank you.

Speaker: Yeah. I mean, I got an email last night from the property manager, and they're like, hey. Like, the sprinkler head needs to be replaced. It's a $125. And in my mind, it's like, approve.

Like, the first thought was like, approve. And second is like, they only charge me a $125. Like, this is a steal. Like, I'm used to getting ripped off. Yeah.

Right? As a landlord. So... Yes. Okay.

So department management, so that's taken care of.

Speaker: Yeah. And

Speaker: then you said, like, so the the the the the hedge funds came away, and then the next big rush was all the educators coming to the space.

And then they would introduce them to you, and you would provide properties for them and management and, like, white glove service.

Speaker: You know? So this is... Yeah.... Care of them. So now this is...

At this point, you've evolved into a turnkey operator.

Speaker: Right. And so we're getting properties from And

Speaker: so just real quick for everyone. Like, what what is so... Not everyone knows. What's turnkey?

Speaker: So turnkey is, I'm basically selling the investor the house rented.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: It's done, remodeled. So I would go out, buy all the homes for cheap. I would remodel them. I would put tenants in them, and then I'd sell them

Speaker: With a long term lease.

Speaker: With a long term lease to an investor

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And probably get their loan too. Yeah. And so, you know, we were... We did that for... Until COVID.

Speaker: Yeah. You know, and then COVID. Yeah. So for, like, nine years,

Speaker: you were doing turnkey. Doing that. I was doing a bunch of that for a long time. Yeah. Because...

Fortune builders for a long time. I mean, all these guys were coming through. And Trump University. Yeah. Jason Hart.

All these guys would come through, and you just have, you know, these big outfits and everything. You know? And so we became... We quickly became that Kansas City

Speaker: You're the source.

Speaker: Yeah. And so we had... We were still doing 20, 30 homes a month Mhmm. At that time for a long time. And then COVID came and they couldn't meet.

You know? When the companies can't do the seminars, they can't bring the people in. Yeah. It's done. You know what I mean?

Speaker: So nine years, a really solid run, selling turnkey homes.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: I mean, we kinda jumped straight. Like, nine years is a big leap here. Anything else interesting happened in those nine years? Or it's just

I'm the gymnastics dad. I'm taking... Running my kids to practice, doing this and that. I mean, life is life in

Speaker: Mhmm.

I mean, it was just one thing after the next.

Speaker: So this is like you're hustling. You're going hard doing all the turnkey homes. You're still rehabbing this whole time, flipping your own homes at the time?

Speaker: Yep. Still building the portfolio and keeping all the cherries and keeping the homes up north, all a two car garage, all the split level

Speaker: You're just stacking homes.

Speaker: All the split level, two car garage, 1,500 square foot, three bed, two bath. I was just... I was a collector Yeah. Of that. You know?

And I just was... I collected

Speaker: So you're you're you're acquiring these other deals, selling them, on a cap rate.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Because this is their retirement plan.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: You're keeping the best properties, and getting paid a whole bunch on every spot.

Speaker: Everybody to manage the portfolio. And then, like, five years ago, I end up selling the property management piece. Well, not... I I sold the contracts. Mhmm.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And they put me on a noncompete for four years, which kinda threw me. And that's when I joined Boardroom.

Speaker: Yeah. And So was that, because you're saying the stress of running apartment management. Right? Everyone hates you all the time. No.

So was that was that a relief?

Speaker: Yeah. It was. But it was also, like, crazy because it was, like, the... How do I say it? Like, the, it made me feel lost.

I didn't have my vertical system anymore. Mhmm. That was the major piece of the puzzle is property management. I mean

Speaker: Why was it the major piece?

Speaker: Mhmm. You know

Speaker: They knew that they were performing.

Mhmm. Like, I can't sell this system because I can't manage, and I'm giving it to other people, and they're not doing it the way I do it. Mhmm. You know? And they don't do things the same.

That wasn't a problem, but it was more mental for me getting over this obstacle in my head that I'm not right because I'm not selling a 150 homes a year.

Speaker: Okay. Because, it's... You were the hustler.

Speaker: Well, it's like up

Speaker: to your potential.

Speaker: Slow. Yeah. Yeah. And you don't... You know?

And then you're used to making... I mean, back then, I was making $4,500 a month. Mhmm. You know? And then you're not making that anymore.

You feel like

Speaker: So why do you do it?

Speaker: Because it was starting to affect my family. My wife didn't wanna manage no more. She was adamant about not managing for other people and getting rid of that piece. You know?

Speaker: Where'd that come from?

Speaker: couldn't Really? It was a strict travel.

Speaker: Do anything. Like, you're, I mean, you're traveling, but you're on the phone all the time.

Speaker: You're you're Dealing with nonsense.

Speaker: Yeah. It's like, it wasn't... And so we had a... That was the biggest reason was the fact that my wife didn't wanna do it.

Speaker: It was just leaking in the family. Yeah. Yeah. What, how many doors did you guys have at the time?

Speaker: Oh, probably a thousand.

Speaker: You're managing a thousand doors.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, like, we wouldn't manage anything that we didn't sell. You know?

And so it created that revenue stream as well. And so we, but when I sold the management... Yeah. And so I I got out of that. And at this point now, we got couple 100 performing assets.

My debt's low. I've been doing this line of credit strategy for fifteen years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: I've got low basis. I've got access to tons of capital. Mhmm. And, you know, I run into boardroom and Right. Some coaching I did with Kent and

Speaker: Did you know when you sold the property management company, how much of a hit it was gonna be on the rest of the business?

Speaker: Yeah. I knew. I kinda knew. And that was my biggest, like, hindrance of doing it, you know, when you

Speaker: sold opposed because

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: This was the part that made sure everything else happened.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Yeah. Couldn't you sell, like, half the houses or half the contracts?

Speaker: No. I mean, at that point, it was... It wasn't about that. It was about, like, they didn't want half the houses. They wanted it.

And what they loved about my portfolio was that I had 200 investors. It wasn't one investor strong. You know what I mean?

Speaker: Like, I had so many diverse.

And the only problem was that a lot of my customers got mad because the place I sold it to didn't perform. You know? And so I had to deal with that as well. You had to do with

Speaker: the fallout from that.

Speaker: Yeah. And so that was, you know, kinda sticky. But How

Speaker: that how that all play out?

Speaker: I mean, it was all good. I mean, nothing... I mean, no lawsuits or anything like that, but just more like, Pat, you bought us to the dance, and you left us there. Yeah. You know?

And I was like, man, I've been dancing with you for ten years. Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? Like Yeah.

Speaker: I need to move on. Like... And and my life changed. You know? Things changed.

I got money.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Just the snake.

Speaker: Yeah. Just snake and drains.

Speaker: That's the only thing.

Speaker: You really account they all wanted?

Speaker: For sure. Yeah. So when we sold, man, a lot of people were affected by that because we... You know, like, a lot of people that I worked with for years, I'm a real loyal person. Like, I've...

Well, I

Speaker: can see that's impacting you.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's been... But, honestly, it's been better now.

And the fact that

Speaker: So you were lost?

Speaker: Yeah. I know. We were lost. We... You know, I wasn't lost.

I just wasn't happy. I guess I was, like, I wasn't... I didn't feel like I was living on my full potential.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: But I... What I didn't know is I had to change what the potential is.

Speaker: Yeah. Well, I think the... Because it's funny. Right? Like, we get into real estate.

Right? Whether it's rich, I pour it out, whatever else. And it's like, man, like, one of these days, I'm gonna have this. And you got it. Yeah.

And you don't feel you're not happy.

Speaker: Yeah. And that's what... That was the biggest, like like, it took me almost... It took me probably a good year to... You know?

And I remember my first meet. I never had a, like, a business coach this whole time either. You know? And so

Speaker: I would just hustle all the way.

Speaker: Yeah. And so, you know, I finally get this coach, and he's like like, I forbid you

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: To get back into that business. And, like, you'd... I'm not gonna tell you don't do it, but don't do it. Mhmm. Like, don't remodel homes for...

Don't buy homes for... Just focus on the Grace Family Trust and the assets for you guys. And we quickly came up with a plan

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: On, you know, that I wanted another $50,000,000 in my portfolio in five years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: So that reset your perspective. Yeah. So you said it took a year. So what were you doing that year, and how did you get... I mean, obviously, you

Speaker: That year, I mean, I was just... Honestly, I was relaxing. I was traveling. I was... You know?

And then and then it really sunk in. Like, I guess, because of this line of credit strategy

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That I run, I don't have a checking account.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You don't see a lot of money in your bank

Speaker: account Right.

Speaker: Because they're all

Speaker: Because it's all swept into the line. And so I never... Honestly, I I I never knew I was... And my stuff was kinda messed up. Like, I had, like, my taxes all in one place.

Like, I kinda makes things a little different. Softening

Speaker: the blow. Yeah. You're like, So I don't need it.

Speaker: And then I thought it was wrong. I was like, say it right. Yeah. Like, hey. We gotta check this.

Like, make sure that, like... And we started... We we checked it twice, and I was like, maybe that is correct.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: That we are making this kind of money, and it's passive. You know, I don't need to sit here and do all this work.

Yeah. I mean, it's it's legit.

Speaker 3: What's the situation with the property? Living there, vacant, or rented?

Speaker 4: What is my age? I'm a... I'm 75 years old, and the property is approximately 200 miles away. And it's stressful trying to drive that distance every time something breaks down.

Speaker: I hear you. That sounds like a lot to manage from that far. How's that been wearing on you?

Speaker: Well, it's just the last couple years. You know, after I've turned 73, I got a little... The 70 seem to give you a newer outlook on what you can and cannot do and what your limitations are.

Speaker: Got it. So at least you'd wanna see what options are out there. Would you be open to a quick conversation with one of our specialists to map that out for your situation?

Speaker: I would.

Yeah. Right? And so I worked with you guys. I was working with your team. We were doing the sales training deal, and then I get a call.

Actually, I think it was an email. I gotta pick a fight with you. I think it was an email. I don't know. But we talked from you.

Right? Me? Not from me.

Speaker: It was from my wife. But we talked.

Speaker: But we talked. We talked. Right? And you're like, yeah. We don't need this anymore.

I was like, what do you mean you don't need this anymore? Like, sales is sales. Like, this is important. And you're like, Steve. Like, we just sat down with Kent.

And, you know, like, we're we're cash flowing 200,000 a month right now. We don't need a big team anymore. It's like, alright. Like, I can understand that point of view. Uh-huh.

Right? You don't need to run a... You don't have to deal with a headache running a big sales team Right. When you're cash flowing $200 a month Yeah. Of your assets.

Yeah. Right? So I wasn't mad. Right? I bring this up because I think it's funny.

Yeah. Right? Because you didn't even know how well you were doing.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Yeah. Yeah. And it's because you happened onto this strategy. You didn't, like, hey, this is what we're gonna do, and we're gonna create this much cash flow.

You're, like, hey, like, I learned about this thing.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Let's do it. And then one day you look back, it's like, holy crap. Yeah. We're doing really well.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So let's talk about the strategy that you figured out or you picked up.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: What was what was the strategy that you... When you first heard about it, what was the strategy?

Speaker: Okay. So I've... I learned about this in Australia. Mhmm. So I had went to Australia for three weeks with United Real Estate, the owner, Dan Duffy.

Speaker: Mhmm. And Which is, like, brokerage.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And that, like

Speaker: Everyone in Australia. Everyone in Australia. Yeah. So Not not your friends here.

Speaker: No. Not my friends here. I'm in Australia.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And they're like, yeah, mate. We gotta go, deposit this money into our line of credit. And I'm like, deposit? What do you mean deposit? Like, fucking America, we make payments to our

Speaker: You pay

Speaker: the payment bank. Right. And so

Speaker: I was like, deposits, and he...

Speaker: They started explaining to me. He's like, yeah. Our house, our car, everything is in our line, and then we just deposit all our money into the line, and we pay our shit off in ten years.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I was like, That's that's not how we do it over there. And they're like, yeah. You bloody Americans. They're only idiots that take thirty year debt, you know, and this and this and that.

Speaker: And So that's their perspective. Yeah. Yeah. And so

Speaker: Mhmm.

They have a checking account, a savings account, a mortgage, and nothing's working together.

Speaker: You know? And then Well, it's working together. It's... But it's working together for the bank.

Speaker: For the bank. Right? The bank's making all the money on Yeah. You know, you've got money sitting in there. Some guys, I mean, they've got $500 sitting in a checking account Mhmm.

And they have a $500,000 mortgage. And I literally paid their house off in thirty days.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know, like... And they still have access to the $500.

Speaker: Right.

If you got a $250,000 mortgage, you probably pay $250 in interest.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Yeah. Yeah. Right? And it says, hey....

Speaker: PR comes out. The APR

Speaker: comes out, but it says, hey. You're buying this house for 250,000. Yeah. And by the time the loan's paid off, you would have paid 300,000 in interest.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: And that's the part as the realtor. You hold your breath so I can make sure they don't, like, hold that on for your account when they see that. Yeah. Right? Do you remember that?

Right. Do you remember those moments?

Speaker: I remember that. Right. And and so... But I I knew this other strategy.

Speaker: What I'm saying, like, this strategy, you don't have this 300,000

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right. Right? Forty year now.

Speaker: I mean, they've talked about it. Is it is it official?

Speaker: Yeah. They got a forty year product out there now.

Speaker: Alright. Alright. Forty years. So we're the only country that allows us to benefit at the bank.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Here, we brag about it.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And I just don't... I mean, and so... And the the interest is so heavy upfront.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then what do almost every American guaranteed in the next five years, they're gonna refinance.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And they reset the debt.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: They reset the thirty year.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: They reset the heavy interest, and then they own the hamster wheel just running, figuring why can't I pay this shit off?

Speaker: Mhmm. You

Speaker: know? You ever stop to think how you pay off a $100,000 escalate in five years, but you can't pay a 100 to your mortgage in five years? How come? Because there's... The the debt structure.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Simple interest, and this amortized interest is not... It's just different. And so at closing, they give you an amortization schedule

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That shows you that was even the worst document, your first payment.

Speaker: Well, they didn't understand that document. The first payment of $2, only $80 went

Speaker: to principal, and you're like... And it shows all this interest that you're paying. It breaks it down monthly, and you're like, holy crap. Like, this is... I mean...

And and so that that was, like, an eye opener as well, I would say.

Speaker: That was the first one I did it on. It was a commercial building. Yeah. And I I quickly figured out, you know, kinda like... Just like any pattern.

You know? Like, once you kinda go through it Mhmm. You're like, Let me duplicate this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so the same way BiggerPockets sells the burr. Mhmm. I just got burr lock. It's like, you know, I do the same thing. Buy, refinance, remodel, rent, and...

But when I refi, it's line of credit

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And then repeat. And so I just kinda do the same thing, and I figured out how to do it. And I did all my commercial buildings. And then once I had all my debt getting paid down... You know?

I got $750 to work with that I never... You know, like, I didn't lose any of that money. And so Yeah.

Speaker: It's all accessible.

Speaker: Right. And and that's the whole part of

Speaker: the why you don't pay down debt is because it's it's locked equity.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So with this, you're no longer locked equity.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I'm taking all my debt and line of credit debt, and I've got access to 75% of the value of all my assets. I leave 25% in there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I never sell anything.

Speaker: And

Speaker: I always have access to capital. You know? I don't need partners. I don't need to underwrite. If I wanna go to Florida and buy some land and build a beach house, line of credit.

Speaker: So you shared a strategy for a while. Right? You were spoke... You're you're speaking... We were competing Boardroom.

Right? I'm over here in the AI Room. That's right. Pat's over here in the Velocity Banking Room. Right?

And I'm looking around, like, where is everybody? It's like, well, a bunch of people are in Pat's room. Right? The good thing was, you know, I had a good talk. Everybody's in your room.

Well, I had a good talk, so everyone came back on day two to my room. Right? And I think people in my room probably went to your room. Yeah. Right?

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? And it's crazy to me because, like, this is how I was able to pay off my houses so fast with this exact strategy.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So I'm curious with you, what has been the objections when you tell people, like, hey. You could do this. Why do they tell you it won't work for them?

Speaker: So

Speaker: Or why do they

Speaker: one is my rate's 3%.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? I'm fixed at 2.75.

Speaker: You

Speaker: know? And so, but that's just dumb money speaking. You know? And so, like, you gotta educate people. It's not about the rate when you got so much cash flow that you can put in.

You know? I'm basically... I mean, if you've got $5 extra, after you pay all your bills and you got $5, you're sliding into a checking account somewhere

Speaker: Doing nothing for you.

Speaker: Doing nothing. Or you could put your debt in a line of credit. And if you had a 100,000 and you slide the 5 in tomorrow, your payment's based off of 95. Mhmm.

Speaker: You know

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And and if you need the money, it's there. Right. You can go draw it back out, and so you don't lose it. Your line of credit becomes your checking account Mhmm. And all the money's there.

Like, I mean, I

Speaker: know I got access. You need motivation. I look at I look at... Like I said, like, peep...

Speaker: Right.

You gotta have cash flow.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: Right? You gotta make money. If you upside down, this ain't gonna work. Yeah. If you have no equity in your property, this ain't gonna work.

Once you live it, you're not... You're gonna you're gonna think so different. It's like once you know you're not gonna go back.

Speaker: Well, you look at it. It's, the objection. Right? I got a 2.75. I got a three.

Right? And they're failing to see the effective rate. Right? Right. Because, like, yeah, you might be paying...

I don't know what it is today. Seven, 8% with prime plus whatever or whatever it is. What is it today?

Speaker: So right now, all my rates are between, I'd say, 6.757%.

Speaker: So let's just

Speaker: say prime... I'm at... I got I got banks at prime minus three quarter, and I got banks at prime plus a quarter. Yeah. And so that's kinda where I'm at right now.

Right? And so for a few months, I'm gonna make double payments. But then I was like, I don't wanna do this anymore. Yeah. And so what happened?

We ran the whole amortization and I paid all of that interest. So even making double payments for a few months or for six months, it actually doesn't benefit you paying more No. When it's amortized.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? But if it's... And it's stuck. Yeah. And it's stuck.

You can't get it back.

Speaker: Yeah. That's the worst part.

I took... A lot of people look at it, the line of credit, as it has to be, like, the second position. Right. Right? And for me, from day one, I always had it as the first position.

Speaker: Right.

Yep. So I think that's the part that a lot of people... I I think a lot of people are familiar with the concept of a HELOC in second position.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: People are not using concept of HELOC

Speaker: In the first position. First position,

Speaker: which you could just pay off your mortgage with the HELOC.

Exactly. And so... And you have access to it. If you need the money, you can go get it. That's the most powerful part about this strategy

Speaker: Mhmm.

So I could get five, 10 homes and no lien. I take it to my lender, and I say, hey. I wanna package up these five, 10 homes. They're free and clear, and I wanna first lien line of credit. Mhmm.

And they try and talk me into a refi, a cash out refi, and I'm like, I don't want that. I want a first lien line of credit. Right. And I was just stern with that. And it was like, why?

You know that... And you're almost paying off. Like, if I sold 10 homes on a 20 home package, it would almost pay off the entire line of credit.

Like, this is a million dollars easy. Oh, yeah. You're saving in interest.

Speaker: Easy millions. Yeah. Easy millions. Right?

Speaker: So I think that's what people are are missing out on.

Speaker: Oh, yeah.

Speaker: And I'm gonna do a quick plug here. Right? So, like, this is what I've done. Right? So I got Scotts Community Bank.

It's a bank that I invested in. And so, like, I'm doing this with them. So I'm gonna figure out how, like, how to get my bank on your list, right, to do this with.

Speaker: Yeah. I can get it done. So we've got... So that's kinda what I did is I... So I I honestly thought everybody, like, bigger investors was doing this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? So No.

Speaker: No. And the biggest thing, what you said about the first lien Yeah. That's a big one. The biggest thing is they don't sweep. Yeah.

People have lines right now. There's listeners out there. I guarantee it that are listening right now. They've got a house. They've got a line of credit.

They've got a checking account and a savings account with hundreds of thousands of dollars in it, and they're not working it right.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: If they would just close those accounts out Mhmm. Put the money into the line, pay the line down, and if you need the money is there, you can draw it out. It's changed your life.

Speaker: Right. It's the sweep. And your monthly payment goes down.

Speaker: Goes down every single month. Yeah. Every sing... As soon as the cash hits, your payment next month goes down. And if you can hit cash twice, big...

Speaker: I mean Versus thirty.

Speaker: Versus thirty. And then look at how much interest you save on that twenty years.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Especially that you're saving it in the first ten years. Mhmm.

Speaker: You

And so if you can eliminate all that upfront interest

Speaker: Yeah. I mean, it's like the difference between, I don't know, Wagyu steak and hot dogs.

Yeah. But for whatever reason, it just doesn't resonate. I was like, alright. We're gonna have Pat come on and talk about it. Right?

Because you can you can bring a lot more energy into it. And, like, you've got proof in the pudding. Right? Like, you paid off way more houses than I paid off. Yeah.

Mhmm. Trying to think, like, what else people would object to. Really, it's more... And, you know, another thing, this is an a paper loan. You know what I mean?

We can't do 500 credit. Yeah. 550 credit or something like this. You know what I mean? And so you gotta have good tax returns.

You gotta have, you know Really?

Speaker: You can't do it asset based?

Speaker: No. I mean, there is. In fact, I just talked to a guy today Mhmm. Just today who told me they have a DSCR, non owner, and owner occupied purchase money line of credit. Yeah.

So now you can purchase. Mhmm. You don't even have to refi. I've been refi ing this whole time

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And using my lines to purchase. Now I can just put 10% down, purchase money, line of credit

Speaker: Mhmm. And

Speaker: get the line straight from the beginning on a purchase money loan.

Speaker: There you go.

Speaker: So they have that now. And the guy said that... So I told him, hey. Send me that flyer.

Speaker: Mhmm. Because I

And so that's kinda where I struggle. If I had one weakness, it's that. Like, I got people that... A lot of agents, most real estate agents, they... They're not showing all this income.

You know? There's a lot of people in the service industry.

Speaker: Yeah. You know? It's all right off.

Speaker: You're ten ninety nine. Yeah. And so they got good business. They know how to run something, but they don't have good taxes.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so the DSCR was something that I was struggling with in terms of finding people money for, so when I heard about that, I was like, dude, that's awesome.

Right? So this is free and clear. I can, at any point, go get a HELOC on this one and go do something else.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? It's a very repeatable Yeah.

Speaker: Process. And it's very... You can implement this in literally thirty days. Yeah. Like, this isn't something...

Speaker: When you don't

Speaker: need it. Just let it sit there. If you don't use it, you don't pay.

Speaker: Mhmm.

You know what I mean? Until you draw out of the line. And so you can get lines. I just closed one on my beach house, just a week ago. You know?

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, I've got access to capital that

Speaker: Which we're we're gonna talk about next. Okay. Yeah. So segue. Yeah.

Yeah. The ones that listened are doing really well. So we're gonna put the link inside the show notes. So something interesting has happened in Missouri. Right?

There's, like, this thirty day right of rescission. There's this... I don't know. What's happening in Missouri?

Speaker: So right now, they've implemented two laws that... Okay. The first one is really to eliminate wholesalers. Right? And so

Speaker: You can't eliminate.

Speaker: Well, I mean, it's to eliminate wholesaling, not to eliminate wholesalers.

Speaker: But Okay.

Speaker: You know, that's been a hot topic over there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Who has the money, and they wholesale it to us. And so, this law makes... Gives... They have to... First, they have to disclose, and you should read the disclosure on what they have to say.

Speaker: I mean, it's like, I don't think any homeowner... After you read that, like, you'd

Speaker: Mhmm. And you

Speaker: have to put the numbers in there. And it's like, why would you do that? You know? Or

Speaker: you have to put the numbers in there.

But I don't think a lot of people knew that.

Speaker: Yeah. Okay.

Speaker: So, that's one.

Speaker: Okay.

You know, they didn't even know I bought the house. You know what I mean? They just knew I went and looked at it. Mhmm. Like, they didn't know I was the buyer.

Yeah. And so this crazy, disclosure now that you... And it's basically making it tough for wholesale, which is good for me. You know? Like, I'm loving it because Yeah.

I buy everything. Like, I'm not a wholesaler. So if I come meet you at your table, my biggest competition were the wholesalers.

Speaker: Mhmm.

So I used to be... I'm that guy that would go to you seven, ten days before the foreclosure and be like, hey. What's... Get the payoff. I'll pay the bank off, and I'll lease you back the house.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? And and give them $20. And just however you struck... Well, you can't do that anymore. So now you need...

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And so, those are the two new big laws that hit Kansas City that's affecting a lot of people out there Yeah. Right now.

Speaker: Well, it's a city or or it's a state?

Speaker: Well, shit. I don't even know if it was a state. Yeah. I thought it was

Speaker: a state. Yeah. That was It

Speaker: could be. I know for sure Kansas City. I know it, but it might be the state. You might be right. I'm I'm not sure on

Speaker: that. So I know, like, you know, Doug Hopkins is the gorilla in Phoenix. Right? Like, the guy is everywhere. And I've told him it's not a threat.

It's really just a notice. Right? Like, if they ever do anything crazy like this in Arizona, I'm getting back in the game.

Speaker: Oh, yeah.

Speaker: Because right now, I don't have the energy

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: To play against all the hustlers in the... In in Phoenix.

Speaker: No. I made it good. Like, all I did was really turn back on my meta ads and, like, you know, I called REI Print Mail

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And just started sending shit out again because

Speaker: As you can buy it.

Like, they they they can't do it no more. Yeah. And so, you know, it's sad sad for them, but it's really good for

Speaker: people who

Speaker: have cash. Like, if you have cash and you can actually buy the home, that that part didn't affect me.

Speaker: It's it's almost like the auction at the courthouse steps. You know? Like Yeah. It's like that. Like, I love the auction because you have to have cash that day.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: There's no finance. There's no thirty day close.

Speaker: Yeah. You

Speaker: know? It's cash that day by 02:00.

Speaker: And so By 02:00? Yeah. Is there... See, we get we get the next day. Oh, yeah.

In Arizona, we got, like, I'll give you 10,000 today. I can give you the rest by 5PM tomorrow, or at least by ten thousand. Oh. But I get a whole day.

Like, that's what they say. We want it that day. Mhmm. And so we did... I did a lot of...

I still do auctions all the time because of that. You know? Because I go there, and usually, there's, like, five, 10 guys there.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: You know? MLS, holy shit, man. Everybody on MLS trying to buy a house. Yeah. I mean, it's...

And so that's a tough strategy on MLS. So we do a lot of, I'm doing a... I'm doing... It's funny you say that because, like, I just turned that back on, like, within the last, like, literally month.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: we gotta set you up on our AI appointment center now.

Speaker: You should do that. Yeah. I would do that.

Speaker: They're gonna have a conversation.

Speaker: Thing I hate.

Speaker: We're gonna have a conversation.

Speaker: That's the one thing I'm not good at. It's the... So you got AI that can answer the phone Mhmm. For the foreclosure or whoever the probate

Speaker: Whoever's calling.

Speaker: Whoever's calling, and then what? They set an appointment for me?

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That would be great.

Speaker: Yeah. We're gonna talk about that. Now that you're now that you're back in it. Yeah. I'm back in that.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Cool. So, I mean...

So, obviously, you know, this whole velocity banking thing's done really well for you, and you're you're excited to get back in the game. Yeah.

Speaker: That's the big strategy that's honestly separated me from... I feel like if I look back on everything that I've done

Speaker: Bigger than the property management?

Speaker: Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Biggest thing. I mean, imagine all the properties and all the interests you save.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And the more you buy, the more you save. And the volume that I done millions Mhmm. Of dollars of interest that I haven't paid that has came back to

Speaker: It's in your pocket.

Speaker: Yeah. That's that's my family money. Yeah. That didn't pay the bank. You know?

And then... So that is the the biggest thing when I look back at my twenty five years of doing this.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Yeah. And so I know them. I meet them. You know them. Yeah.

And so, they're not living the same and filling the freedom and having access to the capital. That's the biggest thing.

Speaker: Yeah. The access to that.

Speaker: 200 field, when you got a lot of assets and you got them tied up in mortgages and you got all this stuck money over there and you don't have access rich

Speaker: cash poor.

Speaker: Yeah. You don't have you don't have access to your capital. That's fucking crazy.

Speaker: Like Yeah.

Speaker: I wouldn't even... I can't even comprehend that right now, but that's what a mortgage is. Right? It's stuck capital.

Speaker: Yeah. It's locked in the capital.

Speaker: Here and sweep 20 a month to your mortgage No. You'll lose it. It's gone. You... Yeah.

Yeah. You know? And... Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. There's guys in boardroom who I've... And you know what's funny is I never really talked about this and where it's really got, I guess, some legs Mhmm. Is... Wasn't...

They know that.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And I'm like, well, I'd rather talk about that. I don't wanna go in there and talk about my 200 homes and blah blah.

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: A million a month?

Speaker: A month. You know who, Mark in Boardroom, the oil guy from Okay. Oklahoma Mhmm. Just joined. That guy's business is so big, and he makes so much money

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: That, his son... And I was just with his son in Montana. 1,000,000 a month in what they do. Another guy had... He was the one I was telling earlier.

He had a $500,000 checking account, 500,000... $2,000,000 house, $500,000 mortgage.

Speaker: Mhmm.

You know? And so, and he's got access now to almost $1,500,000.

Speaker: Mhmm. Or

Speaker: he didn't have that before. He had a 500...

Speaker: You know what I mean? He had a

Like, that's what I... When I said millions, it's millions, dude.

Speaker: Sleep good.

Mhmm. Nobody sells it. Nobody talks about it. The banks don't like it because they don't make as much interest on it.

Speaker: That'd be great.

Speaker: They love you more when you refinance.

Speaker: Oh, yeah. Hey. We'll do it cash out. Free. No no no no fee cash out refi.

Yeah. You know, when rates drop.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: They'll pay they'll pay your fee for you and lock and and lock you back down for another thirty years. You know, it's reset the interest clock Yeah. Upfront.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Right? Like, it's it's it's... There's not enough people talking about it. So I'm glad. I'm grateful you're able to come on.

For sure. Anything... As we're wrapping this up, is there anything that you want to talk about, share about, let people know that we haven't touched? No. Yeah.

I mean, I think I think it's an incredible journey.

Speaker: Yeah. I can't

Speaker: believe you hustled all the way through all of that with no coaching. It's it's incredible. So, like, Kent was the first one you hired?

Speaker: Kent Clothier. Yeah. He was my first, like, business coach

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And my first coach after twenty five years. Like Yeah. You know? And and really, it was, like, perfect timing for me because it was, like, really more mindset

Speaker: Mhmm.

Speaker: And having somebody tell me, Pat, you made it. Like, I coach thousands of people, and, like, you're up there, bro. Like, you don't know if you're good or not. I don't know. You know?

This makes zero sense. Like, just focus on you, your family. You don't have to sit here and do this. And I was like, I really didn't believe him. Honestly, the first, like, couple...

Like, first two months of the coaching, I was like, man, I was trying to start property management again. I was trying

Speaker: to do all this stuff again.

Speaker: And Yeah. And, he had to talk me out of it. So... Yeah. But the coaching was probably some of the the best, you know, and enjoying, like, the mastermind group

Speaker: Mhmm.

He's got 10 free and clear properties in California.

Speaker: I'm like, bro, let's get a line of credit on all of these. Let let me package up 10

Speaker: of these. We'll get a line of credit done. You don't have to raise capital. The capital's in your portfolio. It's right there.

Yeah. No. He's got a primary and 10 free and clear properties in LA.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: I'm like, bro, come on, man. This is...

So thank you.

Speaker: Sure. No rush, brother. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate you, Steve. Thank you, man.

Speaker: You're welcome. You're welcome. Thank you guys for watching.

Speaker: See you

Speaker: guys next week.

Speaker: Out to Steve train. Jump on the Steve train. Disrupt us.

The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

Full Transcript

Want to close more deals?

Never miss an episode

The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

Full Transcript

Want to close more deals?

Never miss an episode

The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

Full Transcript

You Might Also Like

George Antone

Gary Harper

Jordy Perez & Brandon Miguel

Want to close more deals?

Never miss an episode

The House Hack The Ultra Wealthy Use You Haven't Heard Of

Full Transcript

You Might Also Like

George Antone

Gary Harper

Jordy Perez & Brandon Miguel

Want to close more deals?

Never miss an episode