Ryan Pineda Shares How He Made His First Million with No Marketing or Staff

Steve Trang: Hey, everyone. Thank you for joining us for today's episode of Real Estate Disrupters. Today, we have Ryan Pineda with Home Run Offer, and he's flown in from Vegas to share how he made his first million without any marketing or staff. If this is your first time tuning in, I am Steve Trang, broker and owner of Stunning Homes Realty, founder of the Offer Fast Homes app, the only MLS for off market wholesale properties. And I'm on a mission to create 100 millionaires.

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So please post your questions and Ryan will be very happy to answer them. You ready?

Ryan Pineda: I'm ready, man.

Steve: Alright. First question. Softball. Well, I guess maybe a fastball for you. Yeah.

What got you in the real estate?

Ryan: Man, so I've been asked to play softball a lot, but, I'm done with that. So, you know, I started out, as a baseball player. You know, I didn't really care about real estate and, you know, baseball was really my goal. So just to bring it to the real estate really quick, I, got drafted when I was 21 by the Oakland A's, and I didn't get a very big signing bonus, so I knew I was gonna need a job in the off season. For those who don't know, you only make about $1,200 a month in the minor leagues, so That's crazy.

It is crazy, dude. And you can't negotiate it like real estate. Like, that is what it is. You sign your life away. And so, I was like, well, if I make $6 a year, I'm probably gonna need another job.

So I got licensed when I was 21 and

Steve: Oh, right away.

Ryan: Right away. I just knew. And so my mom had been a realtor for twenty something years, so I just knew that like, hey, this would be a good job with, you know, I could go leave, play baseball for six months, go do real estate for six months, whatever. And so that's what I did. It was, 2010 in, you know, the pretty much bottom of the recession.

We were just about to come out and, I'm in Las Vegas and prices are super low and I'm just trying to figure out how to be an agent. So, I'm going for my mom, who's been old school, you know, her whole life and so she's like, Yeah, put ads out in the paper and you know, this and that. I'm like, Okay. And I'm like this '21 year old kid.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: So I'm putting ads in the paper and the classifieds and getting clients and obviously I'm getting like really old people and I'm like this young kid trying to sell them houses. And so, luckily, somehow, I I sold houses and did that, and I did it for a couple years.

Steve: So in this time, you're playing for the A's miner to their farm. Yeah. You're in Vegas. Yeah. So that was kind of fortunate.

Right?

Ryan: Or Well, the a's weren't there yet.

Steve: Okay. So, like, you you're from Vegas or were you from Born

Ryan: and raised. Yep.

Steve: So you're born and raised in Vegas Yeah. And your farm was in Vegas.

Ryan: No. Oh. No. So in the off season, I would live in Vegas. So from, you know, whatever, six months.

And then they would send me out here, actually, for spring training.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: And so we do spring training for a month or two, and then we would go off to the season. And so, man, I've played in like, I could tell you so many places, but, I ended up doing that for eight years with Oakland and with other teams in the minor leagues. Never got to the big leagues. I wasn't good enough. But, yeah.

So real estate was always for the six months I wasn't playing.

Steve: Gotcha. Okay. And then so you got into real estate. You started advertising the paper.

Ryan: Yeah. So I was an agent. Had no idea what I was doing. And after a couple years, I realized I hated it because, like, I would get clients and they they'd make me go show a thousand houses and they wouldn't buy and every, like every realtor knows how that goes. Uh-huh.

And, I said, you know what? I'm tired of doing this. And so I had just gotten married to my wife, and we moved into this little apartment. And, you know, I furnished it with, couches and stuff from Craigslist. I didn't have a lot of money.

And I had this, like, idea in my head. I was like, dude, if I could resell this stuff, I could like make a lot of money because I got a good deal. And so I tested my theory and I started flipping couches and flipping like appliances, like anything you can imagine, I was flipping it.

Steve: Wow.

Ryan: And it became a legit business. I was I was making $68 a month flipping crap on Craigslist.

Steve: Really? Yeah. Wow.

Ryan: It was like that, you know, like, I see Gary Vee do it on, like, garage sales and stuff now. Like, I was doing that a long time ago. Yeah. And, it was great. Like, I had storage units full of couch.

It was like my showroom. And, all I would do is just get a distressed couch, go clean it up a little bit, and then throw it on Craigslist again and deliver it for them.

Steve: I've never heard of distressed furniture. That's interesting.

Ryan: You gotta find a motivated seller of distressed furniture.

Steve: Because you see it with, like I heard some people that got started, they were selling cars. Yeah. Or they buy them cheap Yeah. Fix them a little bit and flip them.

Ryan: Cars are way harder because a car has all these part I don't know anything about mechanic stuff. Mhmm. I can wash a cushion cover, you know? And there's no, like, mechanical stuff that's gonna come back on me like like, dude, this car is a piece of crap. It doesn't work.

And it doesn't require capital. I just need, like, a $100 to buy a couch, and I can go sell it for 3.

Steve: Wow. Okay. So then what

Ryan: when did you start flipping? So I quit real estate to do that, and I was still doing baseball.

Steve: Mhmm. And I

Ryan: was making good man, I thought I was rich, honestly. And, around 2014, the end, I, started to realize, like, alright, baseball's not going where I want it to go. Like, I'm probably not getting to the big leagues and I pretty much have reached my potential in couch flipping. Like, I literally bought every couch there was in Craigslist. I'm like, I can't I can't do any more than I do.

Yeah. I'm I was the king. And, I didn't like it. I just was doing it. And so Paid the bills.

Yeah. Paid the bills. And, so my wife and I went on a one year anniversary to New Orleans and I sat there and I was just reflecting on our first year of marriage. And, I I started praying. I was like, god, what do you, like, want me to do?

Up until this point, I thought it was play baseball. It's not. You know, I know it's definitely not real estate.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And I know it's definitely not flipping couches forever. And, I was like, just give me a sign. And I kid you not, like, that day, I saw an advertisement on TV for Scott Yancey's course or a seminar thing.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: The flipping Vegas guy.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: Yeah. And, I was like, that's a scam. Like, I already knew. Just I was I'm always a skeptical person. Like, whenever I see guys on Instagram or whatever, I'm like, I don't believe it.

I don't believe anything. And so I felt like God saying, no. Look into it. So I Googled it, and I was like, Scott Yancey scam. And

Steve: That's your Google search.

Ryan: Yeah. That was my scourge. I was like, Scott Yancey, seminar scam. And then the first thing to pop up was BiggerPockets.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And people were talking about it on the forums, and they were like, yeah. You don't need to do that. Blah blah blah. Like, you know, all the information's on BiggerPockets. And I was like, Wait a minute.

Like, they're saying that you can buy houses like with no money.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so I started looking on BiggerPockets and I was like, You know what? I'm gonna buy these books. So I bought the books and it like opened my eyes. I was like, woah. Like, you really can buy money or buy buy houses without your own money.

And they started talking about this thing called wholesaling, which I still didn't even understand. Like, I read about it and I was like, being an agent, you're like, you can't do that.

Steve: Right. And

Ryan: I was like, I don't even know what that is, like whatever. The thing that intrigued me was the hard money because I knew I could, I was good at finding deals. I'd been a good deal finder my whole life and I just couldn't buy them and so after I learned about hard money, I was like, okay, I know what to do. And so this was all on the trip, on our anniversary. I was just crushing books and, I was so excited about it and I told my wife, I was like, babe, like, we're gonna flip houses.

And she's like, whatever. Like she was like, you know, like, do you know, I trust you. Whatever you wanna do, you could do. She, like, she has such blind faith. It's crazy.

That's awesome. And, so we get on the plane flight back and honestly, I was so cheap, like, we didn't even sit together because we just, like, bought the tickets and we didn't pay the extra fee to pick your seat. And so we got separate seats and I'm sitting next to this guy, this really old guy, and I'm still reading this next book and he's like

Steve: What did you want to like this like the bookstore to buy these books? No.

Ryan: I bought a Kindle. I had a Kindle.

Steve: So I just

Ryan: bought the ebook.

Steve: Gotcha.

Ryan: And, so I'm reading the ebook and he's like, what are you reading? I was like, oh, I'm just reading about flipping houses and stuff. I'm gonna be a house flipper. He's like, interesting. He's like, you know, I I've been flipping houses for thirty years.

I was like, woah. And he's like, yeah. And he's like, so what's your plan? I was like, well, I'm gonna get a hard money loan and I'm gonna flip this thing. And he's like, Well, why do you even need a hard money loan?

You can just take it subject to, you could do contract for deed. I was like, What are you talking about? Like, I was so confused. And, he's like, I'll send you some stuff about it. And he's like, honestly, I want you to know, like, I I really I don't talk to many people, but he's like, I kinda felt like God calling me to talk to you about this.

And I was like I was getting goosebumps. I was like, holy crap. And so that was all I needed, like, to have the faith that it was gonna work out. And so I got back. This is the 2014, and I had $10 in the bank.

That was what I had saved up from flipping couches. And the thing I actually took from the seminar and all the, like, angry posts and bigger pockets was, oh, they make you, like, raise your credit card and, you know, go through that process and apply for new ones. And I was like, that's actually a good idea because I'm gonna use that as a down payment.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so I maxed out all my credit cards and got another 50. And, I don't advise, like, anybody to do this.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: But this is what I did. So it is what it is. And, I maxed them all out. I had like $60 to play with. Like two months later, I found my first deal on Craigslist from a wholesaler, bought it, and, like two weeks later, I saw another deal in the MLS.

And I thought it was too good to be true because I was like, this house doesn't even need work, but, like, the comps say this and he only wants this. Mhmm. So I ended up using my remaining funds and I bought it and I was like, well, we're just gonna see what happens. And, I fixed that house in two days. Like, it didn't need anything.

I just, like, cleaned it up and whatever. Threw it back on the market, first day offer for what I wanted, and then it sold, like, forty days later. And I made, like, 25,000. And I said, holy crap. Like, I had $10 and now I have $35.

Steve: So you bought something off the MLS? Yeah. And you spent two days?

Ryan: Two days. And I marked it back up and I made $25.

Steve: What the hell was the other agent doing?

Ryan: I have no idea. I really don't. And I just, you know, I really do think it was like a blessing from God to just give me the confidence and, like, look, you can do this. Mhmm. And, you know, it was crazy.

I don't know what the heck the deal was.

Steve: Right. Yeah. But that's awesome. Alright. You're making it work.

You you made it work by taking action. And I think that's one of the things that we were talking about beforehand is that there's so much information out there. There's no shortage of available information out there. You know, between all the podcasts Yeah. Between all the YouTube videos, between all the Facebook groups, there's a lot of information out there.

But there's a lack of

Ryan: Action. Right.

Steve: So you wanna talk about on that a little bit?

Ryan: Yeah. So I think so many people and, you know, I had some people last night, you know, do I did a little meetup, and, you know, they're they're was that?

Steve: I didn't get an invite.

Ryan: Dude, I just threw it out on Instagram stories, man. So it's all good. You would I lost money gambling, so you you're lucky you didn't come. So, you know, basically, they're like, oh, but, you know, what do I do about my CRM? What do I do about I like, I don't understand how the title company works.

I like, I need a realtor for my team and this and that. I'm like, why are you worried about all this crap? I'm like, how many leads you got? Oh, I don't have any like, so why do you need a CRM?

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: You know? And I'm like, you literally just need to get a deal. Like, do whatever it takes to get a deal. And then the rest, you'll figure it out as the deal goes on. I go, and honestly, if you get a deal, like, I'll buy it and I'll walk you through it.

Steve: Like,

Ryan: just do something.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. So that's something that, you know, I I I tell people, like, there's two different schools of thought. One is to buy find buyers first. The other is find sellers first.

I'm with a school of thought. You find the distressed properties, you'll find the buyer.

Ryan: Oh, yeah.

Steve: It it it tracks itself.

Ryan: Oh, yeah.

Steve: So, like, you know, going and build out the buyers list was, like, you know, skip tracing, calling all these different buyers without a seller in hand. Well, bro, you

Ryan: know what's crazy is, like, when I started five years ago, they there was none of these giant Facebook groups.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: K? There was no, like,

Steve: How long ago was this?

Ryan: In the very beginning of 2015.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: So this this is my fifth year. And, yeah, there was, like, no $80,000 or 80,000 member groups

Steve: that

Ryan: you are now. Like, if you have a deal, all you can literally do is just press, I have a deal. Enter. And you're gonna get 8,000,000 people who are like, send me the deal. Send me the deal.

Yeah. You know? But, yeah, you there's no excuse for getting a buyer's list today.

Steve: Right. Okay. So you did your first couple of flips. Right? When did when did you realize that flipping was the the way to go?

I mean, I know you you kinda have this this calling Yeah. Or this vision. Yeah. But But you're still playing baseball. Yep.

So, like, how did you know Yeah. When it was how to make the leap?

Ryan: So, you know, that was 2015, very beginning when I bought my first flip. And, that year, I bought five homes. You know? It was my first year. And, a lot of people, like, they get discouraged or and they tell me, like, yeah.

I only I only did, like, five deals my first year. I'm like, that's great. That's awesome. Like, you did really good. Yeah.

And, so I was still playing baseball. I wasn't giving up the dream because I knew that with baseball, you have a lifespan. You know? Once you reach a certain age, you're done. You can't go back.

Real estate, it's like, you could do this forever.

Steve: Literally, you can

Ryan: do it for

Steve: there's so many dinosaurs in the business.

Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. And so I was like, I'm gonna give it everything I've got in baseball until I just feel like I got nothing left. And so 2015, I played. 2016, played again, and I bought 20 homes that year.

Steve: Wow.

Ryan: Yep. While I was playing. And I was doing it, like I said, by myself. When I when I, like, would leave the game or leave the Las Vegas to go play, I would just have my dad go watch the projects and, you know, I'd just give him some money when they closed.

Steve: Who was negotiating the deals? Like Me. I was

Ryan: doing it over the phone.

Steve: I mean, you're basically been a virtual flipper.

Ryan: Yeah. I was. And that was honestly, playing baseball and flipping taught me to delegate, and that was what has really helped me be successful today is because, like, I push everything. I'm like, why am I even doing this job? Like, you need to we need to create a position to do this job.

Yeah. You know? But, when I first, you know, started, I had to learn to do it all myself before I could teach it. So 2016, you know, I did 20 while I was playing full time. And, 2017 was where really when I broke through.

Because up until that point, I was still maxing out credit cards, getting hard money, whatever. And so making those payments is scary. You can only do so many. And so I was in bible study, and one of my guys was like, yo, you know, I see what you're doing. You know, I wanna lend.

And this guy, he had been retired, worked multimillions. And I knew he was, but, you know, it's just like, whatever. And so

Steve: Never thought we had to ask him.

Ryan: Yeah. You know, I'm not there for that. And so he's like, I wanna I wanna get invested. What can you offer? And I said, hey.

Here's what I can offer. You know? Here's what I'm paying for my hard money, but here's the difference. Like, if you can pay if you can give me a 100% of purchase and rehab and then give me deferred interest so I'm not making all these payments every month, like, I could buy a lot of deals. Mhmm.

Because I pass up on a lot of deals because I have no money. And, he's like, yeah. That's not a problem. So he started me off with half 1,000,000. So I bought a couple homes with it, flipped them.

He got his return. He's like, okay. I see you. And I was like, alright. Like, what do you wanna do?

He's like, let's let's up it to

Steve: a million.

Ryan: Mhmm. So we do a million. You know? He's still getting his return. He's like, let's up it, you know, 2,000,000.

I'm like, okay. So we're still getting his return. And then he's like, let me let me tell you about my friend. Friends start coming, whatever. And so that was how I've raised private money, literally just strictly through relationships and, social media, just showing what I'm doing because people see it and they're like, okay.

He's legit.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: But, anyway, so 2017, I'm still playing baseball, and I actually just came off the best season of my career in 2016. And so I'm going into 2017 like, hey. You never know what's about to happen. Mhmm. And, my my house holding business was exploding because of him, you know, funding me.

I go to play the season, and I kid you not, dude, it was the most stressful time in my entire life that I've ever had because before the game, I would have all these texts and emails about deals and projects and this and that. I still didn't have staff. You know? I was growing faster than I realized.

Steve: So 2016, how many did you do without staff? 20. 20 without staff.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: And then so 2017, I still didn't have staff. And, I'm out on the field, and I'm, like, I'm getting emails and texts every single minute. And so, like, before the game, like, I'm supposed to be getting mentally prepared to play the game, and I'm on my laptop, like, typing up offers and counter I'm like, what am I doing? And then, like, during the game, I'm playing a game, and then I'm thinking about deals.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And then, like, after the game, my computer and phone are blown out. I'm like, dude, this is getting really stressful. And so after halfway through the season, I was having the worst season of my career. And, I honestly wanted to quit because I, you know, just was, like I could see real estate was like, like, my future, baseball was not. And, but I just didn't have it in me to quit.

Steve: So while you're going through this balance of figuring out whether to quit or not Yeah. It's either 20 flips and 16.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: How much did you clear on

Ryan: that 20, if you

Steve: don't mind me asking?

Ryan: We made a little over 200,000 that year because I didn't sell all 20.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: You know, I bought 20 and then some rolled over into 2017. And

Steve: so cleared 200. Yeah. But you're still like, do I really wanna

Ryan: No. I knew I knew that I wanted to flip, and I would it was gonna be my thing. But baseball, I just didn't wanna give it up

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: To be on. I enjoy playing. You know? I love competing. I love and like I said, I knew I had a lifespan.

Span. So it's like, hey. Might as well just keep playing till somebody tells me I can't. Yeah. And, so I ended up getting released in 2017 and because I was playing bad.

And, I just I was very content with that because I didn't wanna quit, and it was my way out. And so I had other teams like, yeah. You wanna play? I'm like, no. And so I went back to Vegas.

And during that time, forgot to mention 2017, my buddy, who is now my broker partner over at our brokerage

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: He started helping me out because I was like, hey. Look. I'm gonna go leave for baseball, and I need someone to watch my properties. He's, like, tight. Like, I wanna learn the business and, you know, same thing I had with my dad, just, you know, paid him when a property closed.

And so he was doing that for me while I was gone. And so when I got back, you know, I went to him and I'm like, okay, let's kind of like think about how we can do this, like more efficiently with you. And, you know, so I'm like, alright, you know, you check on the projects and I'll just keep finding deals and doing what I do. And, we did that, for a few months and I'm like, hey, we're like getting a lot of deals now because once I got finished playing, I was like, well, what do I do with all my time now? I I I'm not gonna train for baseball anymore.

Like, I'm used to doing that for hours every day.

Steve: Hours.

Ryan: Yeah. And so I was like, well, I guess, like, I'll train in real estate, like, whatever that means.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so I just started getting devoted to it. And I went from doing in '17, the first couple months, I was doing, like, two, three a month, you know, whatever. When I got released, that was in, like, August, I immediately bought, like, 10. Yeah. And then, like, ever since, I've been buying, like, 10 a month.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And, you know, it got crazy. Because once I stopped, I was like, alright. We're gonna open up a brokerage now.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so him and I opened up a brokerage. He got his broker's license and, you know, so I was telling you about we opened it up, and I was like, alright. This is about to be 2018. I'm like, we're gonna start marketing now.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And because I'm like So

Steve: you're buying all these houses without marketing?

Ryan: That's what I

Steve: was saying.

Ryan: Yeah. My first 75 deals, maybe 80. My first 80 deals, I didn't pay a dollar for.

Steve: Right. As far

Ryan: as So how are

Steve: we getting deals brought to you?

Ryan: MLS and wholesalers. That's it.

Steve: So you're Coleman MLS yourself personally

Ryan: Yes.

Steve: Making offers Yep. Like, through the listing agent? I was an agent. Okay. So you're representing yourself Yep.

Making offers? Yep. And then wholesalers, you're developing reputation. Yep. So, like, right now, if I'm in Vegas and I have a house that I wanna sell Mhmm.

As a wholesaler, I think of you? Yep. As a homeowner, do I think of you, or is that something different?

Ryan: No. Homeowners didn't know me.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: Yeah. So I was more business to business. Right?

Steve: Gotcha.

Ryan: So I wanted realtors to know me and wholesalers to know me. Mhmm. And so the first thing I started doing, and it goes back into how did I get, you know, all these deals without marketing, I just started getting really active on social media. And up until that point, I hated social media. I absolutely hated it.

Like I

Steve: wouldn't know it by looking at Instagram.

Ryan: I know. I know. It's let me tell you guys this. So up until 02/1616, I hated social media. If you look on my face I didn't have an Instagram back then.

If you look on my Facebook, I didn't have any post. And one of my, buddies was telling me, he's like, bro, if you start posting on social media what you do, people are gonna bring you deals.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And I was like, well, I can I can do that? Yeah. And he was right. Like, I just started posting crap I was doing, you know? And then I started just taking a camera.

I was like, hey. I'm at a, you know, I'm at a property, blah blah blah. And people liked it.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And, wholesalers started DMing me, and they're like, yeah. I got a property. You want it? I'm like, absolutely. And, I met so many wholesalers realtors doing it that way.

And the other thing I did too was I went on Facebook and added, like, every single realtor as a friend in Las Vegas. And so that way, they knew who I was. And so I got plenty of realtors who were like, oh, yeah. I've seen you before, you know, blah blah blah.

Steve: So you and Kenny are competing for these realtors headspace?

Ryan: Yeah. Me and realtor or me and Kenny were doing pretty much the same thing, except Kenny wasn't really looking on the MLS. Kenny was trying to just, you know, talk to realtors directly, whereas I was still getting the majority from MLS, but a lot of referral.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: Yeah. And I bought a lot of stuff from Kenny too.

Steve: So there's a nugget there that we kind of gloss over, the the hard money lender or the private money lender you end up working with partnering with.

Ryan: Yep.

Steve: He was funding your deals Yeah. Funding your rehab

Ryan: Yep.

Steve: And deferred pain payments.

Ryan: Yep.

Steve: So I started doing this last year, and I was telling people, hey. I'm looking for money. I wanna pay 10. I want them to fund the whole deal. Mhmm.

And I want deferred payments.

Ryan: Yep.

Steve: And I was getting laughed at. Yeah. And then I found somebody. Yep. And it's awesome.

Yep. So you wanna explain to these people what that means?

Ryan: Okay. So if you get a typical loan, right, you pay your interest payment every month, your mortgage payment every month. That's how a loan works.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: But, you know, you get right now, I think we had, at one point last year, 70 homes at once. And so that's, like, $13,000,000. And so if you have to make that payment every month on 13 mil, you're talking, like, a $130 a month. Right?

Steve: Our cash a little bit.

Ryan: Yeah. You better be, like, really bringing in the the bacon. And so the only way to really scale is to get them to not make you make those payments.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: And so you just say, Hey, look, here's the deal. You know, you're gonna give me 150,000. When I sell the property, I'm gonna get paid and you're gonna get paid. You'll get the $1.50 plus whatever has accrued up to that point. And so you would have basically a daily amount

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: That, you know, it costs.

Steve: And so

Ryan: if it takes me a hundred and twenty days to flip it, that's what you get paid on.

Steve: Right. Yep. Is there an interest rate that you're marketing at that point?

Ryan: Yeah. So I was like I said, with my first lenders, I was telling them, I was like, hey. I'll give you three points 12%.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: That's what I was paying hard money, and, you know, that's what I'll pay. And, to me, I needed you know, it was great. Like, oh, you're gonna give me the same terms, but I can buy unlimited? Right. Great.

And so, I always avoided the profit split model because I just knew I was buying good deals. And so it's like

Steve: It's more expensive in the long run.

Ryan: It is. Yeah. And so I would prefer to pay more point. People think that's expensive. They're like, oh, that's really expensive.

Three points 12%. Okay. But if the numbers still add up and you're gonna make $20, why do you care? Yeah. You know?

So Yeah.

Steve: Very good point. Very good point. Casey wants to know how do your hair always look good?

Ryan: Is that Casey Ryan? That's Casey DeVault. Oh, okay. Man, dude, you told me this this morning when we were running. K?

Steve: Okay. So I see so we show up at the park at 05:30. So you guys know I do our our our our wholesale, running club pacing me and a couple other guys. And I see Ryan this morning, and his hair still looks this good. I was like, what the hell is going on?

There's no way he's waking up that popping out of bad hair looking that good.

Ryan: But Hey. I can get multiple roommates to confirm it happens. But, I told you in the morning, it's just water. Right now, it's gelled up. So, you know.

Steve: So I would say that, you know, a lot of people are selling a lot of courses for three ks, five k. You could probably sell a course on getting your hair looking that good. That's true. Three ks, five k course.

Ryan: At least five k. Yeah.

Steve: Alright. So you were an agent Mhmm. Using that past tense. Yeah. And you decided to open a brokerage.

Yep. Okay. So let's explain the rationale because there are a lot of people here that are licensed as well Yep. That listen to the show. Why did you open the brokerage?

Ryan: So I had started gaining a little bit of a following, and, I was like, you know what? We're gonna do so many flips and stuff. Like, I don't wanna be at my old brokerage and, a, bring them liability and b and b, like, you know, pay all the fees.

Steve: Mhmm. So I

Ryan: was like, you know what? We'll just start around. And so, Nick, my partner, and I started the brokerage, and, it's been great ever since. Like I said, we we've got about 50 agents now in about a year and a half, so it's growing really fast. And the approach we've taken is just social media.

Like, we don't market for that at all. It's just so strictly social media. And, with that, we're trying to appeal to the investors. I think you're trying to do something similar.

Steve: Yep. Absolutely.

Ryan: It's like, hey. If you're an investor in Las Vegas and you're not at Forever Home Realty, then quite frankly, you're just probably stupid. Yeah. And, like, make it such a good deal that you would be dumb not to join.

Steve: Yeah. I feel the same way, but I don't say I have Jamil say it. So it's great.

Ryan: Yeah. No. I mean, I straight up like, when people come to our office for the initial meeting, I'm like, here's how it's gonna go down. Like, this is what we do. This is what you get.

You know? We're not gonna hold your hand, and, we're not gonna follow-up with you. So if you wanna join, join. If not, it's all good. Like, I'm not gonna hear from you again.

Steve: So at some point, though, you deactivated your license? Yeah. Yeah. I was rationale behind that?

Ryan: So up until that point, right, I was doing the MLS on my own, getting deals, making commissions. So that makes the profit obviously better. And then I got a guy named Gabe who I said is, in one of my other posts, the most awkward person ever. And, you know, he proved that he was really good. Mhmm.

Because he was just strictly devoted to it. By then, you know, I got all this crap going on. And, I'm like, you know what? I'm willing to let you do this because you've proven you can get deals. And so after he started doing it, I was like, what am I even using my license for at this point?

Right. I don't have clients. Like Mhmm. And so all it brings me is liability. And, you know, like, you you get complaints here or there.

Like, out of the hundreds of flips I've done, I've only had less than five complaints. Mhmm. But every time, it's just like, if I wasn't licensed, they couldn't complain to the real estate board. And so I was like, you know what? I'm just getting rid of it.

And so I got rid of it.

Steve: Yeah. I haven't gotten complaints. Let's see. I haven't gotten complaints to the board. Yeah.

Ryan: I've gotten lots of complaints.

Steve: Like, you're a broker. You should, you know, blah blah blah. Mhmm. But then I explain them where they're wrong, and then the issue kinda goes away.

Ryan: Yep. For now. Yeah. For now. Until they decide to Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. So you're the third person here from Vegas. Right? We've had Laith. Kenny, we had you.

Yeah. How is your operation different than your Vegas peers?

Ryan: You know, honestly, I don't really know what the heck Laith does. You know, Kenny is more on the wholesale side, and, like, he talks about he tries to get to refer him stuff. I think what makes me different than, honestly, most people, like, even nationwide, is that we do everything. You know? Like, we fix and flip high volume, probably top three in Vegas in terms of volume.

We wholesale. You know, we have rentals. We have Airbnbs. We have, you know, the brokerage.

Steve: You

Ryan: know, I don't really know of anyone in Vegas that does all of those things, like, at a decent not just like, hey. I've got one rental. Like Yeah. You know? So when we get a property, we can really decide what's the best route for this.

Like, we were talking about earlier, if we get an in house deal, you know, we'll blast it out and just see. Test the waters like, okay. You know what? If we can make ten fifteen on this as a wholesale, we'll take it. Yeah.

Okay. Nobody wants it. We can only make 5. We'll flip it. It's not a big deal.

Mhmm. And so, the other part is I get to be everyone's best friend that way because the wholesalers know I buy Mhmm. And I buy a lot from the wholesalers. Like, I would say I buy six a month from wholesalers Vegas. And then they know I sell too, the other flippers.

So the flippers are like, hey. You know, whatever deals you don't want or whatever you know, sell them to us. And so I get to befriend everyone. Because, you know, wholesalers, like, they kinda

Steve: it's like, oh, how can you even help me? You can't help me.

Ryan: Like, blah, blah, blah, blah. And flippers are like, oh, because you're always competing for the wholesaler's deals.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: Whereas I'm, like, in the middle, and I'm like, hey. I can make money with both of you.

Steve: I don't care.

Ryan: Right. So and then, oh, you're an agent. You want, you know, whatever. You can join my brokerage. That's cool.

Yeah. So, like, I can befriend everyone.

Steve: And then you look at Airbnb and rentals as other exit strategies. Is that did I get that right? Yeah. So So you get a property as presented to you. You look at it.

This could be a wholesale. This could be a flip. This could be a rental property for your buy and hold.

Ryan: Yeah. For me personally. Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. And this could be an Airbnb for you.

Ryan: Not in Vegas. I I do Airbnbs and Big Bear, because Vegas is so restrictive. The rules in Vegas are crazy with Airbnb. What? Like, how so?

Because the casinos want you staying on the casino. And so they've changed the rules so bad. Like, one rule is you can't have a vacant house in Airbnb anymore. You have to live there, and you can only do, like, your rooms. K?

You can only have, an Airbnb Airbnb can't be within six sixty feet of another one.

Steve: So if

Ryan: somebody if your next door neighbor already did it, you're never gonna get one Yeah. Legally. Wow. So people do it illegally, but that's, like, I ain't trying to, like, deal with all this drama. Yeah.

You know? In Big Bear where I do my Airbnbs, there's no hotel. Like, there's a shortage of housing.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: They need it for their economy. Yeah. And it's a vacation town. There ain't no casinos trying to get them on the strip. Mhmm.

So, you know, I do it where it's friendly.

Steve: Gotcha.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: Okay. So when do you decide? Because it's something that, we talked about also offline is that I'm a reluctant flipper. Right? Like Mhmm.

I'll buy anything. When we talk to homeowner, like, when you make them offer, like, we're gonna perform or we're gonna sell it. One of those two things can happen. We'll never, like, walk away. Yeah.

So but we flip reluctantly and our margins we look at is if we can make five wholesale or 20 flip, we'll just take the five wholesale.

Ryan: I'm the opposite.

Steve: So what is your role for that?

Ryan: So here's my new model. Last year I was not a wholesaler. Last year I literally bought every deal we did and I bought every wholesaler's deal and every MLS deal, whatever. Like, honestly, even up until, like, the beginning of last year, I didn't know what dispositions was. I was like, what is disposition?

Like, I was asking my buddy, Tyson, I'm like, what is a dispositions manager? He's like, that's the person that sells deals. I'm like, why? Like, I just buy them all. And he's like, yeah.

You don't need it. I was like, oh, okay. And, I feel really stupid, like, admitting that, but it's true. And it goes back to the point of you don't need to know everything. Yeah.

Because it didn't apply to me.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: I didn't need one. And so last year, right, the the the market went crazy. It was on the up and up and up, and it so it's like, I'm buying every single deal because, you know, this deal right now might be worth $20 more by the time I flip it. And I was right, like, a lot.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: And so around September, October, I realized, like, the economy was, like, flatlining. Mhmm. And I was like, you know what? We we need to diversify. Like, sales are way down.

We're not selling as many flips. And so I said, let's start wholesaling some of these homes. And it was the biggest blessing because it definitely helped with the cash flow situation, you know, because whether it was a flipper, you don't know when you're gonna get your cash back, you know, even when you're not, you know, putting your money into deals, you still end up going over budget. You still have taxes, insurance and all these things overhead. And so cash is always going out until it comes

Steve: back in

Ryan: months later. And so wholesaling turned out to be a great thing to balance our cash flow. And so I started that late in the year. And then, this year I said, you know what? You know, the market is kind of flat.

It's not going up or down. So I'm like, you know what? I kinda wanna diversify my risk and not be holding 70 properties at a time.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: So here's how I'm gonna operate. Any deal a wholesaler gives me, I'll just buy it straight up. Like, I don't wanna co wholesale it, you know, just because I know like it's big out here with Keeley and all them and we just talk with him, but in Vegas it's like you, you co wholesale and you're a daisy chainer, they're like dude, I don't wanna deal with you. You know, and so I wanna maintain my relationship with these guys. Like, alright, he's gonna be buying it and flipping it.

So anything I get from them, I buy it. Anything we self generate, whether it's through our direct marketing or the MLS, we'll blast it out no matter what. I will not buy it before we blast it out. And then from there we decide, oh, we can only get five like December the opposite. Oh, we only get five.

I'm buying it. Oh, we can get 20. Alright, we'll sell it.

Steve: Yeah. If you can get 20 on the wholesale Mhmm. You'll sell it.

Ryan: No. Not 20. But, I would say our minimum would be, like, 10. 10. If we can't make at least 10, then I'd rather just buy it.

Unless it's just a property that I don't want for you know, it's like, dude, this property is like too big of a job or maybe it's like I don't like expensive homes personally, so maybe it's a really expensive home. I'm like, dude, no matter what, I'm not buying it. So we'll sell it for whatever we can get.

Steve: What's the price range at your target?

Ryan: For me, I love the sub $2.50. Yeah. I love entry level homes because you're not competing with new builds, you know, because there's nationwide a shortage of entry level and affordable housing and so if you get like a 300,000 plus home, you're competing with new builds. I don't wanna my flips can't compete with a new build.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: You know? You well, you pick your all your own stuff and whatever. So if I'm in the 2 hundreds, you can't buy a new build for 200,000. Yeah. So who are you going to if you need a move in ready home?

Like, I'm the only supplier. So it's like you're either gonna buy my home, you know, for top value or you're gonna go buy, you know, a piece of crap for less. Mhmm. And that's the choice you gotta make

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: As a buyer.

Steve: Gotcha. So we got some questions here from, YouTube. Chris Norman wants to know what was the best method for you to build a buyer's list?

Ryan: You know, it's kinda weird because in Vegas, there's really not that many, like, volume buyers. I mean, I could give you the top five, and they're gonna buy 80% of the deals, to be honest. And so it's not really, like, a huge thing here in Vegas, but, you know, Sean Bob, who you met, he does our dispo now, and he attends meetups. He, you know, goes on Facebook groups. He goes and, you know, just networks and does all that stuff.

Ironically, you know, we have buyers or not buyer we have wholesalers who, you know, they'll send me a deal and then they'll cc every buyer on it. I'm like, alright, Sean Bob, go take all these buyers names. Like like, you know, it's funny, dude. I'm like, this is, like, so careless. Yeah.

And, so, you know, those are ways you can do it. Another way is, you know, if you are on every wholesalers list, you know, look up who bought the property after, you know, it sells. Alright. Then you'll see who they're selling to. Super simple.

Steve: Absolutely. And then, he wants to know, did you get buy most of your properties off the MLS or at a courthouse auction?

Ryan: I've never a lot of people used to ask that because that was, like, the biggest way to buy properties, the easiest. They're just such terrible deals that I didn't I didn't waste my time.

Steve: Terrible deals as in other people are bidding it too high? Yeah. Gotcha. And,

Ryan: so I always focus my time on the MLS and just meeting wholesalers. Like, if I can go meet wholesalers and be a resource to them, I'm gonna get more deals. But, you know, it's funny. When I started, I didn't have a lot of money. You know, I needed all my money for my down payment.

And so also, no one ever taught me how to market. So, and I never followed up. Even when I was a realtor, I never had a CRM or anything. I didn't know what I was doing. And so I pretty much was like, well, how do I get deals for free?

And the MLS was the only way I knew how.

Steve: I was

Ryan: like, in fact, I can get paid to get this deal because I get my commission.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: And so, I just really honed my skills on the MLS, and that was how I got the majority of my first deals. And then in, like, 2016 when I realized what a wholesaler was, I was like, these guys do all the work for you? This is tight. And so, I loved it. I was like, where do I find these guys?

And so, like, I was calling bandit signs. I was going to meetups, and I was meeting all these guys. And then, you know, I just started meeting them all. And they send me deals, and I buy them, and it was great.

Steve: So how much of your operation is wholesale? How much of it is flipping?

Ryan: I would say, like, 70 to 75% flip. Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: Okay. So what does your organization look like today?

Ryan: So with all the companies, you know, mainly, I have five companies. There's wholesale flipping, the brokerage, education, and, my rentals. And so, like, on the flipping side, all I have are two project managers. You know, they do everything with the properties. They go see them.

They go bid them. You know, they handle all the repair requests. They check on them, all that stuff. And so those guys are on salary, and, they do a great job. My dad is one of them, so it's awesome being able to work with him.

I have my sister who's pretty much my right hand on everything I do. You know, she handles wholesaling, flipping, every as you'll like in my company, we're small, but everyone has multiple hats. You know, you don't need, like, dedicated hats, even at a high level like we're doing. Like, so many people wanna, okay, he only does this. He only does like, people can wear multiple hats.

Mhmm. Okay. So on the flipping side, that's it. Like, all you need is a couple project managers and, like, a transaction coordinator, essentially.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so, on the wholesaling side, Noelle, once again, she helps with that. And, I have Sean Bob, who you met. He does dispositions and, you know, texting and, like honestly, I don't really know what he does half the time. He'll he'll tell you more than me. Yeah.

And then we have my guy, Michael, who is pretty much, like, our head acquisitions guy. So he's he's great on the phones and all that. And then we've got two leads managers, who, you know, just follow-up with leads all day. And then, this isn't really kind office, but I also have, like, probably five or six of my realtors from the brokerage who are actively being trained by us once a week, to door knock, cold call on their own. And, you know, when they get a deal, we partner with them and all that stuff.

So, they're not in the office, but get a deal, we partner with them and all that stuff. So, they're not in the office, but they're out there doing stuff. Yeah. And, so that's the wholesaling side on the brokerage. Like I said, I've got my partner who lists all of our flips.

So I'm hands off with that. I let him handle all the negotiations and all that. And, you know, we got about 50 agents now, so it's great. Education, I need to do a better job at that. I don't really promote it too much, but, you know, I've got my book, which has helped a lot of people and a course and our Facebook group that you're in.

So, you know, that doesn't take a lot of time. Yeah. And then, rental wise, I've got about 30 units, and, you know, I've got property manager that does them all.

Steve: Do you guys do property management at your at your brokerage?

Ryan: Absolutely not. I don't wanna get in that business.

Steve: I don't think there's any industry that's hated more, on on the than property managers because you get you get crap from the landlord and the tenant.

Ryan: No one likes you. They're they're equivalent to umpires in baseball. Like Yeah. No team likes you.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: You're always wrong.

Steve: Always wrong. Yeah. The best example, because I was the only someone that was coming from property management. She's like, anytime the refrigerator breaks, landlords like, tenants like someone's gotta pay for my food. Yeah.

And I was like, go deal with it yourself. You guys eat it. Like, just

Ryan: Yeah. Landlord's like, you need to fix your fridge. You broke it.

Steve: Right. This is always always a lose lose. So, Fasha Zellen wants to know, are you marketing to distressed owners, or are you just focusing on realtors and wholesalers?

Ryan: So we do our own direct marketing now. Like I said, up until 2018, I never marketed. And so 2018 was the first year we did it. And, honestly, just, like, figuring crap out, you know, just throwing stuff against the wall, and somehow we were getting deals. Like, I look back now a year and a half later, I'm like, I don't even know how we got deals doing what we were doing.

Mhmm. Honestly. And so that once again goes to show, like, just take action

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: And things will happen. You'll realize later, like, wow I was an

Steve: idiot.

Ryan: And so, as far as distressed sellers now, yeah, like, we on our direct to seller, front, you know, we go after all the same motivations other people go after. You know, we do the NODs, the, NOSs, the, you know, high equity. All these things guys do, we do. There's really no secret sauce. I think what it comes down to is your sales team.

That's what I've realized over a year and a half of marketing is, like, people are so focused on the marketing channel, and they forget the other half of sales, and the sales channel is far more important than the marketing channel. Like, if you can't convert all these dollars you're spending, what does it matter?

Steve: Right.

Ryan: And so, yeah, that's really, like, the big revelation I have is, like, you need to work on sales skills.

Steve: Gotcha. And then, Kareem wants to know, are all your agents flippers?

Ryan: No. No. I would say maybe five to 10% actually flip. Mhmm. You know, another 10% wholesale.

But I think the majority of our agents want to. You know, that's eventually a goal.

Steve: And it's That's why they're at your broker.

Ryan: That's why they're there. You know? But it it always it's not like they wanna scale and, like, do something crazy. It's just like, if I could do one a year, cool. Like, that's a lot of money.

Steve: Right. Right. And then Kevin Saunders wants to know, what would your how would your strategy change if the market goes down?

Ryan: So that's another thing we were talking about. That's something I'm, definitely preparing for, and I don't know what the the Fed made the announcement today, and I think I saw that they plan not to chase change rates, which is good. That's something people need to watch because last year, you know, like I was saying back in, September, October, they announced, hey. We're gonna raise rates. Mhmm.

And then in Vegas, we went from, like, 4,000 sales a month to, like, 1,500. It just people were like, eff it.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: I don't want it. And, so I'm I'm closely watching what the Fed's doing, what our inventory is. You know, I'm just trying to keep a really close pulse because, man, when things change, you gotta be ready. Yeah. You know?

Because as a flipper, there's a lot of risk.

Steve: Well, that's where I think most of the risk is.

Ryan: Oh, yeah. The wholesalers don't get it. Right. Because they they just wholesale homes, and they get their quick buck, and they're good. And that's cool.

We wholesale too. But I've been on the other side, like, even last year where, you know, we have all these properties we're expecting to sell in four months and then they take eight, nine months and now we lose money. Yeah. You know? And so it's like, alright, you know, I just went through that where, you know, I lost a lot of money because, you know, when you're doing a high volume and you have, you know, say 50 properties that take five more months to sell than you think, do the math.

Right. You're gonna lose. Now granted, in 2019, we've been pretty good, haven't lost any money on any deals in 2019, buying more conservative, and that's why I was saying like last year we bought about 140 homes. This year I have no desire to do that. Like I will probably buy 80 to 100.

Because I wanna be safer with our deals and hedge my risk and if we go into the winter and something happens again, I'm not as exposed. Right. And if I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Great. They're gonna sell and, you know, no no love lost and we'll continue.

But I think, man, we're at the point where something's gonna happen.

Steve: So, Hart wants to know, are you doing anything with low equity, creative financing?

Ryan: Yeah. So, I actually just had this, meeting with the guys on Monday because they were like, well, how do we do sub twos and this and that? I'm like, there's a lot of value in sub twos. Like, if you can do them, there are people who will pay retail for them because they can't get a loan. Yeah.

And so, even if it's low equity and it cash flows a lot, you know, great. Like we just got one last week where the mortgage is $770 and it rents for 1,400 and there's not a lot of equity in it, but who cares?

Steve: Alright, who cares?

Ryan: Yeah, and so if I keep it as a rental, great. If I can wholesale it, like I said, make 15.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: I'm cool with that too. Right. And somebody, would you pay retail for that if you had a loan that good?

Steve: Hell yeah, I'd pay that.

Ryan: Yeah, so there's a lot of money to be made in creative finance deals where other people walk, oh, they owe too much. Well, that's actually pretty good. In the creative finance world, owing too much can actually be a good thing because you have less money out of pocket. Cause if your seller says, hey, I wanna walk away with $5, but, you know, whatever and it's 2¢, well, let me rephrase that. Let's say your seller wants $2.50 and they owe $2.45.

Steve: It's like,

Ryan: okay, I only gotta come out of pocket $5. Let's say they want $2.50 but they owe 200. Now you gotta come out of pocket $50. Yeah. So it makes the sub two less appealing.

Mhmm. You know? But if you only gotta come out of pocket $5, you're gonna cash flow $600.

Steve: Yeah. That's good. That's very good perspective. Matt wants to know, what's your best marketing channel in Vegas?

Ryan: For us, man, we've been cold calling since day one when we started. Mhmm. We were talking about this. Like, I had in house cold callers and, you know, we had, like, six guys in house and we we got deals and but, man, it just frustrated me watching people in house because, you know, guys weren't working and this and that. And I'm like, oh my gosh.

And then, like, we couldn't play ping pong because there wasn't enough space. And so there's a lot of reasons I didn't like it. So, now we're just virtual and, you know, we got some Filipinos. I gotta rep my people, you know, and, you know, they they do good. It's I wouldn't say it's like, you know, the crazy, like, everyone cold calls at this point, but, you know, we're doing some texting.

I've tried everything. Like, right now, we're in the process of trying PPC for the first time. It sucks. We haven't got anything. You know, we tried direct mail for three months.

Didn't get anything. I even bought some billboards. We didn't get anything.

Steve: Yeah. Billboards is rough.

Ryan: Yeah. And, yeah, it didn't get anything and, I even went back to try newspaper ads again from my, you know, when I started and, you know, haven't got anything, but consistently we've always gotten deals from cold calling and texting and door knocking too. I forgot to mention that like my guys, I was telling you about who door knock. I mean we get a couple of deals every month from door knocking,

Steve: wow, that's awesome.

Ryan: That would cost you a

Steve: dollar. That's the best part about all these. Yeah. That their, cost per lead are very low. Yep.

And you have to sign a contract. Yep. Right?

Ryan: Super easy.

Steve: If you're doing billboards, radio, TV Oh, my gosh. You gotta sign contracts on top of the high expense.

Ryan: Yeah dude. I'm not about that.

Steve: Christian Samoyoy wants to know, can you see yourself ever going 100% wholesaling?

Ryan: Absolutely not. I think because, A, I don't really like the wholesaling game as much because I'm not really a marketer. Like, I honestly, looking at KPIs and stuff, I stop looking at it. Like, if you talk to my guys, they'll be like, no, he's not gonna look at Podio. Like, he don't even know how to log in.

Yeah. To to the honest truth, I've maybe spent an hour on Podio in my life because I look at it and my mind just like, I'm like, what am I even looking at right now? It's like so ugly. And, so I really don't like the wholesaling aspect. I like, you know, relationship aspect of like, oh, hey, Steve the realtor, you wanna do a deal?

Tight. Right. Steve's the wholesaler, I'll buy all your deals all day. And like, I look look at it as like, honestly, because we have the back end system built with, you know, fixing them up and everything, like, to me it looks like free money. As long as I make a decision, like a good decision, like, oh, you're you're just giving me this for free?

Cool. Right. You know? Why would I ever stop doing that?

Steve: Yeah. Let's see. Jordan Cast wants to know if you're in any other markets.

Ryan: Just Big Bear. That's where I've got my Airbnbs. We've got five Airbnbs up there and, two we're working on right now. I'm actually selling a flip tomorrow up there. So, we've done some flips up there.

AirBeam, I like it, man, because

Steve: How far is that for you?

Ryan: Three and a half.

Steve: Okay.

Ryan: Yeah. So it's super close. I'm actually going there Friday to furnish our our newest one. I love it for many reasons. One, because I like vacation there.

Have you ever been?

Steve: Yeah. Okay. I think I think that's where we went for snowboarding. Okay. It's like North of, Orange County.

Northeast of Orange County.

Ryan: Northeast. Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. So, like, two hours from LA.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: And so I love it because, a, it it cash flows really well. And people from Arizona go, people from Cali go, people from Vegas go. It's just a a quick little trip for everyone.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: So the location is prime. The second thing I like is I'm so used to, and you guys are too in Phoenix, like high competition on every deal. Like, you know, oh, you've talked to five people already. Great. Like, how do I differentiate myself from you?

And so, in Big Bear, they're like, no one's ever called me. Cool. Like, you wanna buy my house? I'm like, yeah. Like, you know, but still, I we honestly don't even market that much out there because you have the other problem of no one buys.

You know? So, like, if you are wholesaling Mhmm.

Steve: What are

Ryan: you gonna do? Who do you sell to? You're gonna sell to me. Yeah. But, honestly, you are because I've had many people wholesalers because they just know I buy up there and they're like, do you want this?

And I'm like, no. That deal sucks. Like Right. Because if I'm gonna buy in Big Bear, it's gotta be super deep. Yeah.

Because What what

Steve: was what defines super deep?

Ryan: So the one I just bought that we're rehabbing, I paid $1.50 for. We're putting $70 into it. It's a big rehab. Mhmm. It's gonna be worth, like, $3.20.

So, basically, a 100 k spread.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: I'm keeping it, though. And then, like, the other one I just bought for $2.70, we're putting 35. It's worth, like, $4.30.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: So, like, I need a giant spread to do a deal there because I'm not doing volume. You know? Right. I'm not trying to, like I can't there's just no contractors up there, honestly. So it's super hard to scale.

So that's why And it's

Steve: a lot more expensive in California than this.

Ryan: Yeah. Cali's more expensive. Finding workers is hard.

Steve: Well, I'm talking about just yeah. Just finding workers

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: In California. I think it's, like, almost double compared to Arizona.

Ryan: Yeah. But Big Bear is kinda different because it's so small. Like, it's kinda like the boonies with, you know, they're they're just like, oh, you like, they want work, you know, because there's just not people buying homes. Yeah. So, you know, it it has its pros and cons with no competition.

Steve: Right. Yeah. That makes sense.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: So then how much are you guys spending monthly on marketing then?

Ryan: Right now, we've got six cold callers in The Philippines. You know, that cost, like, probably 4,000 a month. And, you know, we do some texting. Not a lot. I don't even know what I can't imagine it's more than a thousand bucks.

Mhmm. And we're trying the PPC right now, which is my budget's, like, 10,000 on it. I just really wanna try it, but they're not even spending it. He's, like, testing it and stuff. And

Steve: Really? Yeah. Dude, I can break through 10,000 so fast here.

Ryan: He I hired a company to do it. Right? And they're just like, yeah. You know, we're gonna test it and see this and that. And, I haven't got any leads from like, well, I've got a lead, but I haven't got no deals from it.

Steve: And When I when I when I waved the white flag last year Yeah. I'll spend I I was budgeting 9 k a month Okay. PPC. Yeah. And I said, this is just

Ryan: this is just It sucks. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and I You have to

Steve: you have to do a deal every single month for it to be worth it. Yeah. And there's no guarantee you're doing a deal every single month.

Ryan: Yeah. But I think the thing too for us that skews it is, like, so that deal where you're only gonna make, you know, $2,000, I can flip it and make 20. Mhmm. Now my ROI is great. Right.

So, it's a little different as a flipper, and I actually had another flipper tell me that. He's like, honestly, PPC might work for you. Like we're not getting big spreads on PPC as a wholesaler, but you'll find flips that work.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: And so, I don't know. I'm gonna give it another month. And if it doesn't, I'll just cut it off. Yeah. So to answer the question, right now, probably like ten.

My idea is to keep it around ten.

Steve: Gotcha.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: And then one thing that, we don't talk a lot about on, on this show, but, you know, I can't remember which Facebook group you and I were both, commenting on. We were talking about profitability. And profitability is something that's super important to you. Yeah. So what is your target targeted profitability in in all your operations?

Ryan: So with me, I try and stay as lean and efficient as possible. Because, like like we were talking about, when I started, I was a one man show flipping, not spending any marketing dollars. I was running a 100% profit. I didn't have a office or anything. Yeah.

And so I'm used to that. I'm like, oh, man. If, like, I'm not making near a 100%,

Steve: this is not a

Ryan: good thing. And so, when I started diving into what wholesaling was, I originally thought, like most people, I'm like, damn, that dude just made $50.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: But he really didn't.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: Right? Like, you know, I think from who I've talked to, like, the most profitable wholesale companies might net 40%. I don't know what you've heard.

Steve: I hear it's a lot higher.

Ryan: I

Steve: hear I hear it's more than 50 because of the margins. Right? Like, if your target if your margins are 15 to 20 Yeah. Then it's realistic to get north north of 50.

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: But, yeah, if your margins are, like, 10 Yeah.

Ryan: Then it's gonna be talking, like, at a a really high level when you're spending

Steve: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Ryan: If you're I'm not talking the $10,000 level.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're talking, like, the people running massive operations. I don't know what their true profitability is.

I've never seen a p and l

Ryan: Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. On a big company.

Ryan: Yeah. So I think, like, for a big company, let's just say, you know, they're running 40%. Like, to make a million dollars, you gotta, you know, do, like, 2 and a half million. Yeah. That's a lot of wholesale fees.

Steve: That's a lot of wholesale fees.

Ryan: Or, like, as a flipper, I can go buy 50 deals. You know? Mhmm. And, like, I'll for sure net a million dollars.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: And so to me, it's like the flipping has such higher profitability, you know, because my overhead is just basically the the $8 a month I pay my property managers, and that's it. You know? Because the profit is built into the flips, you know, p and l. Yeah. You know?

Or not the profit, all the cost. Mhmm. So, I I would say as far as the flipping side goes, like, profitability, true net profit, I aim to make 20,000 a flip.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: That's my aim. Will I take deals where I make 15? On occasion, if it's a super safe deal, like a hotel or something like that. Right?

Steve: Right. Just carbon paying.

Ryan: Yeah. Like, okay. I'll just whatever. So I always aim for that. On the wholesale side, that's something I'm still figuring out, like, what do I wanna do?

Like, at the end of the day, if I spend, you know, 10,000 a month, that's not a lot in terms of like what other guys are doing. Mhmm. I can definitely run a much leaner operation, but I just need to get more focused with who we're targeting and how we're targeting, because I've tried that approach. Like, you know, I your buddy, you know, our buddy Jared, we were talking, you know, like he's been sending, like, you know, a million texts and, you know, doing all this stuff. And I was like, you know what?

Jared's sending a million texts. I'm gonna try sending a million texts. And so I had Sean Bob like texting 10,000 people a day and, we got like, we got like shut down by the provider because he's like, oh, you know, like, you can't send this many texts, bro. And I was like, we I looked at the results after like a month of doing it. I'm like, we didn't get any more deals.

We just spent more money and we didn't get any more deals. Like Right. And like everyone is all stressed out, like, you know, trying to get through all these leads.

Steve: I think the the difference too though is that Jared's sending a million texts nationwide.

Ryan: Yeah, true.

Steve: You're sending a million texts in one market.

Ryan: No, and that's the point I was getting at too is like when you go to like a higher, yeah, like, hey, I wanna market 30,000 even in a market, right? You have to go broad. There's just, you can't go niche trying to market that much.

Steve: So

Ryan: you just become less efficient as you go more broad.

Steve: Right.

Ryan: And so that's the decision, like, I'm thinking about as well. Hey, if we can get just even four or five deals a month on $10 and we're making, you know, 20 on each, just call it because we're either wholesaling it or flipping it. Mhmm. One way we're gonna make 20, you know. It's like, well, if you can make a $100 on $10, you know, granted you've got commissions that you're paying your guys and this and that.

So Right. You know, call it, you're running like 70% profit

Steve: Mhmm. On the

Ryan: wholesale side. So I think that's the the way I would rather go versus, oh, you know what, let's try and make, you know, X amount of money. I don't wanna hire people.

Steve: Me neither. And that's, that's, I can tell you the between running a brokerage and running our traditional real estate team, you know, spending 38 ks a month in each operation on the on the wholesale side, I am freaking cheap. Right? So we're targeting 75% profitability in our wholesale business because I don't need any more expenses. I'm good.

Ryan: And that's what I think I'm leaning towards to after because like I said, wholesaling is pretty new to me in terms of what we're doing. Mhmm. But I think that's my my model I'm going for too. And even if it's $50.50, you know, but being lean doing it, I'm good with that. Yeah.

You know, because I'd rather pay my guys more and do less personally and be good. Right. So, yeah, I would say, because you were asking me this before, I think, on Facebook, like, what's your total monthly nut? And between, like, the wholesaling, you know, like I said, we spend about $10. On the flipping side, I've got my project managers who make 8.

We got our office, which is $2,000, you know, so you got $20 there. And then, like my brokerage is like $6 a month, so you know, we're spending like 26, call it 30 for crap I'm not seeing. Mhmm. You know, so $30 a month's not a big nut for three companies

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: Which are all producing different types of revenue.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. I would kill for 30 k total a month between all the entities. Alright. So Forrest wants to know, what's when you're targeting MLS for finding flips, is there a specific strategy you're using for finding flips in MLS?

Ryan: Yeah. And this is why I wrote the book. I would say just read my book, Flip Your Future, because I talk about all the different ways you can find deals on the MLS.

Steve: Is that on Amazon?

Ryan: It's on Amazon. Yep.

Steve: Alright.

Ryan: And not to be short, but there's, like, a lot of ways.

Steve: So so when you first started fixing and flipping, Killa wants to know how did you learn to estimate the repair costs?

Ryan: So that's a funny, kinda story I discuss in the book too. So when I first started, I don't know why I thought this, but in my mind I was like, oh, that's 20. Like, that was just like the go to number. I didn't even look at square footage. I'm like, this house is a piece of crap, so probably like $20 will fix it.

Yeah. And like

Steve: you found out very quickly.

Ryan: Yeah. As I started fixing them, I realized it was, like, costing me deals because I don't know my numbers. And, you know, I'd be like, well, that one cost $40 and, I didn't make money.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And then I'd be like, that one only cost $10 and, like, you know, I could've, or I'll think back on a previous deal that I lost because I overestimated. Mhmm.

Steve: I was

Ryan: like, I could've bought that deal.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: Just the same house. Right. So, yeah, it developed over time and then, I heard about the the price per square footway where, you know, $10 a foot, $15.20, 25, and that actually works pretty good. Like, you'd be surprised how accurate it is. Now granted, like, in other markets, it's gonna be different.

Right? Cali isn't gonna use that. K?

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: So you just have to take the same concept, though, and apply it to Cali. It's like, okay. Full interior remodel. K. Ryan says it's $20, but here in Cali, it's $40.

Yeah. Okay. We'll just adjust it, and now you know.

Steve: This is double everything for California.

Ryan: Yeah. Pretty much. Or New York.

Steve: Yeah. I can't imagine New York with all with all the unions.

Ryan: I used to have a duplex in Buffalo. Buffalo is cheap.

Steve: But Yeah. So what is your why?

Ryan: Man, so when I first started, my why was, like, to get out of couch flipping, to be honest. It was like, hey. I just like, god, give me, like, something better to do than what I'm doing. This is not fulfilling.

Steve: I think the Couch King is

Ryan: a pretty good name. Dude, I'm gonna change my Instagram. And so, it was strictly that. I was like, how do I get out of this? And, you know, I did it and I was like, this is freaking sweet.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And like I said, I was a one man show for a while, so it was like just pretty much fulfilling me and my family. Once I got employees and, you know, all these other people who depend on me and once I got on Instagram and like, you know, started gaining a little bit of a following, I realized it wasn't like really all about me. There was a lot of people who A, their families depended on me, you know, making sure we have a successful company and then B, there's all these people watching me on Instagram who are like really taking it in and like being influenced. And, so I realized, like, I need to continue to, to do this at a high level for them and their families so they can, you know, sleep well at night and not stress, but I also need to set a good example for, you know, these people who are watching that I don't even know about because there's just so many people that are doing it a way that I don't agree with, you know, in terms of, like, lifestyle and stuff like that. Like, you know, I'm all about, like I was saying in the Facebook group, we have a saying called raise.

Right? Relationships, assets, intellect, spirituality, and exercise. Like, I'm trying to be balanced in all of those

Steve: things

Ryan: because most people are not. You know, most people are just strictly workaholics and like they neglect their family to make a dollar. They neglect their faith to go pursue the dollar. They their health is terrible, you know? Yeah.

And life's not about that, man. It's not about like making more money. It's about improving your life. Mhmm. Life is not just about money.

And so I'm just trying to show that with my Instagram, Like, hey, look. This is, like, what I do every day. Just so you guys really can see it, like, I'm exercising every day. I'm going to church. I'm working, doing my thing.

I'm spending time with my family. Like, you know, I'm trying to better myself and learn and, you know, and just try and live that balanced life so that people can, you know, see that, like, oh, man, he's not like, you know, these other guys who just, like, are just all about work, work, work, work, money.

Steve: Well and that's something that I can say coming from the corporate world. World. Right? Like, you see these guys working crazy hours and we're always like as an as an employee back at Intel, I was like, why are these guys working so freaking hard? Yeah.

You know, like, they're making the same no matter how hard they work. So Yeah. If they're on salary, then the only thing we can come up with, like, they must hate their family. Like, that's the only reason why they're working so damn hard. But to hit on your other point, you're talking about exercise.

You were talking about how you hate running. Yeah. I personally hate running. I just don't enjoy running. I've hated running.

I've fought it my whole life.

Ryan: Why did you start doing it?

Steve: Because the doctor said I was getting too fat. The doctor's like, you need to work out. You need to exercise. Like,

Ryan: quit eating them donuts. They're delicious.

Steve: But the doctor was like, if you don't change your habits, you know, you're not gonna live as long a life. And, you know Yeah. You've got one kid. I've got three. Yeah.

And, like, you know, we're working hard, but if we can't spend it later on Yeah. Like, why are we working What's the point? Yeah. They're

Ryan: not well, I'm not even gonna be there for them. Yeah. And that was the point. Like, you know, obviously, I do that stuff on Instagram so people can see it.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And then, like, that's why I created the Facebook group because there's a ton of Facebook groups dedicated to wholesale and dedicated to building business. But I haven't seen any that are dedicated to, like, hey. Let's have, like, an actual balanced life where people are talking about these things that no one talks about in groups.

Steve: Yeah.

Ryan: And so, yeah, if anyone wants to be a part of it, it's the Future Flipper Facebook group. So

Steve: Yep. Awesome. It's a great book. It's a great group. I'm in it.

And then what is your biggest struggle right now?

Ryan: Biggest struggle? I would say, like I said, the whole selling piece of it, man, I legit hate, like, Podio and, like, like, picking new marketing and looking at I I hate it, dude. And, I'm really trying to figure out, like because I don't like to delegate things unless I fully understand it.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And so I can't really pawn it off yet until I understand it. And so we're grinding through it, learning and trying to get better at it every day because I know, you know, it's it's such a good stream of income.

Steve: But that's such a key piece. Right? Like, you wanna understand it before you delegate it. And you see it so many times in the in these other, Facebook groups. The whole sales, like, how do I find a caller?

How do I find a caller? I was like, you need

Ryan: to pick up the phone Yeah. And call

Steve: Yeah. And deal with this crap Yeah. Before you delegate it. So you wanna understand it. It's, the in a different coaching program I'm in, they call it abdication versus delegation.

And to be too many people just give it up Yep. While understanding it.

Ryan: So And I'm guilty of that. Like, when we first started, I was like, freaking call people and get deals, and no deals came. I'm like, I don't get it. Why can't you get deals? Yeah.

And, you know, I I finally I took a step back. I'm like, okay. I need to actually immerse myself. So I went on appointments for a week. I went and, like, played for Podia for, like, five minutes and, like, looked at it.

But then, like, I was talking to our leads guy. I'm like, tell me how a lead is processed. Like, what's the what's the formula? And they're like, oh, you know, I answer it, then he answers it. I'm like, how?

Like, I didn't even understand there, but they had figured it out. Mhmm. And then I'm looking at them, like, well, why don't we do it this way? And they're like, oh, yeah. Yeah.

That'd probably be a better way. Right. And it's just like, I don't know these things unless I'm actually in it. Yeah.

Steve: You can't off you can't help. No.

Ryan: And it it's tough when you come from the other side of everybody just gives you deals. Hey, Ryan. You want a deal? Here's wholesale I'm like, yeah. Thanks.

And now you're trying to create deals, and it's like, this is a whole different beast in itself.

Steve: Yeah. What is your superpower?

Ryan: Superpower, man. Man, I think it's like that balance like you talked about. Like, I think, you know, I have enough discipline not to, like, get caught up with all this other stuff, like, people give you crap for drinking a a little free drink at the the bar.

Steve: Yeah. Ryan and I were talking beforehand. Like, I can't drink something at a bar unless it's got an umbrella in it.

Ryan: Yeah. I'm like, I'll drink that. I don't care. Like, I don't care about people's expectations. And, we were making fun of, like, Sean Bob's coffee that he was drinking.

Yeah. Like this. With cream, I'm like, I'll drink that. Whatever. You know?

I'm not afraid to, like, make fun of myself and, like, be comfortable in my own skin. And so, it it goes with the same thing of, you know what? I don't care if I, you know, don't have a super nice car.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: Granted, I have one right now. You know, I've got a nice Lexus. But before that before this year, when my son was born, I drove for, like, six years straight in a car that had a 100,000 plus miles, and I was making a lot of money before that. Mhmm. But I could care less what people think.

You know? Yeah. I lived in a house that was way, you know, below my means. And, you know, I've got a nicer house now because it was a good deal.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: But, it's just like so many people have this, like, feeling of, like, man, I've gotta I've gotta prove to people this or that. And

Steve: Keep up with the Jones.

Ryan: Gotta keep up with the Joneses. Like, I love the book, The Millionaire Next Door.

Steve: Have you

Ryan: ever read it?

Steve: Yeah. It's a great book.

Ryan: I love it because, man, like, that's the downfall of so many people is the expectations.

Steve: Yeah. I love it. And I think there's, absolute truth. Right? I mean, we're connected, more on social media, and I see what you're doing and the messages out there.

There, so I think definitely the balance. Yeah. You're living it. So I'm gonna ask you for your last thought before we do that. Guys, if you want a copy of our assignment contract, the stuff that we put in there with a lot of teeth, text assignment to 345345.

And next Wednesday, we got Antonio Edwards coming in for the show. If someone wanted to, reach you, how would they get a hold of you?

Ryan: Best way is through Instagram, All Star Investor. I'm also on Facebook. Just Ryan Pineda. Yeah. You know, like, if you wanna join our Facebook group like we're talking about and other things I've got going, you can go to ryanpineda.com.

Steve: Yeah. Alright, guys. So if you like this show, you know, please share this episode right now. Subscribe. Let other people know about it.

So last thoughts. My last thoughts? Yep.

Ryan: I don't know.

Steve: What do you think? Message. Something that people just need to hear or something that, you know, you're you're you're saying a lot to other people?

Ryan: You know, I think the biggest thing okay. Last thought would be this. A lot of people want to, like, do big things and scale and, like, you know, they're gonna watch this interview right now and be like, okay. Like, I wanna flip a 100 homes or whatever. Like, don't think like that.

Like, you and I were talking about this. Do not let anyone else, like, place undue expectations on you or influence on, like, what your business should look like. Okay? Like, I know there's a lot of people who have successful businesses by themselves and make hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Steve: There

Ryan: are people I've seen make millions of dollars with three people and then there are people who have twenty, thirty, forty, fifty employees and they make millions of dollars. Like, don't think you have to be like him or like me or like someone else. You know, do what's right for your family, your situation and everything like that because, you know, not everyone fits in the same box, you know. I think, like, when I teach people, I try and say, tell me your situation. How much money do you have?

How much experience do you have? And just be straight up.

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: Okay. That's what you have. Here's what I would do in your current situation. You know? I saw it so much in baseball, like, with hitting coaches and everyone.

Like, they try and teach their philosophy on hitting. Like, hey. Your swing needs to be like this or you're not gonna make it. And you watch the major leagues and everyone's got a different swing.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. No one has

Ryan: No one has the same swing. The fundamental swing. Yeah. Everyone's got their style and what works for them and so it's the same with real estate. You don't need to be a wholesaler, you don't need to be a flipper or what like, you don't need a giant operation.

You need to figure out what works for you and what makes you happy

Steve: Mhmm.

Ryan: And what's gonna be best for your life as a whole, not for making the most money.

Steve: Yeah. I think that's a great message. Guys, thank you for watching. Thank you.

Ryan: Thank you, guys.

Steve: It was an incredible show. Oh. Appreciate it. Yeah.