From Broke Realtor to Flipping 83 Houses in 2022

Chris Burrow: I took, $387 out of our last thousand bucks and bought this list without telling my wife. I remember sitting upstairs in our in our bedroom making the decision to to spend that money Mhmm. And walking downstairs and saying, here's what I just did.

Steve Trang: And, you

Chris: know, she lost her mind for a second. I spent the better part of a week knocking every single door on that list, trying to see if this is a viable opportunity. Mhmm. As I'm getting to the end of this list, I was already defeated. I'd already accepted honestly accepted defeat.

Like, what am I gonna tell my wife? What's the next where do I go? Do I go work at a car dealership? Like, what what's next for me?

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: I'm already rationalizing this. Like, here we go again. But I could not stop. I had three names, three addresses left on the list. Very last house on the list, I knock, not expecting the door to open, but it opens.

And a lady opened the door, and she said, I've been sitting here praying all day that someone would knock on this door and ask me to sell my house.

Steve: Hey, everybody. Thank you for joining us for today's episode of Real Estate Disruptors. Today, we have Chris Burrow with Maximum Cash Homebuyers. And Chris flew in from Atlanta, Georgia to share how he went from broke agent to 83 flips in 2022. I'm on a mission to create a 100 millionaires.

The information on this podcast alone is enough to help you become a millionaire. In the next five to seven years, if you'll take consistent action, you'll become one. And we know the fastest way to become a millionaire is to get really good at sales. Our sales community was launched just a few weeks ago, and the community members are already closing more sales. If you haven't checked it out, go to salesdisruptors.com to surround yourself with sales assassins from across

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Go to investorlift.com, put in disruptors to get 10% off. And if you get value today, please hit that subscribe button. That way we can all grow together. And, I guess we'll just jump right into it, Chris. Well, actually, before we jump into it, I I wanted to pick on you a little bit here because we were chatting chatting before the show.

Maximum cash home buyers. So I think I I I saw you kinda, like, on social media a year or two ago. I was like, hey. That guy's name sounds very much like like our wholesale operation.

Chris: How ironic. Right? I learned this a year or two ago also. I was like, oh, man. Of course.

Steve: Yeah. So how did you come up with

Chris: the name Maximum Cash, Homebuyers? I think it was very late at night. I just needed a website. I was trying to start some PPC. Uh-huh.

There was very little effort or thought put into it. Yeah. What I figured out now is, when people are trying to, you know, spell maximum, or or get the name right, like, it's very regularly that people get the name right. I think that should encourage people. It it really just doesn't matter what the name is.

If you're doing the right thing, if you're taking the right approach, it's not gonna.

Steve: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Marketing marketing. Alright. So going back to your situation, what was your life like before real estate?

And I'm including the realtor side as well. Right. Before you got into the became a realtor even. What were you doing?

Chris: Door to door sales.

Steve: Door to door sales.

Chris: Yeah. Selling what? Selling cable, Internet, security, you name it. I would knock on a door and try to literally, like, get your foot in the door. Mhmm.

And it was very much a beat them up and fast talking Mhmm. A totally different sales approach than what we're used to in real estate.

Steve: Yeah. So that's when when I say get your foot in the door, like, that's

Chris: Quite literally. Right?

Steve: Yeah.

Chris: It is, if you position your your body the right way, like, it makes difficult to close the door. So that's like those were the techniques that I was I was taught.

Steve: I have to learn these ninja techniques. Yeah. So door to door sales, was there anything else you were doing before you got into door to door sales?

Chris: Cable disconnects, climbing poles. I would Okay. Knock on people's doors that were behind on their their cable or Internet. Mhmm. So they'd have a $500 bill.

I'd knock on the door and say, hey. If you don't pay me right now, I'm climbing that pole. I'm turning your stuff off.

Steve: The collections.

Chris: Collections. Door to door collections.

Steve: That's gotta be I mean, you're talking about door to door sales being a pretty tough Yeah. Gig. Yeah. Door to door collections, I imagine, is pretty tough as well. Absolutely

Chris: tough. It the job was sold to me as a technician job of, hey. See if you can collect this bill. If not, you climb the pole. We made $2 to climb a pole risking your life.

I figured out I get paid 10% of every dollar I collected. It's way easier Mhmm. To make this a collections job and then work with people. So we could do all sorts of stuff, take postdated checks. There's ways to solve the problems, but I made that a sales job and not a technician job.

Steve: Were there ever any fears of having the ladder kicked out while you were up high?

Chris: Oh, yeah. That was absolutely a threat. People would say, you climb that. I'm I'm kicking your ass off the ladder. Mhmm.

And, sometimes you have to call the cops because there was a very real threat or people would threaten, you turn my TV off, turn off my Andy Griffith, I'll shoot you. You know?

Steve: Did that ever happen? No. No. Did you call the cops before you climbed the ladder?

Chris: There's maybe one or two times, but most people, I mean, they're just they're upset. Right? It's the last thing they have. It's the last like, it's one of those comforts that people are just not willing to lose. Sure.

You know?

Steve: Well, I've said before, one of my favorite experiences someone can have on their resume is collections. Yeah. Right? Because if someone's done collections Mhmm. They know how to reach out to a person in a very difficult scenario, get screamed at on the phones.

You're door to door. Yeah. But get screamed at on the phones, calm that person down, and then try to come into an amicable resolution with another person. So is that was that your experience?

Chris: A 100%. It it was a learning process of, working with people. When do you get paid next? What's the you know, how much can you pay now? How much can you pay later?

It it's just, connecting the the dots or putting the pieces of the the puzzle together. But once people understood, I had no interest in climbing that pole.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Right? I'd rather work with you, and let's figure this out together. The the conversation changed, and it changed my approach.

Steve: Right.

Chris: It was a much lighter, you know, it it was a friendly conversation. So you're not the bad collections guy. You're like, look, man. I don't wanna do this either. You know?

Steve: Right. So I imagine then then the transition from door to door collections to door to door sales was a lot easier.

Chris: Yeah. A lot easier. The problem that I had in door to door sales was I got really good at selling anybody and everybody. So anyone that didn't need a security system, I could convince them that they needed one.

Steve: Right.

Chris: Right? But I would get a lot of chargebacks. Mhmm. So I could talk someone into doing something that they really it was not in their best interest to do. Right.

And then I, you know, I wouldn't get paid because they would prevent the installation or whatever. For sure. And that's just it's a it's a trial by fire kinda kinda job. I don't think anyone lasts long term in those positions.

Steve: So was that feeling more like, you know, we oftentimes kinda feel like the car sales guys under the bus here. Right? Mhmm. Yeah. Was this kinda like that stereotypical thing we hate about other salespeople?

It's just pushiness, getting something signed at all costs. Yeah. Yeah.

Chris: The better guys knew how to problem solve or actually address real problems. But the approach that that I was taught is a very pushy

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Like, it it doesn't matter whether it's, you know, if you can't afford it, like, it was everyone needs this no matter what. Mhmm. The problem that that created was taking that approach into real estate.

Steve: Right.

Chris: Those that same sales style didn't work. No. And I can't imagine how many millions of dollars I've lost over the years, missed opportunity by misunderstanding what what the sales or the negotiation process should have actually been from day one. Right. But that's part of that's part of the journey in the store.

Steve: Absolutely. So then you're doing well, I imagine, in this in this seat door to door sales. Like, I mean, door to door sales guys generally get compensated fairly well. Is that

Chris: accurate? Generally, but, I I mean, $50.60 grand a year. Got it. It was great for a college kid, not great for someone that's got, you know, a family, two kids Mhmm. That kinda thing trying to support, and it was inconsistent.

Steve: Okay.

Chris: Prices would change. There's a lot of stuff out of out of our control or out of my control. I knew that that was not my landing spot, so it was never a long term thing.

Steve: So why real estate?

Chris: I was knocking doors. I was right in the middle of a sale, literally pushing the contract across the table. And it was a it was a lady named Amy Gonzalez, and she she stopped me. I'm I'm pushing for the signature, and she said, let's pause for a second. I need to get you a book.

And so she went in the back. She got, a Garrett Keller book. I think, maybe the one thing I can't remember, I can't remember which book it was, but she said, have you thought about

Steve: what is it? Remember the color? Was it a red book? Yes. So the Million Dollar Real Estate Agent.

Chris: Million Dollar Real Estate Agent. Thank you. Yeah. She gave me the book, and she said, you need to get into real estate. Mhmm.

I said, yeah. But about this, like, contract, I was only worried about losing this. And she was like, you would crush it in real estate. You really need to do this. The deal fell apart, but I listened to her.

Well, I took the book. I didn't think anything else about this.

Steve: She was a realtor, I presume?

Chris: She was a realtor. Okay. Yeah. I did not think much more about it. I didn't get that deal, but two or three months later, I was just struggling in the door to door stuff, and someone else mentioned the same thing to me.

So I went back to Amy and said, hey. How do I do this? I went and got licensed and and joined Keller Williams for, for a period of time, and that was the introduction into the

Steve: real estate. Got it. So you were indoctrinated by a realtor.

Chris: Right.

Steve: And then you got licensed, I presume. Mhmm. Joined a brokerage. Lots of promises. Lots of hope.

Mhmm. What were the promises like? What was the reality to become a realtor?

Chris: This was 2015. The market was not quite as competitive. This was also in North Carolina. North Carolina is slightly more difficult to get your license in than than other states. I'm in Georgia now.

Everyone's cousins, nephews, aunt is a is an agent there. Mhmm. So there's the, I had a little bit of an advantage at that time, but I came out swinging. I did 25 transactions first year, with no, like, sphere of influence. They pushed, like, friends and family, and I just felt I didn't do that.

Yeah.

Steve: So I I You're a hunter.

Chris: Yeah. I I transitioned, for sale by owners into listings, and that was kinda my,

Steve: bread

Chris: and butter

Steve: for a

Chris: couple years.

Steve: Going from door to door sales to calling in cancels and expires is, like, such a not simple, but it's such a direct translation.

Chris: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was a it was a natural transition, and it just did not feel all that difficult. But what did feel difficult is the real estate agent mentality or the culture, and something about that just felt inauthentic to me.

Steve: What's that?

Chris: There there seems to be, like, if you think about the stereotypical real estate agent Mhmm. Roll up in a Mercedes. Right? Mhmm. Like, dressed to the nines.

You have to speak a certain way. You have to, I just had this this image, but that was also what was being taught to me in the circles that I was in. It's like, this is what it looks like, and it just didn't feel authentic to me. I felt like I had to kiss people's ass, and I it just did not it did not suit my personality. Yeah.

What

Steve: is your personality?

Chris: I think, to be a little bit more real, with the danger of coming across, maybe maybe slightly crass or maybe I can occasionally rub people the wrong way.

Steve: Sure.

Chris: But I found that there is I'm able to build trust. And and when I'm being actually who I am, that's where I can establish and nurture relationships. And I don't have to pretend to be something I'm not.

Steve: Right.

Chris: I feel like real estate investing lends itself more to that than me being this, like, agent in a suit on a billboard.

Steve: Maybe the industry is more in line with how you're wired.

Chris: Probably.

Steve: I wouldn't say realtors are necessarily inauthentic. I'm saying for you to fit the persona Absolutely. Realtor probably was the best fit.

Chris: Correct. I think it's a skill set fit, and it's the way I felt at the time. Yeah. You know?

Steve: Well, because look. The re the reason I bring this up, because I've gone through the realtor route, right, as well. I mean, I'm tech still technically licensed. Same here. The things I hated the most because you said you didn't like calling friends and family.

Things I hated the most was calling Chris. Right? It's been four months since, you know, you bought that house with me. Hey, Chris. How are you doing?

How's the family? You guys have any fun planned this summer? Alright. And these kinds of questions Mhmm. Were just grating on my soul because it's so not me.

I don't call anybody to ask what they get planned for the summer. Right. And that's what we had to do all the time. I had to goo frog. Right?

Family, recreation, occupation, goals are forward, family, occupation, recreation, and dreams. Right? Like, those are the two things that the priest like, what would I say to them? I was like, well, talk about these four things. Like Mhmm.

I don't want to talk to them about these things.

Chris: I think you're you're hitting the nail on the head of the the part that I felt uncomfortable with is every time I did actually care about a friend or family, I'm thinking that they're they're cringing like I have ulterior motives

Steve: Right.

Chris: That they're thinking, well,

Steve: Chris wants something. That we actually wanted the best for them.

Chris: Absolutely. And so it it creates a dynamic of, like, people are always like, what's he after?

Steve: Yeah. Is he saying this because he cares, or is he saying this because he's trying to sell me something? Correct. Yeah. Absolutely.

So I struggle with that as well. Yeah. So between that, the having to care more about people that you wouldn't normally hang out with. And then the the other thing that kinda was a shocker for me was I left Intel because I was hired to having a boss. And as a realtor, everyone's your boss.

Right. Yeah. How'd you deal with that?

Chris: Horrible. Absolutely horrible. There was one the the the end the beginning of the end and, really, the end of the end was one deal that I had both sides of a transaction, and I had poured everything into this lady. Yeah. Everything.

Her her house that I was listing, it was under contract. We're going through repair request and that negotiation. I've been looking for a house for her. We've gone to, I don't know, 30 houses. I've spent a significant amount of time, probably two months, working with this one person.

And she says, I I've decided not to sell. I said, hey. Is it because of the repair request? I mean, it's $1,500. You know, it's the

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: I even volunteered to pay it. She said, out of principle, I'm not selling. I will not do it. I will not allow you to contribute your commission to help solve this. It was done.

So I'm counting on $78 that's gonna get me through the next two months, and it all comes crashing down. Mhmm. And that was where I just felt so out of control. Like, I don't have control of this entire process, and the compounding effect of, like, everything that we just talked about. I was like, I'm out.

I cannot do this anymore.

Steve: Yeah. So the realtor thing, not in love with it.

Chris: Right. To say the least.

Steve: What was the next when when did you come to this realization?

Chris: This is in 2017.

Steve: So come out of the gate swinging, crushing in 2015. 2017 is like, I can't do this anymore. What was the next step then?

Chris: I had moved from North Carolina to Georgia. So I was doing great in North Carolina. Some of my family moved to Atlanta. I thought that Atlanta would have so much more opportunity, but it was a different it was a different environment. Mhmm.

So that was, that was mistake number one, and that Yeah. That killed that, like, deal flow. It was just much more competitive. I could not compete in in Atlanta. Yeah.

I still don't think if I went and tried to be a, like, a full time agent that I would be very successful at it. So there's there's some compounding things. 2017 was a extremely rough year, as like, total income for the year was $20 that entire year. Wow. With the with the family living in Georgia.

It just, yeah.

Steve: Okay. So then what do you do if that's the case?

Chris: I scrambled. I tried to start a photography business, a real estate photography business. A lot of people did that. That did that did horrible. I'm also not a photographer, but I I was willing to try anything.

I went and worked for, Mark Spain for a period of time.

Steve: That guy's a big name.

Chris: Absolutely. I

Steve: think he owns Atlanta. Absolutely.

Chris: Yeah. He's everywhere. He owns a lot of the Southeast. Yeah. So it was interesting being in a larger company.

Mhmm. There were there were things I learned, but I do remember sitting there. There's one specific moment that they played a, a video, a a really motivational video. Like, man, you guys can do it. Like, you're awesome.

And I was like, you know what? You're right. Like, I I, they that video motivated me right out.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: So, that was the moment I decided to, to get into wholesaling.

Steve: Right. Why, though? Like, you're watching this video, production's not great, and they're trying to hype you up in the realtor team. Mhmm. What about wholesaling was, like, in your ears?

Like, you know what? I gotta I gotta go down this road.

Chris: Something about the opportunity spoke to me. I the first I heard about wholesaling, I was watching Grant Cardone, one of his live, podcasts, and he had I don't even know the name of the guy, but he was talking about the concept of wholesaling.

Steve: Probably Chris Rood.

Chris: Probably.

Steve: Yeah. Did he have a southern accent? Mhmm. Very, very thick southern accent. Yeah.

Yeah. That's Chris. Okay.

Chris: Yeah. So now I know. Yeah. And the concept blew my mind. And I I I knew a little bit about real estate, obviously.

Something about it, yes, spoke to me. I actually went to Mark Spain and said, hey. Is this something I can do? They're like, absolutely not. You're not you're not doing this here, which I knew that answer anyways.

I went and had a conversation with my wife. We laid out the pros and cons, and I knew how many other failed businesses I had started.

Steve: How many at this point?

Chris: Six or seven.

Steve: Okay.

Chris: A used car dealership, a, a publishing company, lots of

Steve: Serial entrepreneur. Right. Alright.

Chris: Yeah. And I I failed, and I knew I was beginning to feel the pressure of when am I gonna stop failing? Like, is this gonna be another one? Because I'm stepping out once again out of this comfort zone, out of this, you know, it I wasn't making very much money, so there wasn't much of a comfort zone. But still, to to, not convince my wife, but to get her on board with Mhmm.

This is what's happening next. I knew that stakes were extremely high. And it was, it was one of those, you know, Tony Robbins, like, burn the ships kinda moment. There is no there is no room for failure anymore. There is no backup plan.

There is absolutely none. We had negative money that it it it was it was down to the last thousand bucks, and that was that was it.

Steve: So talk to me about this because there's a lot of people I think that kinda go through this scenario and maybe even experienced it last year as well. Right? Like, as an entrepreneur, one of the hardest things is that we have to grind and sacrifice, and that includes sacrificing time with the spouse, time with the family, living on less. Right? Because, like, we gotta take this money.

We gotta put it back into the business. And we do this venture and this venture and this venture. And somewhere along the way, I know I've had this conversation with my wife many, many years ago. It's like, are we done playing? Like, are we gonna start like, are you gonna go get a real job?

Are you gonna Right. Go make this work, this and that? What was that conversation like, you know, in in the dust? Because those are the the the most some of the most trying times. We can look back and triumph later on, but those are some of the toughest moments in our career.

Chris: She's been very supportive and very gracious to allow me to go fail or succeed.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: The pressure I I was feeling was, less about pressure she was putting on me and more so I understood, what had happened in the month or two previous to that. I neither one of us knew this, but she mentioned to her sister that we didn't have we didn't have enough money to pay rent.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: We were behind on our cell phone bill, behind on utilities, robbing Peter to pay Paul, that vicious cycle that I'm sure a lot of people are familiar with. Her sister went and told her parents. Her parents gave us $3 to make it into the next month. And I'd never once ever asked anyone for money. And I was so, humiliated is the best word.

Just humiliated that someone had to step in and, you know, rescue us. So that was the pressure that was starting to mount of, like, this is this has the potential to get really bad if I don't figure this out real quick. Oh. Yeah.

Steve: So what was step one in getting the wholesaling?

Chris: Step one was figuring out who do I talk to, what do I do, what do I say, all of that. Mhmm. I, I bought a list, pared that down into, like, multiple, motivations that I thought would translate into, wholesaling, and then I did what I knew how to do, and that's door knock and door knocked. I also, you know, like, cold called them, left them messages, that kind of thing. But I I took, $387 out of our last thousand bucks and bought this list without telling my wife, without telling Meghan.

I remember sitting upstairs in our in our bedroom making the decision to to spend that money Mhmm. And walking downstairs and saying, here's what I just did. And, you know, she lost her mind for a second, as she should have. But I knew the the the heat was on. So, yeah, I I spent the better part of a week knocking every single door on that list, trying to see if this is a viable opportunity.

Mhmm. The very last as I'm getting to the end of this list, I was already defeated. I'd already accepted honestly, accepted defeat. Like, what am I gonna tell my wife? What's the next where do I do I go work at a car dealership?

Like, what what's next for me? Mhmm. I'm already rationalizing this. Like, here we go again. But I could not stop.

I had three names, three addresses left on the list, and these are on the outskirts. I saved these for last because it's a it's a drive. I was like, I have to hit them. And I know it's costing me gas at this point to do this, and I had to hit it. It's on a Sunday afternoon.

It's getting late right before dark. Very last house on the list, I knock, not expecting the door to open, but it opens. And a lady opened the door, And she said, I've been sitting here praying all day that someone would knock on this door and ask me to sell my house. I said, excuse me?

Steve: Sounds like a prank.

Chris: I know. It did not it's like, it did not feel real, but it got my attention. Mhmm. Now I didn't, I didn't make it into the door, that day. I didn't wrap up the deal that day, but, had a had a brief conversation, got the phone number.

It started the ball rolling. And within that week, that was the first contract. Yeah. And then it was off to the races.

Steve: So you've never done this before, but you have a bunch of realtor experience Mhmm.

Chris: As

Steve: well as door knocking experience. Right. Certainly helps. Yeah. Walk me through this transaction.

Right? So you said you didn't lock it up that day. What happened between the initial door knock until locking it up?

Chris: This one happened to be a a preforeclosure.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: So there was a there was a time was ticking, so that was certainly on my side.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: I could not get them to agree to let me come back to the house. We were texting. She would not answer the phone. So I'm trying to, like what can you put in a text to convince someone to let me come out to the house? And finally, I tried everything, and it took getting a little bit mean, I guess.

Almost an ultimatum of, you know, if you're unwilling to do this, like, good luck

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Kinda thing. And that's what that extra kinda pressure is what got me in the door. Mhmm. The guy's name was Ed or Edward, and it was, I think the contract price was 78,000. That week, I had just gone to a they called it a BiggerPockets, meetup, like a local meetup.

I think they've changed the name now. But I met a guy. I accidentally interrupted a conversation, but, I met a guy named Jason there. I got his card. I knew he was buying houses in the area.

So after I got the contract, he was the first call. Mhmm. I said, hey, man. I've got this. Do you want it?

He said, I'll be there in an hour Mhmm. Or two hours. He walked through the house. It was a $5,000 assignment fee. It's $5 back in my pocket and kept us rolling for another month.

Steve: So it's almost like a Hollywood script here, like The Last House.

Chris: Sounds too good to be true. Right? Right. Sometimes those moments happen, though, where I feel like as undeserving as I am, right, sometimes the universe just gifts the situation.

Steve: Right. You know?

Chris: And I I feel like like it's my responsibility responsibility to be ready and prepared for when that, you know, when the sky's open and the stars align, I've gotta be ready and willing to take that step and seize that opportunity. Yeah. There's been multiple moments where it's like, it just is too good to be true Mhmm. And and, take that leap of faith, and it it it works out.

Steve: How did you con continue? Right? So you said, okay. That $387 turned into 5,000. How did you continue that momentum?

Chris: The next month, when did it again?

Steve: Same list?

Chris: Same list? This is where things started to change a little bit where I realized I I might not have to use the same techniques. It actually took me a couple years to fully, like, work through this. The second deal we did, a lady named Dana, I remember the conversation. She would not let me in the house.

And I started to go into this, like, pitch thing. She interrupted me. She had a story to tell. Her husband had died of cancer six months ago. We sat there on the porch for two hours, and she is pouring her heart out.

I didn't have to say a word. Mhmm. At the end of this, she says, how can you help me? I didn't I didn't have to do anything. All I had to do was listen.

Mhmm. And that was the that was the beginning of me realizing that it's not about what I say. It's about listening. Mhmm. And and at the end of that, like, we've gained trust through listening.

Steve: Right.

Chris: And we're able to we're able to apply a solution to whatever that problem is, but it's not because of what I've said.

Steve: No. Yeah. There's a lot very little to what you say That's exactly right. How much they feel like you understand them.

Chris: And validate them. I tell our our team, you know that you have done the right thing. You've won the negotiation. When you've gotten the contract, you're walking out of the house, and they say, hey, Chris. What's your last name again?

Hey, Chris. Remind me the name of your company again. Hey, Chris. Let me, you're gonna send me a copy of all this. Right?

Yeah. That tells you it's not about me. I haven't sat there and said, well, here's our five star reviews. Here's our here's our this. This is our reputation.

Me, me, me. They don't know. They have no clue who we are or any of that. It's about how they felt in the moment, and do they trust us to take care of them.

Steve: Absolutely. So what would have happened you're talking about that you're accepting defeat at first list. What would happen if you didn't get that house?

Chris: I would quit. I would've. And that's the scary thing when when I talk to people getting into this business, they're like, how did you get started? Like, man, I got lucky, honestly. That fir I needed that first one to give me enough hope to take the steps to take the second one.

And what I fear is that there are so many people that have tested getting into this business that have they're on the wrong side of that cycle. So you know how a sales cycle, you've got this.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Well, let's say you put in this amount of effort, and you're you're netting one deal on average every thirty days. For a smaller smaller sample size, that might actually take sixty or ninety days. Well, how many people have quit before they got that first one? Their efforts were were not in vain. They would have gotten it.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: In fact, they might have gotten two at the end of that, you know, that valley.

Steve: It's that that that story, the fable, right, of, the digging for digging for gems. Right? Like, you're right there. Yeah. You've done all that work and they quit right beforehand.

Who helped you on this? I mean, you pulled that list and you went to go door knock, but who guide you on your way in building up your real estate business?

Chris: I had two mentors that both of them, I I was wholesaling deals too. That's how I met these guys. But I I knew that they were making money. Right? So it's in their best interest to be be nice, be kind, but it went beyond that.

There was a true friendship and mentorship there. Mhmm. This guy named Jeremy Bill, he's out of Atlanta. He owns a Homevestors franchise. I owe him so much.

He he would stand and talk to me for, you know, one, two, three hours at a time every time I would call him, and I could ask anything and everything, and he never asked for anything in return. Mhmm. Like, that what he invested into me is the reason I'm I'm here. Yeah. And every time I talk to him, I remind him, like, I am not like, I will not forget that, and I thank him every time I talk to him Yeah.

Because it just meant that much. So it's my desire, like, as we progress and we learn more, that I'll have those opportunities to show that, like, I have to take extra time. Even when it's not convenient for me, I don't have it doesn't make me an extra dollar. Right? I want to be able to invest into other people because I don't know what that's gonna mean to them down the road.

If I can have you know, competition's funny, but I think the more allies we have, even in the Atlanta market. Right? Like, I would prefer my competitor competitors to be my allies, our friends. How much more business could we do? How much more money could we make together?

Steve: Absolutely. Who's the other mentor?

Chris: A guy named Jason Fears. These guys have two different two different strategies. Jason is a buy and hold guy. He does some flips too, but two different mindsets, two different mentalities. Both have helped out, in a lot of different ways, but still very close to both of those guys.

Steve: What were some of the biggest victories you experienced along the way?

Chris: I think transitioning out of the solopreneur into building a a real team, building a real business, part of that journey I went to scale with Cody Hofhein. Mhmm. Cody's another one of those mentors that I met along the way that's, you know, he's poured a lot into me and very thankful for, what he's done. Went to scale and got the the the blueprint for how do we how do we build a business? How do you add that next piece and the next?

And then what does that look like five years down

Steve: the road? Mhmm.

Chris: After I went to scale, I started looking for office space. I was gonna rent a rent a space, and, I went through several negotiations. I was really mad one day. I was driving home. I was just livid because I couldn't get a deal.

Like, I couldn't none of my stuff was working. And I saw this little for rent sign, in a office building that was, like, grown up. The the grass was really high. So I called the guy and ended up taking a tour. And as we're walking through the, the office, like, I'm noticing, like, stains on the ceiling, like, the roof is leaking, the carpet's shot.

And so I asked him I I had not thought this strategy through, but I asked him I said, what happens when the roof needs to be replaced? What happens when the carpet needs to be replaced?

Steve: And

Chris: he said, I guess I guess I would have to do that. I said, it doesn't sound like you're very happy about that. He's like, I'm not.

Steve: And I

Chris: was like, well, what if there was a way that I could pay you exactly what you're asking in rent, but you're not responsible for any repairs? Mhmm. He said, how do we do

Steve: that? Yeah.

Chris: So we we ended up buying an office building. He seller financed a 100% of it, and that's what got us into our location now.

Steve: That's awesome. How did it feel when you realized that real estate could be your career? Like, this is this is gonna work.

Chris: I felt that feeling in 15 when I was an agent, but it that feeling went away very quickly.

Steve: But,

Chris: yeah, that man, the feeling of getting that first deal was great, but the the fear of can I reproduce this?

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Can I turn this into consistency? So my approach initially was, let's treat this like a real job, and I have real quotas to meet. Now I don't answer to anybody Mhmm. Other than myself. So every month, k, you have to do one.

You do not quit. You do not go home. You do not eat dinner with your family. You do not go on vacation until you get your quota. So that's that's the way I did it.

And then it was two deals because I knew I was capable of two. And then it was three, and then it was four. And that's how we've that that's how I've held myself to this the standard and that, it's not just kinda going through the motions. Yeah. When a deal happens, it happens.

Okay. I made a $100. I'm good for the next three months. Man, that kinda inconsistency will you know? It it's not the way to to approach this

Steve: Absolutely. History. You know, going back, you're talking about that property you bought, seller finance. Here's a couple of keywords, what if. Yeah.

You said that you kinda just figured that out on the spot, or you heard this talking track before?

Chris: I was familiar with seller finance, but I had no plans walking through that that building to pitch it on the spot. But it hit me as we're walking through, especially the reaction I got when he said, I guess I'm gonna have to do it. And I was like, you don't sound very happy. He was like, nope. I knew right then, like, we have a shot at this.

And it took it took another meeting and us working through the numbers, Our down payment in that situation so that's the other thing. It's like, how do you work through the terms, the down payment? He wanted me to put up, I think $50. What we ended up doing is I, I guaranteed that I would make $50,000 of repairs to the building within the first twelve months

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: And that was the that was the down payment. So we had to renovate the building anyways.

Steve: But the only reason I was highlighting that is, like, my two favorite words, especially in creative, is what if What if we could what if we could do this? What what if we could do that? Right? And just it opens like, they're receptive to that versus, like, hey. Can you?

Will you? Right? Those are

Chris: I love the yeah. The we call them conditional or hypothetical. Mhmm. And it really takes the pressure off of, like I'm gonna throw a silly idea at you. Like, what if this

Steve: It's a place of conversation.

Chris: Absolutely. Like, hypothetically, if someone walked in off the street and said this to you, what like, how'd that make you feel or how would you react? We get a much more honest answer because it takes the pressure off. I'm not trying to negotiate

Steve: with you

Chris: right now. I'm we're brainstorming. This is a collaborative. Let's lay it all out on the table, and then we can pick what we like.

Steve: Right. Yeah. So two, I think those two of the most powerful words. I see it, especially in the creative world, but generally speaking, what if is, we we use it quite a bit in, negotiations for, like, repairs. Like, I don't know what we can do.

Like, what if we did this?

Chris: So powerful.

Steve: Yeah. And they're like, no. That sounds terrible. I was, yeah. Okay.

Alright. Let's come up with another idea. Yeah. Yeah. But we're not committed to anything.

So you went so you're doing 20 k a year in 2017, 3,000,000 last year Mhmm. In gross revenues. You're you did 83 houses last year, and you're on pace to do a 120 houses this year. Talk me through that. It's a lot of flips.

Right? You're you're doing, last year, you're doing about six or seven a month, and this year, you're gonna be doing 10 a month. Walk me through this evolution from wholesaling to flipping this many houses. Sure.

Chris: On the wholesaling side in Atlanta, I was netting, an average of $15 an assignment. It ranged anywhere from, like, 5 to 25, but on average, about 15.

Steve: Those are typical numbers.

Chris: Yeah. Absolutely. As we started advertising, the the cost per conversion or cost per deal, it was hovering around 5, but that started to creep up.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: You know, as, competition prices went up. So then it was $10,000, and it was bumping 15. I knew, you know, this is not sustainable. Alright. So as our cost went up, okay, I have to do either have to get two, three, four times the amount of deals out of out of the same amount of leads.

Like, how do I do that? But it hit me. Why not just take the deals we already have and make them three times more profitable?

Steve: Right.

Chris: How do we do that? The next logical step was wholesale. It's it's the same as wholesaling. We're just taking it to the MLS, the largest buyers list in the world. Mhmm.

And we figured out a formula that works. So it's predictable. At least in my market, it's predictable. We generally have an idea of what they will wholetail for. The only thing I had to figure out was how do I actually take down this deal?

Whose money do I use? Do I use my money?

Steve: It's

Chris: scratching us thin. Right? Mhmm. Do we go get a private loan? Do we take it down sub two?

What do we do? So the the first one we ever did was sub two.

Steve: Yeah. So, really, it wasn't necessarily, like, let's become this major flipper.

Chris: No. That wasn't the desire.

Steve: Yeah. So the first thing was, how do we just get a little bit more added a little more juice out of this? And getting more juice out of it really was just listed in the MLS, which isn't really rocket science. But for whatever reason, that's not the most common exit strategy.

Chris: I don't know why. It is it's it's just, it's pouring rocket fuel on wholesaling. That's all it is. Is there an extra step there? Is there a little more complication risk?

Sure. But if you're wasting your time with trash deals, like, you're missing the point anyway. So if you're doing good deals, why would you not make as as much as you can? Sure.

Steve: So, so first, we need to sub two. So you convince the seller to allow you to list it while they're while you're making payments for them. What do you do right now? Right? I mean, doing 120 deals, what are you doing right now to fund all these deals?

Chris: It's taken time, and the advertising that we're spending, it takes a lot of capital, but it's been a slow roll. Mhmm. We take the the profit we make, and we we budget as we add another lead source or strategy.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: So, no, you can't go from zero to a 100. I don't think you know, the house has to be built. The foundation has to be built. It does take time.

Steve: Right. But, well, how are you funding it right now? With cash. Who's cash?

Chris: My cash.

Steve: Your cash.

Chris: You don't have a problem. Houses or advertising?

Steve: The the wholetails.

Chris: The wholetails. The majority is private money.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: So it's hard money, but it's not institutional hard money. We're not I'm not going to, the the guys that advertise. Right? The guys that do this for a living. These are relationships that I built through, friends and and my network.

Mhmm. I've been able to to do some of this through some of the, like, bourbon groups in Atlanta. There's, kind of a a group of guys that, buy nice bottles of bourbon, collectible stuff, and I kinda fig figured out, like, this is a a natural transition, you know, or it gets me in front of a lot of people that, I can have a conversation with. Right. So we built out a a network of private lenders, and we exclusively use that.

I fund the the actual renovations with cash and, then obviously all of our operations and stuff. We're not taking loans out on that stuff.

Steve: What kind of terms are you getting in borrowing from the from the Bourbon Club?

Chris: Anywhere on the low end, 8%. I think our highest is, we've averaged it down to 10, so eight to 10 right now. Yeah. Gotcha. Every new lender we take on is a lower interest rate.

Steve: Right.

Chris: So what I've what I've done here's how I've solved this problem. Here's the problem that working with private individuals Mhmm. That that presents itself is you have a new opportunity and a new lender with x amount of cash. Right? Let's say you get a better rate.

When you're tempted to go back to the guy that you first started loans with and say, well, he's giving me 8%. How about you do this? Right? That creates animosity. So what I've what I've guaranteed is when you come on as a lender, I will never come back and renegotiate with you.

I will never ask you to, for a for a lower rate.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Now I'm not gonna I cannot guarantee, however, that we work together for forever. But for as long as we work together, the rate is the rate. Mhmm. On the flip side, I will never take on a new lender that's not lower than the previous one.

Steve: Right.

Chris: So and that's the to this point, it's worked.

Steve: Mhmm. I'm

Chris: sure there's a flaw in the system, and we'll have to to pivot at some point.

Steve: I think it it sounds like a great system. Right? Because, like, hey. We're not gonna come back and renegotiate. It's just we might not call you anymore.

Chris: Right.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. So for someone that's listening right now who's looking to get, you know, private money on maybe their first holes wholesale deal. Right? Like, they're wholesaling right now.

Let's start wholetailing. What advice would you give someone not doing what you've done now on how to get their first or second, private money lender?

Chris: Think through, your your network. There is a risk. Like, I I hesitate to say go to friends and family because if like, we have a tremendous responsibility. When you're when you're touching other people's money, this is no joke. This is no guess.

This is no best case. It's not it it should not be speculation.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: So there's a tremendous responsibility whether you know the person or not, but it does add a layer of complication if things go south, if this is a friend or a family member. So be prepared. You have to know the weight of what you're getting yourself into, and you better know your deal. You know? You better know what you what you're getting into it for and and getting out of it.

But with that being said, I would start with with friends and family. I would very much advise against doing JV deals with, lenders. So the I hear this all the time. Someone says, well, he's willing to put up the money. We're gonna go $50.50 into this thing.

Do not do it. It's not it is, you can get money for for less than that. It it gets things off to the wrong, things off on the wrong foot.

Steve: Yeah.

Chris: I would not go down that road, but money is out there. And don't be, don't be afraid to have these conversations. And also don't be afraid to tell people, hey. This is the first time I've done this. Here are the things that can go wrong.

You know? Don't Same

Steve: thing as when you're raising capital. Yeah. Here's a list of all the things that can go wrong. Yeah. So you and I definitely disagree on this one particular point Okay.

On the $50.50 deal.

Chris: Okay.

Steve: Right? Yeah. And only reason why I say this is, like, if you're starting brand new and you have no credibility, money should be more expensive.

Chris: Okay.

Steve: Right? And be very first to

Steve: like, I would never call someone.

Steve: It's like, hey. I got a deal. I'm gonna do $50.50. That makes no sense in my world right now. Okay.

But my first year, I was doing $50.50. Okay. Right? So money was more expensive. But now when it's like, hey.

Should I do this deal with Steve? Why don't you call these other people? They seem to be pretty happy with it. Right? Sure.

So it's just building that credibility, building that confidence. I'm not saying this is the right way to go. It's something we've suggested in the past because when you're starting brand new, it should cost more to borrow.

Chris: I think it's an easy enough problem to solve. Mhmm. Here's my rationale behind it is you're never you you've just hammered the first nail into the coffin of that relationship.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: It's it's starting to end before it's even begun.

Steve: Right.

Chris: Now you can if you would if you take the the, the interest rate approach Mhmm. Right, that can maybe be adjusted. But once that lender, like, has a piece of the deal Mhmm. I I feel like it opens them up to suggestions or now they're they're asking you, hey. Where's this contract?

Where's this? I

Steve: was very clear when I was like Yeah. You're only the money.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. Only I mean, those are those are those are, relationships I had. They were already close relationships. And like you, I started on the realtor side before I got into the wholesaling side or the wholetailing side. Mhmm.

I was like, here's what we're doing, and I need some money, but you're only the money.

Chris: Here's the beauty of real estate. There's a million ways to to slice this thing.

Steve: Oh, yeah.

Chris: And so what's worked for me isn't gonna work for everybody. No one has to do it the exact same way. So I'm not saying, like, my way is a 100% right. It's the way that makes sense to me, but I love that other people do it different ways, and it's worked out for you too, man. So, dude, that's great.

Steve: Yep. So then, you were door knocking, and then this whole thing happened in 2020. So how'd you pivot door knocking in 2020?

Chris: We shut down. I mean, we really shut down the business. It went to zero overnight.

Steve: So you went so describe for me. Right? So in 2019, what was 2019 like before you had to shut down shut it down in 2020?

Chris: Half a million.

Steve: So half a million? Mhmm. COVID comes around. Mhmm. And you just say, alright.

We're shutting everything down.

Chris: We had started doing flips at that point. I had a handful of flips, and I was, I think we had four, maybe five projects going on at that moment. I was really terrified that I was going to, obviously, not make money on these, but I was very worried that I was going to lose other people's money. Mhmm. And, we rushed those flips.

I sold those properties. Like, normally, we would give it a period of time on market. Like, we did everything we could to get out of those as fast as possible. So. I was so convinced the market was going to zero.

Steve: Very rational conclusion. Yeah. Exact opposite, Kurt.

Chris: I know. Right? So I was sitting on the sidelines, like, waiting for the sky to fall. It never fell.

Steve: Well, it did. It just took a few years.

Chris: Right. Yeah. So, yeah, we sat on the sidelines, and and a lot of what we were doing were, were foreclosures, and those dried up. That wasn't everything, but it was a it was a fair amount.

Steve: Yeah. Foreclosures definitely dried up.

Chris: Overnight overnight. And the money that we were spending on marketing, yeah, man. I got scared. I I stopped all marketing. I stopped spending because I I was just I thought, okay.

We had x amount of cash to get us through whatever this looks like

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: And we went into survival mode. So we sat from March until June until I could not take it anymore. Mhmm. And I said, okay. We're getting back into this.

I'd worked with a previous, like, SEO, digital marketing company before paying a monthly rate. We shut that down, but I learned in June how to do some of that myself and run a PPC campaign and started spending dollars again in June, ramped up all the way through September. We still ended up closing out, 2020 at half 1,000,000 or closer to 600,000.

Steve: So it

Chris: wasn't a bad year, but it was still, like, a a stagnant year minus four months.

Steve: We took a pause. We need to restart. Yeah. Yeah. So, is that something that you're really focused on now then, digital marketing?

Chris: A 100%.

Steve: Okay.

Chris: It it showed me the some of the flaws of the type of operation I was running. So everything depended on me to do it all. So

Steve: the only door knocker.

Chris: I was it. I was the only person doing everything. So I'm managing our our flips. I wasn't swinging a hammer or anything. I had a contractor.

But managing that, I'm doing our marketing. I'm making every call. I'm knocking a door. I'm negotiating. Like, all of it was on me.

So if I stop doing something, right, then the business goes to zero.

Steve: Or if we stop

Chris: stops. Man, it stopped hard. It it stopped so fast. So that's I I learned, okay. I need to diversify a little bit.

I need multiple, streams of leads. I cannot count on one source or two sources, and I've got to scale this thing to where if I'm if I'm gone for a month, whatever that looks like, the business continues to operate.

Steve: So prior to that, you couldn't even take a vacation?

Chris: No. We did, but I that was the stop and start. It's a it was a trade off, and it was inefficient.

Steve: Yeah. Those those vacations are really expensive when they continue.

Chris: Every time you leave, guess what? You get a call, like, now they're ready to, you know, to sign a contract. Every time we left, I knew that I was gonna get a deal.

Steve: It's it's like without fail. You get on the airplane. Right before you get on the airplane, hey. I'm ready to go now. It's like, now.

Of course. Of

Chris: course. Yeah.

Steve: Okay. So, talk to me. Like, is it is digital marketing, like, a majority of your business now, or what's that looking like?

Chris: It's a healthy chunk. We spend 85,000 a month in advertising. Mhmm. That's split between radio, TV, and digital marketing.

Steve: Got it. TV, this is like, major networks. Mhmm. What's your brand for that? What do you mean?

Like, is it maximum cash home buyers?

Chris: Yeah. Same brand.

Steve: Chris Burrow? Like, what do you what what is the persona you're pushing is my question.

Chris: Everything is maximum cash home buyers, but it is the feel of all of our ads is that local type feel. So we're not trying to replicate a Open Door or a a Marksbane where it is a polished product. It feels local, and it feels like that on purpose. So I'm doing the reeds. Like, our our, radio commercials, you're gonna hear me say baloney, malarkey, mumbo jumbo, all sorts of cheesy, stupid stuff, and it's a dry reed.

Like, it it feels, mom and pop on on purpose. Mhmm. And it tends to eliminate your retail ready a plus properties where there's no motivation. I don't want those calls.

Steve: Alright.

Chris: I want you guys to call. Yeah. Please call Mark Spain. Mhmm. Do not call me.

Right? We have solutions for those now too, but I want your more motivated Mhmm. Sellers. Right? So I feel like I'm able to speak directly to that person.

It doesn't have to be polished. These are not polished situations. Yeah. And it works.

Steve: Who are you using for, digital marketing?

Chris: Brandon Bateman.

Steve: Bateman Collective.

Chris: Yeah. Bateman Collective. I love those guys. I've been with them since, the '21. Yeah.

Brandon is a legit stand up dude, and I fully endorse him in their their company.

Steve: Yeah. Brandon's a genius. It's I always enjoy talking to him because it's he gets it.

Chris: He really does. Yeah. He cares, man. There's a lot of other, you know, people or, like, vendors that, you know, they do a good job, but I don't feel like they care. Like, Brandon really cares about his clients.

Mhmm. And I can say, like, you ask him a hard question or if there's bad news, like, he's gonna stand up and tell you, like, the bad news. He's not gonna shy away from a tough conversation. I really appreciate that about it.

Steve: Yeah. Absolutely. And then you also buy a lot of sub twos. Mhmm. Talk to me about that.

Chris: Yeah. That was the the very first house we purchased, was sub two. It's a strategy that we, you know, we've gotten better at. We've learned. We've learned how to pitch that.

We've learned what situations it's useful in useful in. It's not useful in every situation. So if your purchase price is 300 and they owe a 100, you know, on the house and your purchase price is $2.50, like, okay. And now you're coming out of pocket a 150. What's the point?

Steve: Right.

Chris: So we've gotten better at it. It's a tool just like any other tool, and it's not all that scary. There's a tremendous amount of responsibility that comes with it.

Steve: So talk to me about that because no one really talks about the responsibility component. They talk about, like, how you can buy all these properties and get a tax write off. Yeah. What are the responsibilities?

Chris: My understanding is if you're if you were committing to making this payment and you have a oopsie daisy Mhmm. And you forget to make a payment, it's not like, okay. You forgot to pay your mortgage. Like, you've committed fraud, maybe unintentionally, but you've you've made a legal commitment to make a payment, and you didn't do it. Mhmm.

That's a big deal. So I think they're they're really I I really wish the the people teaching sub two would teach this component also. Mhmm. I just don't hear it enough is about the tremendous amount of responsibility. There will be more legislation.

There will be more, restrictions and oversight, the more people, you know, abuse this

Steve: Yeah.

Chris: Or just are are not responsible with it.

Steve: And then are these are you buying these all from your own marketing, or are you buying these from other, wholesalers in your market as well?

Chris: I don't buy a lot from other wholesalers. 98% of what we do comes from our marketing.

Steve: Why do you think that that is, that you don't buy as much from from your your peers?

Chris: I've struggled to hire the right relationship manager

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: The person that fields those those opportunities. We do get a lot of calls, but they man, there's a there's such a, an influx of, I don't wanna call them junk deals, but, man, there's just a lot of I don't know if it's our market, but 95% of the deals that we get presented from wholesalers are, they're not they're not deals.

Steve: Yeah. The so Jamil is a good friend. Right? The Blue Genie.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Right? Yeah. And one of the things he says is, like, the hardest thing in his experience, which makes sense because he's a joint venture guy, is getting wholesalers to learn how to comp correctly. Yeah. Right?

I think, what what is it? There's a term for it. It's not happy ears. You know, when you're selling, you get happy years. But, people that own homes are generally overly optimistic about the value of the home.

Mhmm. I think wholesalers have a vested interest in believing the property is worth more, especially if they bought it wrong. Right. Right? And so, like, we've gone back and forth in our own organization multiple times.

Like, we've got this reach. Why don't we just, like, JV all these deals? And then we start JVing all these deals. Like, a lot of underwriting. Sure.

A lot of underwriting. And do we get deals from it? Absolutely. Is it worthwhile? I don't know.

Mhmm. Right? And we kinda go back and forth on it. So that's why I'm asking because I know, like, Gino, diploma is in your market, obviously. Right?

And we we've gone back and forth. Like, should he should he do do TV or not? Right? And I was like and my argument was, just by being on TV, you should just get way more opportunities. Mhmm.

Right? But in your experience, unfortunately, it sounds like you're getting the same issue on TV as I have had on Instagram where underwriting is a challenge.

Chris: Right. Yeah. We the the more, like, shotgun marketing we do, not highly targeted online. Yeah. We get lots of calls from agents and wholesalers.

And it's been a a part of the business that I've struggled with because I know other people that do the volume that we do have a successful relationship manager, and they're able to kinda wrangle all of these opportunities. And then also coach on top of that Mhmm. And help a wholesaler get better Yeah. Or help an agent, you know, renegotiate a price. So that's a work in progress for me.

I can't sit here and say, hey. I figured it out because I haven't. Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: Well, when we first started, right, you were saying there were a couple of mentors. Jeremy Bill, I think, is what you said his name was. And he spent a lot of time helping you. You're hoping to repay that back in the future.

Chris: Yeah. Absolutely.

Steve: Is this an opportunity here Yeah. Where you repay that back in the future, or is it just maybe you're not the relationship guy, and you're saying you need to bring in the relationship guy?

Chris: Yeah. In July, we have a list of wholesalers and agents that have reached out to us in our local market. Our office is, is a really great resource. It's a great location in Atlanta. Mhmm.

We're gonna host a investor meetup and, start kind of, our own group. So I'll be, leading that. We'll do that once a month. We've also partnered with, the local there's a college there, KSU.

Steve: Mhmm. KSU?

Chris: Yep. Kennesaw State University. Okay. They have a really large real estate, like, subchapter, like, real estate group. We're gonna be hosting some of their real estate club, meetups and also speaking in the fall there.

So, I'm excited about, you know, having a chance to kinda, give back or share, you know, even if it's a little bit of what I know that maybe helps somebody else.

Steve: Yeah. I know there's a guy out there as well, I believe in Atlanta, who, one of his specialties was interns from the local university.

Chris: Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: I don't remember which university.

Steve: We finally launched a sales community. For the longest time, people have been asking me, when are you gonna launch a general sales training program? You see, we've only been doing real estate sales training for the longest time, and we couldn't quite quite figure out how to do a general sales training program until very recently. So outside of real estate sales, we also have car sales, auto sales, insurance sales, all sorts of different industries. And you wanna check it out, the link to the Discord is in the description below.

Now, if you've been following my journey, you're aware that I've been really geeking out in sales for the last five years. I've had the great pleasure of teaching the best house buyers across the country the intricacies of sales. So you could say I'm pretty passionate about it. And very recently, I found another person who is equally geeked out and super qualified to teach sales. And the

Steve: reason why I say that

Steve: is he's already had a tremendous career within sales. And, again, he knows sales better than anybody else I know. Together with Ian Ross, our goal is to create a platform where the entire sales community can learn, grow, and improve together. We figured out some time ago that you can learn from an instructor, but it's just as effective effective to learn from your peers. So within this platform, we're gonna have courses, training, and all other sorts of live calls.

But again, you get to learn from your colleagues. For $97 a month, you're not only gonna have access to great sales trainers, you're also gonna have access to all of our previous courses, which means over $5,000 in value, as well as first premium access to all future products we're gonna record for free so long as you're a member inside of our community. So whether, again, you're in car sales, insurance sales, solar sales, or any other sales industry, find your community of other salespeople and grow your sales, grow yourself, and grow your business. Sign up now.

Steve: It was one of those.

Chris: It's a great idea.

Steve: Okay. So at some point, you made a conscious decision. I know we touched on it a little bit, but the conscious decision to stop wholesaling and focus predominantly on hotel rehabbing innovations. So hotel, we already talked about. Why not just get a little bit more out of it if you had the if you have access to capital, which, something that Chris Root, we were talking about earlier.

One of the things I love what about what he says is we always have to be sourcing three things, motivated sellers, buyers, and money.

Chris: There you go.

Steve: Right? And we're sourcing money. We can wholetail. Right. Right?

Rehabs. We haven't really spent a lot of time re talking about rehabs. So talk to me about this journey to rehabbing now.

Chris: Sure. You get to the point if you're as your deal flow increases that, you get really tempted. You see something that just doesn't need a lot of work. Right? And that's the natural transition into rehabbing.

Mhmm. The first year, I worked with two or three different contractors, horrible experience. I mean, the same thing that other people go through, until I met my contractor. And at the time, he was just painting. As we did more work and I would have, like, a plumber, not show up for a job, he'd volunteer.

He'd say, hey. I can do the toilets. Mhmm. Like, do you know how to do the toilets? No.

But I'm gonna learn. Mhmm. So it was that trust of, like, we gave him more opportunity. He was willing to to learn and so he's learned all these different aspects. And so we grew in volume, he grew in in skill and what he was able to do, but that relationship really started with with respect.

I I think a lot of people that do rehabs, potentially the reason that they struggle with contractors is you are not showing respect. Right? Mhmm. And you any any chance you have, like, jobs with, like, manual labor, it's just easy to kinda write off those, positions or whatever, just not really appreciate. And I I really, I've gotten to know our contractor, gotten to know his family.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: We try to help take care of his crew, make sure they feel special. Like, I think it's really important, and it's grown that, like, trust. There's times that I need a favor, and he'll jump right in and vice versa, man. So it's if there's one thing I've gotten right, it's been that relationship.

Steve: Sure. How do you compensate him on your on your rehabs?

Chris: We used to negotiate every single house separately. So how much is flooring? Well, I, you know, I think it's about this. I'm like, well, I'm I was thinking this. Well, how much is the paint?

I was thinking this. Man, you cannot do that to scale. Three years ago, I had a conversation that said, we have to standardize pricing Mhmm. So that we do not have to beat each other up every house. It's gonna it's going to strain our relationships.

So we did we agreed on a price per square foot for flooring, a price per square foot for paint, an individual price, every ceiling fan that goes in is the exact same price. That is standard across the board. So when I give a house, I do not have to tell what to do. The the paint is standard, the flooring standard, everything that goes in is is the same product, and he doesn't have to ask questions. We don't have to follow-up.

He gives that house back ready to go. Yeah. So standardizing that process is really, really key. It takes some time to to do that, but it's, between the pricing and between the product. Mhmm.

Another mistake I see people do is, like, they try to do too much custom stuff, man. Yeah. They try whether the house, like, calls for custom, but, like, they want everything to be different. Well, on this one, we're gonna do this backsplash. Like, that's so much time, effort, and energy.

Is that giving you a return

Steve: for

Chris: how much you're investing into that?

Steve: Doubtful. It's probably more of like a feels good situation.

Chris: That is exact it's it's only to make you feel better

Steve: Yeah.

Chris: About about this. It does not add up on the dollars and cents.

Steve: Difference between, I think, playing, blackjack and the slot machine. You're losing either way. Right. But one of them, it feels like you have some sort of control of the outcome. Right.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. That's cool. Okay. So, you know, you're talking about building this relationship with them. I'm curious.

A lot of the guys that we take, you know, when we when we start off, we're bringing in less certified. Right? We're bringing in someone that is willing to do work cheaper. And then we ask them to bear more responsibility. And you're talking about building this relationship with them.

So are you helping him with leadership skills? Are you helping him with time management? Are you helping him with communication? And and, you know, all these other things are important because I think that contractors get a bad rep in many ways. Like, some wholesalers get a bad rep and realtors get a bad rep.

But I think a lot of contractors, they get caught up if they've been focused on price in that they don't necessarily know how to run a business, which is very different than construction. So when you're talking about building this relationship with them, did you have these kinds of conversations with them?

Chris: Yeah. There's constant struggles, but because our relationship is solid, if, like, when we've had the struggles, we've been able to have an honest conversation and work work through them because it's it's really based on trust, and we both want the best for each other. Yeah. I really feel like does that help answer?

Steve: Well, I mean, as far as, like, coaching him up. Right? Because when you first worked with him, he was a painter.

Chris: Right.

Steve: Right? He wasn't a general contractor. I'm not sure like, I think he still need to be licensed, bought, and insured to be a painter officially. Whether that happens or not is a whole another question. But you have to you've been trained in one trade, and now you gotta add all these other trades, right, to have the whole, you know, what's the one I'm looking for?

Collection. Right? So to have painting, plumbing, electrical, HVAC certified, roofing certified, like, there's a whole bunch of different certifications to get there. Yeah. Are you working with him on top of doing all these different trades and how to effectively manage and be an effective super on all these properties?

Chris: On the organization side, processes, systems and processes, our COO I'm not a systems and process guy, and I I, really struggle in that area. Our COO, He's worked with us for three months, so he's three months in. We've made tremendous progress. Part of the thing that we're working on right now is, implementing, better systems for the project management side and what that looks like. As far as helping our contractor, manage his crew, he's generally really good at that.

We don't have to intervene on, a lot of that. That's he's, he runs a pretty tight ship, and we don't have to I I don't have to micromanage, which is really a, you know, a a blessing. Yeah. But on the organization side, yeah, there's been several things us figuring out, well, we've gotta buy flooring and we're buying, you know, 20 or 30,000 square feet at a time. Like, where does that where is that stored?

Mhmm. How do we inventory? Those are the things that we've had to figure out Yeah. Is, okay, how do we get a a a warehouse, a a supplier that will let us store this and check it out, you know, house by house? Those are the things that are the that's the thorn in my side of

Steve: Alright.

Chris: As we scale, those kind of things are are tough.

Steve: So one of the things that you also talked about, before was growing up extremely poor. So what tell me tell me more about that.

Chris: We were broke as a joke, man. Yeah. Yeah. Not a lot of money, and, and I was very aware of that. It was not it it was not a a surprise.

So there were, there were moments I knew if if I wanted something, I would have to to go get it. Mhmm. So is that grabbing a rake and walking around and raking people's yards for any amount of money that they would give or going and washing cars. If I wanted to anything I wanted, I knew I had to go get for myself.

Steve: How old were you?

Chris: I mean, that was the that was my entire

Steve: childhood. I know. Were you, like, five years old, eight years old? I think

Chris: nine, 10 is when, probably first memory of doing something like that was, selling Krispy Kreme donuts door to door. Mhmm. You know? That

Steve: that sounds like that should be an easy sell.

Chris: Yeah. It was. It was an easy sell. You mark it up a couple of dollars. Yeah.

Yeah. I can't remember what I was raising money for, but it got me on a a trip to something or somewhere. Yeah. But, yeah, it's, it, I think helped build that independence

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Maybe, you know, maybe in a negative way. So one of the one of my challenges, right, in raising my kids is figuring out, like, is the the reason I am the way I am is because I had nothing, and I knew I'd have to fight for everything. So if I provide to them everything I didn't have, am I taking you know, am I sabotaging them Yeah. Their their future? And I don't have the answer for that.

I'm you know? We're we're trying and figuring out ways to, you know, not spoil them.

Steve: How many kids do you have?

Chris: I've got two.

Steve: Two kids. Yeah. How old are they?

Chris: They are nine and 10.

Steve: Yeah. So mine are 12, 10, and six. Okay. And so I got the same struggles. Right?

Because we grew up poor. Didn't know we were poor. Right? I knew we weren't rich. Mhmm.

Right? I didn't know we I didn't know how poor we were until we went to this other guy's house was who owned the biggest hard money lending in in Phoenix at the time. Mhmm. Didn't know this. Right?

Because as an eight year old, you don't know any of these things. Right? And we're asking my dad, like, how come their guest house is bigger than their house? Right? So this is when you start figuring figuring out.

It's like, oh, like, man, we're not doing so great. Yeah. But, yeah, I do I know I'm wired in a certain way, programmed a certain way because we were poor. But at the same time, like, how do we make sure they have that same hunger?

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: So the words, we used to lie to our kids and say we were poor. Right? But it's not true. Right. So now what kind of precedent are we saying are are we setting?

Right? So now the words we use is not in our budget. Mhmm. Right? Like, we it's we don't have money set aside for that.

Chris: That makes sense.

Steve: So now it's not like we can't afford it. It's just it's not in the budget. What they don't realize is that nothing is in the budget. Right? Right.

So, mom and dad used to tell us, like, we were poor. Right? It's that we can't afford it. That's just a fact. There's no arguing that.

Yeah. Now it's just not in the budget. Like, you know, what's in the budget? Like, well, you know, we'll have to figure that out later on.

Chris: Right.

Steve: But it's not in the budget. I I know we had, had a very passionate, heated conversation. I remember at Roadrunner Sports. This is just a couple of years ago. Maybe three years ago.

Right? And, I was we were there. It was before school. So my wife, myself, my three daughters, and, you know, the kids try on the shoes. And so whatever the shoe sizes are, she decides we're getting a larger size.

Right? If you're

Chris: new can grow into it. Right?

Steve: They can grow into it.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Right? And you talk about, you know, nature versus nurture. How much are we programmed from our circumstances? How much are we just wired this way? Mhmm.

I remember telling her, I was like, I made the decision when I was a kid. Right? Because I'm tired of wearing shoes that are too big.

Chris: Right.

Steve: That when I have kids Mhmm. They're we're gonna buy shoes that fit.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Right? And I remember, like, saying this to myself as a kid. I don't know I don't know how old I was.

Chris: That's so funny that you remember that.

Steve: Right? Yeah. So then we get into the situation here and, like, you know, now it's on the line. And my wife's like, well, we wanna buy bigger shoes. Like, no.

We're not. We're buying shoes that fit. Like, this is, like, a traumatic situation for me. We're buying shoes that fit.

Chris: Meant a lot to you, man.

Steve: It did. Yeah. Right? And so the compromise, right, after, like, some feelings were hurt was, alright. We're gonna buy shoes that fit.

And if you wanna buy shoes that are bigger, that's up to you, and we did.

Chris: Okay. There's

Steve: about two sets of shoes.

Chris: There you go.

Steve: Right? So but, yeah, it it's a struggle because, like, how much again, going back to programming nature versus nurture, how much because I've I believe, right, in our conversation so far, you're a hustler. Right? Why else would you do door to door sales? Why else would you buy a list and knock on 389 doors?

You're driven a certain way. So I think, you know, could the the requirement to go pick up a rake and and and and sell Krispy Kreme door to door, have maybe etched this this this, groove in your brain a little harder? Probably. But you probably also were a little independent. I mean, I don't know if we asked your parents, would they have said you're pretty strong headed as a kid?

Chris: I don't know. I'm not sure. I'm not sure what they would say.

Steve: Yeah. So but it's it is it is is a challenge right for all of us. As as business owners, a lot of us become a lot of us don't start with a lot of them. I think, you know, we're, like, 300 plus episodes into real estate distributors. Yeah.

And there's only one guy that was born with money. Right? Like, everyone else had to earn it. There you go. Right?

And so I think, you know, how much do you have to to fight for and how much is it because of as a function of your That's

Chris: so crazy. Out of 300, one person was born with money.

Steve: One person's like, yeah. I never struggled for anything. I just I decided I wanna get an old sell and mom helped. Wow. Yeah.

It's like, okay. Great. Good story. Yeah. We're supposed to have a challenge here as part as part of the podcast.

Yeah. Yeah. So, now going to your business now, right, because you've talked about you learn a lot of lessons in CL. What does your business look like now versus when you first started?

Chris: We we have five acquisition managers.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: We have a couple of lead managers that answer, phone calls. I'm focused entirely on inbound. So we do not do any cold calling, texting. We we don't do any any outbound, sales. Everything is inbound.

Mhmm.

Steve: I

Chris: would my rationale there is it takes time and money to manage a cold call center or, that anyways. I would rather spend the money and save the time and the management. I'm not saying the other is wrong. It's just not for me.

Steve: Alright. We have

Chris: a COO. We have a operations manager. We have an in house, dispo manager that's also our our real estate agent. He lists all of our properties, project manager, and then the contractor, and he runs, three or four crews.

Steve: Got it. You said you're licensed. Mhmm. Yep. Who are you licensed with?

Chris: Licensed with, virtual properties.

Steve: Virtual properties. So one thing that Mhmm. You know, as we gain influence and reach is being in a MLM just makes total sense. Have you considered this route?

Chris: Being in a MLM?

Steve: So I'm at Real. Okay. Right? Yeah. So there's eXp.

I think they were the first major MLM

Chris: Right. Brokerage.

Steve: Yeah. Right? I had my own brokerage, and we had over a 100 realtors. Okay. And what I realized was on top of that, like, not enjoying having multiple clients that treat you like you're an employee Yeah.

I also realized having a bunch of realtors that I was accountable for was also not great. Right. Right? So we shut down the brokerage. Okay.

But, you know, part of shutting down that brokerage is we decided, well, let's just move everyone over to an MLM so they get a revenue share. Mhmm. And so it's not as profitable as having a brokerage was. Mhmm. But we save a lot of time.

Right? And there's I no longer have to take any calls from any realtors complaining about one of my realtors or having to go to an ethics hearing.

Chris: Right.

Steve: Right? So now that you're doing that, but I guess my my question for you is how come you haven't looked at MLM seeing as how you're growing your influence inside your city?

Chris: I don't think it's the right timing for it. I'm not sure. It's not something I put a lot of thought into. So Right. Yeah.

I'd be happy it's something I'd be happy to explore.

Steve: Yeah. What freedom does real estate afford you?

Chris: Ultimate freedom. But it's a it's a fight to get there. I'm motivated by freedom, so financial freedom. Yeah. Freedom in my schedule.

But to to get to that, man and there's a lot of work that goes into freedom. Right?

Steve: Right.

Chris: And putting the the the pieces in place so that, you know, I I don't just have a glorified job. I actually am a a business owner. And that's a that's easier said than done. It is so hard to scale and run and manage a business. It is the it is so much harder than just getting into, into wholesaling.

I did not have a healthy respect for, people that that manage or or leaders or that run businesses, and it is challenging me tremendously.

Steve: Yeah. How has it been challenging you?

Chris: It's been challenging me to grow personally. I can't walk into a a Monday morning meeting. Our our first, like, fifteen to twenty minutes of that is me, sharing something that I've learned over the last week or a a bit of insight or sharing, you know, a story and applying that to, you know, some kinda motivation or inspiration. Mhmm. And I can't do that if I'm not feeding myself with new ideas, new new information, if I'm not putting the work in, in, leading an inspired life, Jim Rohn says, you know, are you who are you kidding walking in, asking people to, you know, organize, their the business or do this if you haven't even organized your garage.

Right? So there's a tremendous amount of pressure on me to take care of, myself. So I mean, like, from what I'm doing on a daily basis, my learning, my health, everything. And as I get better in these these areas, our business continues to grow, and I feel like those two things are connected.

Steve: Yeah. And you mentioned before that you've lost a lot of weight. Yeah. So what prompted that, and what have you what have you accomplished?

Chris: Well, honestly, I was tired of being a fat ass. That's number one. That's what prompted it. Yeah. But, it's it's not been a it's not been an overnight thing.

It is a it's it's been a struggle. In at the beginning of '21, I started losing a little bit of weight, but I went in to scale with Cody Hofhein. And I went in. I was a little bit arrogant. I was smug, and I was super proud of, you know, making half 1,000,000.

And I walked in there, like, I I knew I needed to learn some stuff, but, man, I just I did I was not in the right mindset, and Cody sniffed that out immediately, man. So Cody Cody pulled me to the side. He didn't do this in front of anybody else. He said, man, I love that you're successful. I love that you're doing what you what you do, but just by looking at you, I wouldn't be able to tell.

Like, I would never guess that you're a business owner. And he said, act like you belong here. And and what that meant to me was, dude, you are capable of so much more. You have not arrived, Chris. Stop.

Like, there you have more potential. And he gave me a book. He gave me, Leading an Inspired Life. Mhmm. And that book, mentions how how tall will a tree grow to be?

Well, as tall as it can. Right? So that was a challenge to me of, dude, you haven't arrived. Do you have the potential to be better, to be more? Absolutely.

So let's let's get after it. Let's do it. So, yeah, I kinda shifted, my focus. And most recently, like, it so it's not just been, okay, I can do it. It's been a little bit at a time.

Back in October '22, I was just struggling to, to work out consistently every day. Mhmm. And one day I had a a wave of clarity that said, okay. So if you struggle to do it, stop letting it be in your control. So I hired a personal trainer to come to my house.

I don't have to show up to a gym because guess what? That's in my control. I'm just not gonna do it. So I have a trainer that comes to my house at 7AM, five days a week to kick my ass. When I signed up, they said, do you wanna do three months, four months?

I said, what's the longest what's the longest contract I can sign? Yeah. They said a year, but we don't recommend it. Absolutely. I'm prepaying.

I'm not getting this money back. Yeah. And that's what we did. That's awesome. Recently, I just hired a, a nutritionist because, man, I struggle.

I love eating. I love drinking. And, I need someone that's not afraid to tell me and not afraid to yell at me. Mhmm. So that's been over the last, like, two and a half months.

Steve: Right. Yeah. I put, so we had a I don't know what's the word we're looking for. Commitment. Right?

Like, I posted something on Facebook last week, maybe this week. Like, how you talk to yourself matters. Right? So instead of saying I'm trying to get down on one ninety, I'm now saying, I'm training to get down to one ninety, and your attitude's different.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: Right? If I'm training to versus I'm trying to. And another thing I was, you know, every we treat, like, every decision is like an in like an independent decision. Right? If I eat this doughnut, like, what?

Yeah. You know? But it's just a single event. Right? But Yep.

You know, now I got, you know, Cole Taylor in my ear, and it's like, every decision you make is a vote towards your effective self or your ineffective self. That's powerful. So now every decision is a factor in your long term decision or your long term desires. So I put this little post about this. Benmont, a friend of mine who works for, Eric Brewer, he's like, hey.

Let's make a dashboard about this. It's like, that sounds totally nerdy. Like, what the heck are you talking about? Yeah. So I had a text message from him.

He's like, we made a Pluckto board. Yeah. So now it's on a Pluckto board. Yep. So now somehow I committed myself with this one ninety thing.

I was like, I was just sharing some

Chris: That's awesome.

Steve: Some lessons.

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: And now my wife's giving me that dashboard for the world to see.

Chris: Man, Eric and Bin Lott, those are great guys. Yeah. I do some coaching with Eric. Yeah. I've had a conversation with Binmont.

He helped us with some Plecto stuff also. Yeah. That's funny.

Steve: Just just straight oh, yeah. Here's here's here's the link. Thank you. What is your why?

Chris: What is my why? Freedom.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: Yeah. I, are you familiar with the Enneagram?

Steve: Yes.

Chris: So I'm an eight. I'm a challenger.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: And part of that that main internal motivation is to not be controlled by anyone or anything. So I I feel like my why is overall freedom, like financial freedom, but also the freedom to help people when when I want to. More specifically, obviously, I I mean my family, my kids, and creating that that generational wealth and providing opportunities that I never had. But, yeah, man, ultimately, freedom to do what I wanna do and and love to do.

Steve: How good are you at Enneagram?

Chris: Not as good as my wife. I know a little bit.

Steve: Okay. So I think if I when I took it, I'm a three. That's the strongest, but I think I was I think I was an eight right behind that.

Chris: So you're you're goal oriented. Right? Mhmm.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. So it's interesting because my wife's like, hey. We should take the Enneagram. I was like, this just looks stupid.

Right?

Chris: That's what I thought at first too.

Steve: This doesn't look very scientific. Yeah. You you take it, like,

Chris: wow. It's scary accurate.

Steve: And then on top of that, you take that, with your spouse, and it's like, how do you two Yeah. Relate to each other? And I think the Enneagram is a better tool to see how it how how you interact with another person than the predictive index, how you work with another person. Because that's good too. Right?

It's more scientific, it appears. Mhmm. With Enneagram, it's it's pretty spot. It's like, here are the things you fight about. It's like, these are the things we fight about.

Chris: It really is, isn't it? Yeah. It is scary how accurate that is. And it also it offered me some perspective of how I'm perceived Mhmm. In those moments.

And it's like I think it's helped chill me out in some some circumstances or me be more aware of how I'm how am I coming across. Sometimes my passion translates as anger, and that can intimidate people sometimes.

Steve: So you were at KW. Mhmm. So the disc is a huge thing. Yeah. KW.

Right? And I remember one of the things that would piss people off. So trying to figure out what the what someone is. Mhmm. Like, are you quick to anger?

Right? Because that's how you can tell us a ID. Yeah.

Chris: Right? Exactly. It's like, I am

Steve: not quick to anger. It was just always a amusing and entertaining experience. What's your biggest struggle right now?

Chris: Biggest struggle right now is managing our acquisition managers. Mhmm. Sales has always been, you know, my thing. I've trained all of our our AMs. What I figured out very recently is although I can train and I feel like I'm really skilled at that, I suck at being a sales manager.

Mhmm. So much, so much that we we just hired a, director of sales. And this is, it's a it's a challenge for me because I this is me giving up control or giving up my my baby or giving up part of the business that I thought I would always run. So, but it's a necessary step in the the evolution of our company. And me realizing that as much as I want to be good at this, I'm I'm letting down some of our team members, and I I am prohibiting their their success and, them getting better at their job.

Steve: Right. Yeah. Managing salespeople is tough. Yeah. Been the bane of my entire career.

But, you know, working with Wren, fortunately

Chris: Yeah.

Steve: There is a way to effectively lead salespeople as we cover a lot in our sales leadership training. How do you stay motivated?

Chris: I feel like I'm just naturally motivated, but I think getting a taste of success is the best motivator. So, like, the best time to close a sale is right after you just closed another sale. So I think you've got to stay in the the reason why consistent production is so important is because it it that last win connects you so easily to the next win.

Steve: Mhmm. So how

Chris: do I stay motivated is by staying motivated and and winning.

Steve: Right. Enjoying the the the highs. And You

Chris: have to have them.

Steve: Yeah. What is your superpower?

Chris: I feel like my superpower is gaining trust and relationship building. We've been able to to build a network of private lenders. My learned negotiation style is not rapport building. I hate when people say build rapport. It's like, just because someone likes you, you think they're gonna sell you, you know, their house at a at a discount, but but building trust.

Mhmm. I I I feel like that is a unique, kind of ability, and that ties into one of the things that we preach is getting real and just, not being afraid to address the elephant in the room, not being afraid to to to get vulnerable and open up, to scary conversations.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. And I totally agree with that. Right? That part of building trust versus rapport, I think that's something that we all get wrong Yeah.

In sales. You gotta be able to you gotta be able to report people who wanna do business that they know, like, and trust. Like, I don't really need to like you. Right? Like, when a doctor says you need an operation, like, well, I don't really like you that much.

Right. Yeah. It it's You

Chris: liked him enough to go to that doctor, but that's where it ends. Right? Like, then then you've gotta trust him.

Steve: It was more than four stars on Yelp. That's all I needed to know. We needed. Right? Yeah.

And then we get in. It's like, okay. Well, I mean, he's he's the guy. He's the doctor. Mhmm.

What is your biggest regret?

Chris: Not building my team sooner.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: I thought I could do it all, and, yeah, I thought I could do it all. I I I feel like I wasted, at least a year, if not two years. I wish I had made that first hire, but, hey, we're we're here now. So I would really encourage people to if you have a a desire to to scale and you've got your eyes set on these numbers, man, it's not as scary as it seems, starting to, to build a team. I think you have to hire in front of the revenue.

You have to anticipate these needs Mhmm. Ahead of time, but hire into the positions that you suck at, you know, and that's been the best thing I've done so far.

Steve: Got it. What book have you gifted more than any other?

Chris: Can you do can I do two books?

Steve: Of course.

Chris: Never Split the Difference, Chris Voss. That is our sales Bible.

Steve: Mhmm.

Chris: I love that approach. I really, I really thought I knew what I was doing until I read that book, and I was like, oh. And as soon as we implemented the lessons from that book, our sales doubled. Yeah. I mean, it really it really translates.

Second one, I've mentioned a couple of times, but, Leading an Inspired Life. Cody gave me that book. It really helped, focus that motivation Mhmm. And and an understanding of, what am I trying to achieve?

Steve: Yeah. Is that the one with the 12 lessons? The the 12, pillars where, like, the guy had to go go to that guy's house, and he went he wasn't allowed to meet with him till whatever, and then, like, right before the end, like, he dies?

Chris: I believe so.

Steve: Yes. Okay. Like, it's not a long read. Right?

Chris: Different book. Yeah. This one's tremendously long. Probably, like, 300, 350 pages.

Steve: Okay. So that's not the same book. Alright. I'll go check that one out.

Chris: Yeah. This is Jim Rohn, and and his,

Steve: It was not a fable.

Chris: Nope. Nope.

Steve: Something in the wrong book.

Chris: This is, Jim Rohn's kinda introduction with his, his mentor Mhmm. And this guy that teaches him these life lessons. So it sounds a little bit similar, but, I think it's a different book.

Steve: Got it. Alright. I'll have to check it out. Yeah. So I want you to think about a message you wanna leave all the listeners with.

Wanna make a couple of quick, announcements. Guys, if you got value today, please subscribe. Don't keep us a secret. You subscribing can help us reach more people. And, again, we're on a mission to create a 100 millionaires.

Next week, we got Eliiza Rubin, Keith Everett, Alex Saenz. Check it out. This is gonna be the first time we're gonna have three guests in here, so we'll see how this goes. And then, you know, we were talking about the objections. If you guys are running to objections, we're building up a list of top 10 objections.

We compile it, give you our input on the best way to overcome those. So text the word objections to 33777, and then we'll compile it. You guys will get it immediately. What are some last thoughts you'd like to leave everybody with?

Chris: Last thoughts. Dive in. You can't you you can't, achieve anything without getting started. Right? Second one is get real.

I've got a sign in my office that, it's a it's a pink neon sign. And, yeah, I it it means a couple of things. One, hey. Go go get it. Go get real estate.

But two, man, just get real with people. Don't try to pretend like, you know, you're this sales professional and you say everything the right way. People don't want that. People want someone that's real, that's gonna be vulnerable, and just meet them at their level.

Steve: Kinda goes back to why the other career just didn't work out for you. Exactly. Yeah. If someone wants to get a hold of you, what's the best way for them to reach you?

Chris: Reach out through our website, maximumcashhomebuyers.com. Mhmm. It's probably the best way. Or find me on social media.

Steve: And what's your handle on social media?

Chris: Facebook. I believe it's, the Chris Burrow. Instagram, the the Chris Burrow.

Steve: Perfect. Awesome. Thank you very much.

Chris: Thank you, man.

Steve: Thank you all for watching. See you guys all later. Shout out to Steve train. Jump on the Steve train. We real estate disrupt us.