Charles Hernandez & Michael Llanas Share How They Use Sub2, Wrap, & Private Money to Build Their Portfolio while Wholesaling & Flipping

Steve Trang: Hey, everybody. Thank you for joining us for today's episode of Real Estate Disrupters. Today, we have Charles Hernandez and Michael Yanez with Homebuying Home Selling Solutions, and they flew in from San Antonio to share how they built their portfolio with sub two, rap, private money, all while wholesaling and flipping. It was actually really hard to get these guys on the show. I had to lock them down in Houston at whole scaling, whole scaling live to finally get them to commit.

So this is a treat for all of us.

Michael Llanas: You're so busy.

Charles Hernandez: If this

Steve: is your first time tuning in, I'm Steve Trang, broker and owner of Stunning Homes Realty, founder of the OfferFast Homes app, the only MLS for off market wholesale properties. And I am on a mission to create 100 millionaires. If that's something you wanna do, let's connect on Instagram at steve dot trang. If you're excited for today's show, please give me a wave. Give me a thumbs up.

And as a friendly reminder, I don't charge a dime for this show. I don't make any money doing this. So here's all I ask. This is what it costs for you guys to listen to this show. I've been advised by a consultant that to in order to hit some of my crazy goals, I need to get the 505 star reviews in iTunes.

So please do me a favor. Go on iTunes. Subscribe. Give a five star review. If you can write what you like about the show, that'll be even better.

And this is a live show, so please ask your questions for Charles and Michael to answer. You ready?

Michael: Let's go. We're ready, man.

Steve: Alright.

Charles: So Make

Michael: sure you guys do those five star reviews for this guy, man.

Steve: Yeah. I appreciate it.

Michael: Well well deserved.

Steve: So I'm gonna start with you because I think you're the senior member of the team. I'm guessing is so what got you into real estate?

Charles: Well, I would say cold because we're actually cold. But

Steve: Why? I recognize you guys are partners, but I'm guessing you probably

Charles: what got me into real estate was this, that, I was actually in the mortgage business Yeah. Before the crash. And, you know, I did really well doing that. I ran a few offices and stuff, and I actually did really well. But I didn't see the crash coming.

And, I had done some investments for the few homes, but I was more interested back then in in helping investors do what I do now. So I saw it from that perspective. And, when the when the crash came where you don't shut down just because you get a couple bad months.

Steve: No. But then all

Charles: of a sudden, all the banks started shutting down. We had people at the clothing table with no bank, and I took it really hard. I took it in the chin. I took it really hard. You know, lost a lot of money.

You know, went through depression, gained a lot of weight. And then around 2012, I just I told a buddy of mine, I said, man, I gotta I kept telling him for a year, I'm gonna make a change. I'm gonna make a change. And I decided open up home buying home selling. Right around that time, my daughter met Michael, and he was still in the army.

And, I think it was right around last part of 2012. I said, hey, man.

Michael: Yeah. That's how I got into real estate.

Charles: What are you gonna do? Yeah. So because that's how we that's how I decided, hey. I'm gonna go all in on this. So

Michael: Yeah. So, Jason, that question on my half. Right? So I was in the army for twelve years. And, last four of the 12, which was year number eight, I got stationed at Fort Sam, which Fort Sam is in San Antonio, so I got stationed where I was from.

So it was good for me. And when, Crystal introduced me to her stepdad, which is Charles, he's like, hey. Let me show you some real estate. I was like, nah. Not my I'm ready in the army.

You know, five to five. We gotta wake up early. We gotta go do PT. I ain't got time for that. Let me show you real estate, man.

It's easy and this and blah blah. And then when he said, hey. Let me pay for you to become a realtor. I was like, well, if you're gonna pay for it, let me see what this is about. Yeah.

And that's where it started from.

Charles: Yeah. And

Michael: that was back in 2012?

Charles: Yeah. Back then. And, he was a lot nicer to me back then. He was all, yes, sir. No, sir.

But, so, you know, what happened was we just started, and, we started the company and we weren't partners just yet. Mhmm. Because I used to get a lot of leads and I was still kinda thinking about going back into the mortgage. And back then, you know, the MLS came out and you couldn't be a realtor working mortgages and stuff. So I opened up a home I'm selling under a different broker.

I just owned the company. And so Michael came in. I would give him all the leads.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: And a couple of times, I would tell you, I had to tell him, hey, man. You can't get lost, man. I I understand you're getting paid from the army, but this is the real deal. We're dealing with people's lives, you know. And a few times, he got lost on me.

And I only had really to tell him I think it was once or twice. Right? And he got it. And after that, like, within six months, I'm serious. I was turning around.

I was like, you got how many deals? And,

Steve: So you guys hit the ground running then?

Charles: Yeah. We hit it, girl. You know, we we really hit it hard. You know?

Steve: Okay. So 2012, you guys are working together, and you guys just pretty much fly out of the gate. So what were you guys doing at that time to do to have

Charles: some great stuff?

Michael: 12, to be honest with you, we were mostly just doing traditional traditional real estate. We're talking about loans, traditional real estate, being a realtor, and then we got into flipping houses.

Charles: Let me tell

Michael: you how to

Charles: do that.

Michael: The investment part.

Charles: So for a long time, he just kept telling me, hey, man, I wanna flip a house. I wanna flip a house. So 13, I was I was really gun shy. I was afraid to tell him. And every single day almost, he was, I wanna flip a house.

I wanna flip a house. And we actually were in a room about this size. We sat right next to each other for, you know, every single day, seven days a week. We worked seven days a week. And somewhere along the line, we lost a yes, sir.

And and

Michael: so 2,000.

Charles: So so one day one day, he says, hey, man. We got a contract in the house. This is great. You know, what what house is it? No.

He goes, we got a contract in the house.

Steve: So he went ahead

Charles: and He was putting contracts in Come in.

Michael: Ready to go.

Charles: Without telling me. So so we don't buy property.

Steve: Forgiveness, not permission.

Charles: He he didn't he didn't tell me at all. And we don't normally don't buy property off the MLS, but he was putting contracts, you know, just left and

Charles: and right.

Charles: And, it was a it was a moment of truth. You know? He said, hey. Are we doing this? And I wanted to look at the property, and I said, let's do it, man.

Let's roll. Alright. And ever since then, what we did, we sat down and we said, okay. We're gonna do this together. I told him straight out.

I said, partnership bust up all time and for these reasons. We have to agree to these reasons. We have to agree that everything we do comes into APHS. There's no side deals ever. That's the first rule.

The second rule is that we both have a yes and a no. So if he wants to do something and I have my opportunity to say no, but I said, let's just go. I can't ever come back and say, hey, I told you so. And whatever whatever happens happens, we roll with it. That's that's the second thing.

And, the other thing is, what's really important is, all monies are $50.50. So we got that those three things out of the way. And ever since then, I mean, we've we've never had a problem. You know, we just go.

Steve: I like that that you set the ground rules.

Charles: We set the

Michael: ground rules from the beginning. Yeah. There's never any issues, any headaches, any bumps in the road. It was set from day one. And I think it's so far, so good.

Here we are eight years later.

Charles: So all dead. His debts, my debt, my debts, his debt. We consulted each other. We're gonna buy big ticket item. You know what I'm saying?

Our credits seem pretty much married together. So everything we do is

Steve: I love it.

Charles: Is is together.

Steve: So you started flipping in 2013?

Michael: '13. Yeah.

Charles: So you

Steve: guys started as traditional, started flipping in '13. And what were you making offers on at that time? So back then

Michael: because he was pre crash. Right? Not post crash. So I get it. He was hesitant.

But I'm like, man,

Charles: what are

Michael: you talking about the crash? What? We're in 2012. I'm ready to flip a house. I wanna do this.

I wanna do that. So I would just put offers on my list. Now, to be honest, lowball offers? Nope. Okay.

I tried. Lowball offered? And then one said, yes. I was like, alright. Well, let's go let's do this.

So, we did our first flip, right, with our personal money.

Charles: Well, actually, what happened was, I said, if you wanna do a flip because I had flip properties before. You need to come out here and do the work. So we went in there and we're like, well, what about this wall? And it had been years I've done it. So what is he wanted to take it out.

So I said, well, let's take it out.

Michael: Open concept.

Charles: So the next thing we know, it's bowing like this. This. And I said, no. No, man. So we put a a two by fours together, held it up.

And I said, we looked at each other and said, let's go do some contractors. So that's how we started our first crew, you know.

Steve: So you guys did well on the first flip? Yeah.

Michael: I was actually doing that. Pretty good. Yeah. For the first one. Yeah.

For me, anyways.

Steve: Okay. Yeah. So then you guys are flipping properties, and then what was the evolution after that?

Michael: We just kept flipping. To be honest, so I know a lot of people or wholesalers, not a lot of people, wholesalers start with wholesalers. We actually started with flipping houses. Mhmm. So we're flipping two, three, four, five houses at a time.

Charles: And traditional.

Michael: And doing the traditional real estate. And mind the house in the army. Mhmm. So it was real busy. So after work, you know, do this, do that, keeping into the, the flipping.

And then we get a deal. I was like, man, that's a good deal, but we're already we're pretty much leveraged with three, four flips. What's this wholesaling thing about?

Charles: Yeah. We started we started, because we never had mentors, you know?

Charles: Yeah.

Charles: And so we started hearing about wholesaling and we're like, woah. We didn't even know how to write the contract in Sears.

Steve: Well, you guys weren't even buying from wholesalers either.

Michael: No. We're buying So you didn't. We're buying our our own deals. Yeah. We're buying our own deals.

Yeah.

Charles: And so for so we were just researching and researching because people knew us already and they knew that we would flip properties, but we didn't want anybody to know that we didn't know anything about wholesaling.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: So we were researching, researching, and finally we just, man, let's just do it. And we did our first deal.

Michael: So we got the wholesale. I was like, man, that made how much? Yeah. Versus this flipper we've been doing for four months? Yeah.

Cool. Put it to the side. Can flip it. Another deal. I was like, man, this is probably the way to go here.

So we went from here,

Charles: to

Michael: drive, and let's let's let's focus more on wholesaling, and let's do a flipper here too.

Charles: Alright.

Michael: And that's where we're at now for

Charles: the most part.

Steve: Gotcha. And when was this transition where you started at wholesaling?

Charles: It started happening really started happening at 14 and 15. We started making a transition. You know, we started, we started making a transition from traditional, and we were still flipping and started doing more wholesale. But then we started talking about, you know, we need to start putting some properties aside. So we started trying to figure out, okay, how can we put properties aside?

So So I came when when the market crashed, I did a lot of credit financing for hard money lenders, you know. So I was kinda like the middle man. I would get paid to do that. So I had an understanding how to put deals together. And then we started hearing about subject to, and we just dove all in.

So if fourteen, fifteen, we really all those things were kinda like just coming together.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: And then we started putting properties aside and flipping properties, wholesale properties, traditional.

Charles: And it

Charles: was just he and I. Wow. Seven days a week.

Steve: Any staff at that time?

Charles: No. Not until 2016.

Steve: And how many deals were you guys doing at that? Or how many deals do you guys do in total in 2016?

Charles: We cracked we cracked I think it was 2016. We finally cracked a million.

Charles: Yeah.

Charles: But by the time we had a staff. So before that, we were still somewhere, you know, like, 300, 400,000, 500,000. Just you know that. Yeah. He actually his first two years, first three years, he was called up to NAWREP, which is, like, because he had the he was he was in the army.

He was closing sixty, seventy traditional deals a year. That's big, you know, because

Steve: That's big even if you're not in

Michael: our army.

Charles: And we were and we were flipping properties. Yeah. And wholesaling and all that stuff.

Charles: So So

Steve: you got called into NARIP?

Michael: NARIP. Yeah. So it's National Association of Hispanics. What are the cases for for Texas? Because, you know, we do so many deals in a year.

They recognize those individuals. But when I would tell people, yeah, I'm still active duty, it's like, you're active duty? It's like, you're reservists? No, no, active duty, and you're still doing these mini transactions? So, yeah, in the past those three years consecutive in a row.

So

Charles: Yeah. So so, I mean, we were, like, so busy. He was doing traditional and early morning real estate, going to the army. I was looking working on the flips, and together in the middle of the night, we're, like, figuring out these wholesales, and it was it was crazy.

Michael: It's a lot of hustle.

Steve: A lot of hustle for sure. Yeah. So then what were some of your struggles then in the very beginning of your process? Right? Like, because you guys hit the ground running on the traditional side, then you guys started flipping, and you guys started wholesaling.

What were some of the challenges along the way?

Charles: Some of the challenges that we found was that, you know, of course, we would have had someone we could turn to and say, hey, how do you do this, you know? Mhmm. You know, it would have gone a lot smoother. And and we didn't have that one in part because, you know, truth be told, a lot of people already knew us. And we kind of felt a little weird about asking somebody, how do you do this?

You know? We we should have just passed, you

Michael: know? Yeah.

Charles: And and so that was, that Believe it or not, that was a struggle for us because we had to humble ourselves. And Mhmm. So we just took more time in learning how to do it than we should have. So that was that was a struggle that I wish We

Michael: could have saved a lot of time and we just

Charles: Yeah.

Michael: Ask for help. Right? Ask for a mentor. Ask for someone, hey.

Charles: Yeah. What

Michael: are you doing, and how can we get there quicker? Yeah. No point in reinventing the wheel.

Steve: So you guys do you guys have a mentor now?

Charles: No. We don't. I mean, we started following like, I'm gonna tell you, so I told you this. You know, I talked to you. So even up until last year, we really didn't we're just so busy.

We knew the players in San Antonio, but we didn't, you know, you know, we didn't know about all this stuff that was happening in Phoenix and Florida and all. We didn't know about Maxwell. We didn't know none of this stuff. And so one of our guys went to, he went to, I think, see Brent Daniels. And he came back, and he started telling me all this stuff, you know, and I was like, everybody does it different, you know?

That was my first reaction. Yeah. But then Change. But then I started researching, and I started hearing names. We started looking at stuff, and then your name came up.

And we started watching, you know, podcasts and stuff, and we're like I told Michael, I said, Mandy, what? I mean, we're so we're we're so far behind, man.

Charles: Yeah.

Charles: And we thought we were actually doing damage, you know, and we we we understood that we're just, you know, we weren't doing as much as we could be doing. So we started making a transition. I started telling everybody last October and November that we were gonna start switching over to a new system. And it actually took us longer to get there. And then when we saw it, we went to, I think it was WeLive.

Right? Mhmm. And you were there. Yep. And and and we saw all these different people just giving and sharing and this system and that system and this system were like we actually felt like we're out of place.

Steve: Yeah. We actually had a private conversation about that.

Charles: We did have a private conversation.

Steve: Yeah. You felt like you were really far behind.

Charles: I felt like we're like a year and a half behind. Yeah.

Steve: Which I would say is not true because you guys were doing damage. You might not have been doing the damage you wanted to be doing. Yeah. Maybe you felt like you you weren't fulfilling your potential.

Michael: Maybe the systems and processes. Yeah. That's probably what it probably meant.

Charles: Yeah. I mean, we we we, you know, we were doing stuff the old school way.

Michael: Old school. Yeah. Old school school.

Charles: And and, you you know, we had a we had a lot of people come through our office. We love all those peoples to this day. Mhmm.

Charles: At

Charles: one point, we had up to 68 people in our office. Yeah. And and and and what happened is Michael and I were, like, had bags in our eyes because when you have that many people, you know, and bless their hearts, but everybody's just, you know, just I'm not gonna say they were taking because they weren't. They they just wanted knowledge, you know. And a lot of them did bring deals to the table, but when you have that type of system, you can't sustain yourself.

Steve: No. And so Not scalable.

Charles: You can't. Right. So we would ask people for effort and character. And all were welcome. Everybody's saying to me this.

But when we started asking for commitment, because we're gonna change to this new system, you know, that I've discussed with you, And, you know, a lot of people just started falling off, you know. Yeah. For whatever reason, you know, because commitment is hard, you know.

Steve: So when you talk about old school, what would be an example of what you guys are doing that you considered old school?

Charles: Yeah. We were I was training people how to find properties, like target properties. So, you know, we would we would also get lists. Right? But I would show people how to look at those lists and and and figure out which properties we wanted to go after.

Like, for example, you know, not for example, right now I tell everybody, if you only make $5,000 a month, it would change your life. Because people were making $25 an hour working at a professional office, don't even make that by the time they take out tax and insurance there. Mhmm.

Charles: I said,

Charles: let me show you how simple it is. Okay. You look for subject two, and then you, you look for properties in a new build. You know, whether whether whether it's a new, community, the builder's still building.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: Now think about that. Now this is Military City USA. Go after the military individuals. They got about four years to be here before they PCS out. Normally, they buy houses in two years.

Let me let's think about this. So you start knocking on their door, you start dropping flyers, you start meeting with them, and you let them know. Look, if at some point you need to PCS out and your agent tells you you can't sell your house unless you gotta put money out, say, look, I have an option for you.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: And that option is a subject too. Why? Because what's gonna happen is that agent is gonna tell him that he can't he can't sell his house and as he comes out of pocket or he increases the sales price to compete with the builder.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: But but a new homeowner is gonna wanna go as the builder because Right. They're giving them everything. So what happens to a lot of vets is they either become long distance, you know, landlords and they lose the property Yeah. They don't like that.

Charles: Or they

Charles: get a foreclosure. We step in and we take over that property, and it does have no equity, but it's it's a pristine condition in most cases. You know, we get to in most cases, they're not behind on payments, so we get to make money off the down payment when we resell them, and we make money on the passive income and the equity position as as our balance goes down faster than theirs when we when we when we wrap it out. But what happens is for the individuals who are finding those deals, you know, they're making 5 to $7,000 on each one, which is beautiful because if you're doing two of those a month Mhmm. That's that's some good money.

Yeah.

Steve: You're 6 figures already.

Charles: That's it's so easy. I tell everybody, it's so easy to make money if you just think about, you know, I'm I'm showing you how to do it. Right. The the blueprint or some just one aspect of real estate investing.

Steve: So do you still feel that's old school though? I would say that's still pretty relevant.

Charles: The way

Michael: Some of the old school stuff, I would say is, we're talking about Excel spreadsheets. Yeah. We're talking about get your phone, skip trace the number yourself. Dial.

Charles: Yeah. Right?

Michael: White pages. Right. Right. Truth finder, John Smith. Okay.

Eight numbers. Number one? Yeah. Oh, that's

Steve: fine. No.

Michael: That's old school.

Steve: Yes. He's doing that?

Michael: Yes. We're doing that.

Charles: Yeah. Man. Yes. So so now we're like, I order

Michael: And that's

Charles: what we're teaching those

Michael: people to do.

Charles: Now I order, like, 15,000 leads. I'll get them, like, in ten minutes, you know. Yeah. Back then, it was like we had people doing this. It was like and and I and I understand, you know, why it was so labor intensive, you know.

Steve: Oh, yeah. For sure. So let me ask you a couple of questions here that specific to this. Right? So you're talking to a veteran who's got no equity, so you do a sub two.

Now he doesn't have the VA eligibility anymore, if I understand correctly.

Charles: No. They do. They have bonuses. They got they have bonus entitlement.

Steve: So how does that work?

Charles: So what happens is whenever they whenever they PC PCS out

Steve: Wanna for the people that don't know what PCS is?

Michael: PCS. Right. So when a veteran or a soldier or military individual, when they go to a duty station, that's that's their permanent duty station. When they PCS, that means they're gonna do a permanent change of station. So when I PCS to Fort Sam, that was my my station.

And if I was gonna PCS or, get orders to go to El Paso, that's a a PCS.

Charles: That's a a

Michael: transfer move.

Steve: Gotcha.

Michael: So We do. When you have a property, let's just say in San Antonio, I think the VA eligibility is what? $4.34? About 434. That ballpark is

Charles: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Michael: Ballpark is just 434. So they bought a $20,000 house, and they PCSed to El Paso, they still have what he said, the bonus of title. You can still purchase another property.

Charles: But actually, they can you don't need they don't even need to use the bonus entitlement. A lot of people don't know about that. They can they move even if they were to rent that property, right, and they moved, let's just say, to South Dakota, Dakota, they would just have to show the lender that they're renting the property. Now, if they're gonna subdue it to us, they would show the lender, you know, our documents, and then we would put their lender in contact with our, escrow specialist who handles all our notes so they can see that he's not making those payments even though the note is in his name. Mhmm.

They'll still do another loan for him. Now what I mean by bonus entitlement, a lot of people don't know, let's just say you're in the same city. You know, veterans have what they call bonus entitlements. So above 144,000. So as long as they're upgrading, they can still buy another property even in the same city.

Steve: Really? Mhmm. I didn't know that. And then you're you're buying a sub two. How are you moving the property after you buy a sub two?

Is it something you're keeping? Is it another sub like another wrap? Like, what are you guys doing with the exit

Charles: on a sub two? Nine times out of 10, we're gonna keep those properties. Now, the property has a lot of equity, you know, and we've done those before. When we get those, we'll fix and flip them, and I'll go into that if you want. But most of the time, we're gonna keep those, we're gonna portfolio them, we're gonna wrap those properties.

So for us, it just depends. If if we're getting a property that's, you know, on no reinstatement, that has no reinstatements, that's the best deal. We always share that with you. Why? Because we're not having to pay reinstatement, and we're targeting properties that are four years old or five years old.

There's no rehab.

Charles: Mhmm. So

Charles: for us, those are the ones we pay the most on. But when when we sell them, we sell them at a small premium, we're able to get a down payment. So we're making down payment money, plus we're making passive income. If if their payment is 1,500 and the payment that they're paying us is, you know, let's just say $19.50, then, you know, we're making about 4 to $500 on on those deals plus Gotcha. Equity position over time, because we're in this for the long haul.

Equity position over time, our loan our underlying lien is gonna go down faster than theirs. You see? See? Mhmm. So we don't mind carrying these notes for a long time.

We're we're in it for the for the long haul.

Steve: And you're selling it as a sub two agreement for sale. How are you guys doing that?

Charles: It's a

Michael: it's owner finance. It's a rep around.

Steve: Owner finance. Yeah.

Charles: Rep

Michael: around. Every so often, maybe one out of every 15 houses will do a rental.

Steve: Yeah. The only reason why why I asked is, like, Marco and Hillary were on the show, and they're talking about they were getting hit with taxes, tax consequences when they sold the properties. So they're paying taxes on unrealized gains. And that was always that's always been the back of my mind. Right?

Like, if I buy a property sub two and I sell it

Michael: Sell it right then, like, a a flip or something? Or

Steve: no. I think it was it was like a I don't remember. You're

Michael: gonna finance?

Steve: Yeah. It was something along those lines where you because you're you're getting the value today even though you're not really getting

Michael: Yeah. So with our tax guy, now correct me if I'm wrong, because we met with them more than once. Right? So when we set up to a house and the the balance is $200, and we sold it for $2.40, he's looking at that portion. Mhmm.

But then he's also looking at the money we spent to get the deal. Right. The marketing, the wholesale fees, so it really narrows down

Steve: Yeah.

Michael: To that much. So I'm curious to to go back to, see what they were talking about.

Charles: And we're writing off the $800

Charles: off

Charles: the first loan. So Yeah.

Michael: So you get the $10.90 eights on both, and you compound that with your tax card.

Charles: Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. So that's something that I'll I'll get clarity because it's something that's always been in the back of my mind. So, you guys are in San Antonio. So, you know, we just mentioned Marco and Hillary. Quinn's out there.

JR, who's in the studio today

Charles: Yeah.

Steve: Is out there. So how's your comp how how is your guys' business different than your peers in San Antonio?

Charles: Well, of course, if you had Quentin here, you know, we're friends with him and Marco and Hillary. And there's a lot of the people that we work with. But truth be told, we've never we've never actually had to compete with anybody. I mean, because everybody kinda has their own spear. And and the only thing I can say about our the way we run our shop is we're team based oriented.

And I wanna say at least those two companies are that I know, because I know them personally.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: Everything for us is about our team, you know. Yeah. And it's not about just Mike and Charles. So shout out to, HPHS out there if you don't mind me.

Steve: Oh, no. Please do. Please do.

Charles: I

Steve: mean, I met I met the crew, you know, in Houston.

Charles: I mean, our team is, I mean, they're they're awesome. So

Michael: Yeah. The competition I mean, like I said, Q, he does his thing. Hillco, they do their thing. We all do we've done deals together where, like Charles said, before the podcast where it's just, hey. Let's work this deal together.

Joint venture agreement? Nah. We got you. You trust us.

Charles: We trust you.

Charles: We've done high dollar deals, like, you know, $2,030,000 dollar deals where there's there's nothing written on paper. You know? HOKO's done those. They pay us. We done those.

We pay them.

Steve: Yeah. So we've done

Charles: we've done those with Q. We have nothing written on paper. It's all off sheet PLC.

Steve: Yeah. I've actually had someone ask us that question. Right? Like, what kind of documentation? What should you do?

And I always say, get everything in writing.

Charles: Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: But I've never done anything right. Everything's always been a handshake out here.

Michael: Handshake. Yeah.

Charles: Well, you know Yeah.

Michael: Everything should be in writing.

Charles: Well, I

Charles: always tell everybody, you get one shot to burn me.

Steve: Yeah. I mean,

Charles: I'm gonna give you the trust level. I think you stand up. But if you burn me one time, you know, shame on you.

Michael: So When it comes to the competition, I think we're I don't know how it came to be, but I think we're somewhat known for sub twos.

Steve: Yeah.

Michael: Yeah. So I think, Q usually pushes a lot of his wholesale deals that are sub twos our way. Same thing with, with Mark and Hillary. Whether they get a sub two, I would think they push they push them our way, and we usually buy them, and we do what we do.

Charles: We normally don't buy, like, wholesale deals from other wholesalers because we have our own people. We're fighting our own deals. But, yeah, I kinda I I I kinda wish we weren't just known for that, but, you know, that's mainly insanity. Everybody knows.

Steve: It's better as we know for a niche.

Charles: A niche. Yeah. Yeah.

Steve: So then let's talk about that. Right? So you guys are wholesaling, flipping. Are you still doing traditional real estate?

Michael: Still doing, not as much as I used to. Might not back then, two, three years, we're looking at sixty, seventy transactions a year. I think this year, as of January 1 to now, I'm around 33, 34.

Steve: So? A lot.

Michael: It's still pretty busy.

Steve: Yeah. I mean, that's still like, the average amount of time does, like, three a year.

Charles: Three year.

Steve: You're doing three a month.

Michael: Yeah.

Steve: So how much of your business is traditional, wholesaling, flipping, sub two?

Michael: Break it down. Right?

Charles: Yeah. Man.

Michael: Well, I tell you right now, at a 100%, I would say about 10 to 15% is traditional. Mhmm. The 85 will be broken down to Yeah. The wholesaling, the sub two's, the flipping. Out of the 85, I would say 50% is wholesales Mhmm.

With the team. At the office, the boiler room, with Manny Cash, and all the everyone we have in the office, Maverick. The remaining 35 is the flips and the sub twos. Yeah. If that makes sense.

Charles: It makes sense.

Michael: So 50 wholesale. So 35 flips and sub twos, and then 15.

Charles: So we have team based deals, you know, but the office knows this too, you know, like me and Mike and I, we also do our own deals, you know, like

Charles: Separate from

Michael: the office.

Charles: Separate deals, you know. And we share this with them because, you know, they need to know that, hey, you guys need to outpace us. We, you know, there's a lot more of you guys than there's of us. You know, don't ever let us outpace you. Yeah.

Because we we share that with them because one, it incentivizes them, but at the same time, you know, we know that a you know, because the one thing about HBHS that we've turned it into is every single person that that's there understands that we're all moving towards something bigger. Mhmm.

Charles: So

Charles: we don't run our company like this, you know. Of course, Mike and I can be up there and say, hey, we run this company. Right? We run our we wanna run a company like this, you know. Every single individual there has a shot to make it big.

They just gotta learn, put their time in, and and and and and bring it. You know, like Mike says turn up the hustle. So they all have tasks. And so Mike and I, you know, we do different things. I do more acquisitions.

Mike does more dispositions. Mike and I's job is, you know, making sure that that whole system is working and that everyone that everyone, you know, showing people that they can believe in something gonna take them somewhere else.

Steve: Yeah. You

Charles: know, I've told everybody in my office, if you wanna be a millionaire, okay, you're in the right place. Because we're gonna we're gonna go there together. I'm not taking you there. Mhmm. I'm not gonna take you there, man.

But if you believe you can get there, then you're here. If you don't believe that, then you need to get your stuff and walk out that door. You see? Because you can't be in an area where other people are working towards something else. Yeah.

So every single I wanna say, oh, every single person in my office, they believe they're all gonna be millionaires. And and and I don't doubt that we all will because we've outpaced every single goal that we that we that we set. The scary part was, when I told you, you know, you know, July, August, September, you know, we made a big change and we've been fully automated, and we took it on the chin a little bit. But they've all embraced the new systems. The we've not only the softwares, everything that we're doing.

And so, you know, I think I don't know. Going back to your original question was I think that's maybe a difference in our office, you know. Yeah. Everyone believes.

Steve: Well, Well, I think so. One thing here that even Marco just asked this question, like, it seems like culture I'm I'm seeing some of some of the comments here. The theme here is you guys have an amazing culture. Do you guys is that a fair assessment?

Charles: I would say so. Yeah.

Steve: Okay. We've

Michael: been told that multiple times.

Steve: So then how are you guys building that culture? What what things are you doing intentionally to develop a strong culture?

Michael: I would go off with with that with that thing he did earlier, the the tip of the spear. Right? It's it's it's the we I like you know, we've been hanging out with Daniel from Propeli a lot. And he has that we not me mentality.

Charles: Mhmm.

Michael: That can be really driven really hard for when the people at the office look. It was like, man, these guys, it's not them. It's us. Mhmm. Right?

When we're teaching someone, we share everything and anything that we do for the past eight years from our failures to our success, our tips, our tick tips and tricks. We anything that we have, we'll give it to our people all day, every day. So we really want them to grow. Now of course, it helps when we have individuals like Frank Tovar, who's the manager for the company. He brings a different type of culture.

Yeah. You got Manny Cash, who's a young hustler, entrepreneur, came from Venezuela.

Charles: Yeah.

Michael: You know, hustle, that's that's him. Mhmm. His mindset, what he shares he's in charge of the ballroom. The the culture that he he puts in the ballroom is a big difference.

Charles: Offshore and onshore.

Michael: Yeah. And then with the The Philippines, I mean, it's a big difference. I just think everyone has a unique set of abilities, and when you put it all together, it just makes sense.

Charles: But not only that, you know, they all have seen us. I tell them, man, I'll bleed with you, man. If you want if if we gotta find somebody, we gotta do something that we that we're gonna work on something. And we gotta be here at 03:00 in the morning. I'm here, man.

I'm here for you. Don't expect me to do it for you. Let's do it together. And and and that's, I think, a big theme for us, you know. Like, for example, like Frank and Manny, we're so blessed.

You know, I wanna say it. We got other people in the office like Maverick.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: You know, we got the young guns right here that we just brought. Alejandro, he runs our SMS. He was really he wanted to come meet him, so so we brought him. But, you know, these guys came into our lives. They They have been watching us, you know.

And and little by little, they just started changing things. As we started losing the old people, these guys rose up. And and, you know, Frank told our man, god, he does stuff in our office that I just don't like I'm like, how does this get done, you know? And he's that guy, man. You don't have to ask him to do it.

He just get just gets done.

Steve: You know? Sounds like you guys are all empowered as well.

Charles: They're all empowered. You know, we we were real strong about we have we have two two meetings a week. We're really big on share your ideas. What are your strengths? Like, for example, we have we have another small crew.

Look. It's not all peaches and cream. There's there's a lot of chaos, and there's a lot of struggling going on. I told my people this in meetings every day. Man, just survive, man.

Find a way in this company and I I let me back up. I told everybody that and and and then they're watching, I tell them this. Dude, you're in the game, man. HPHS, whether anybody else likes it or not, is in the league. Mhmm.

We were playing ball. You're in the game. You got a suit. You got the chance to go out there and show out. Just survive, man.

Because when we get to the playoffs or we get to the pennant, you're gonna be there. You're gonna make it. You see? You're gonna make it with us. So I tell them to survive.

If it if that's all you can do, survive. But what we try to do at the same time is what is it that you do that's good, that can bring something into the company that can help you get to another level. So we have some guys that are really good at making music. You know, we have some guys that are really good, you know, at soundboards and and creative content. So we try to incorporate all that stuff with them, like Carlos and Martin and and Maverick, and we try to incorporate that stuff so they can so they can be part of our system at the

Charles: and survive so they

Charles: can make it to the next step. You see, everybody's gonna be at different stages, you know. For example, Manny Cash, he didn't get a deal for eight months. And he will come in and honestly, I'd say it to everybody with exception of Mike. Manny Cash is the only person who I've ever trained, who did everything exactly the way I told him to do it.

And he would come in, he would take notes, and a lot of people tell me, well, Charles, I don't know. I don't know what to do. I said, what you do is is go talk to Manny Cash and you follow that example. Because if if you can't do, for example, what he did, you know, it it's it's persevere. You're in you're in the wrong place.

Right. You know, the guy didn't get a deal for eight months and then he got one deal and then another two months passed and he got another deal and now, it seems like every week, it's it's contract contract, you know. And and, I love that Grammy. I love all my people. You know, all you guys watching, I love all of them.

But they're all in different stages, you know.

Michael: That's that's what builds the culture, though. Because then you got some other individuals like Eli.

Charles: Yeah. Oh, man.

Michael: Eli, from when we were doing this, let's just say, two years ago, we're trying to handle all the wholesales, all the contracts, all the title work. And then we had the 68 individuals, and we're still doing flips. But he has someone like Eli, he takes over the the flips. Right? So the day to day operations, the budgeting, we just show up.

Oh, cool. It's done?

Charles: Alright. What's that? I mean, we do very very poorly.

Charles: He does

Michael: the day to day operations. We have individuals like Mario Yeah. Who handles all of our data.

Charles: Well, Mario, the thing about Mario Marley was the longest. But let me get this back to you. Eli, man, he's a beautiful guy. Love that dude. He's now taking over our transactions department also and flips, you know.

He he'll he'll just get in there, man. Just be so specific large company. He's a professional. But he's been with us for a long time. He actually learned the old school way, and he actually popped some of the biggest deals deals we've had.

Charles: Like, for

Charles: example, the one that I sent you Mhmm. Over 100,000. He he was actually involved in that deal. But he he he's he's able to find people where where, you know, others can't. Yeah.

And he handles data. And finally, he's come on board and said, hey. It's time. And I told him, Mario, it's time. I need you, man.

So now he's come on board. He's gonna handle all data. Gonna handle investors.

Charles: Is he

Steve: the one that sent me the HUDs?

Charles: No. I didn't.

Steve: Why don't you send me the HUDs? No.

Charles: I put it together. I put it together.

Charles: So I

Steve: just wanna make this point here because I asked everyone for settlement statements. So that was a development that started last year, and I was kinda, like, enforcing it here and there, but wasn't really enforcing it hard. And then for reasons, and we'll discuss, had enforced it a lot harder. And so I asked you for settlement statements, and then you sent me an email and the file was so big that he couldn't email it to me. He had to send out one of those big file things.

Michael: Yeah. Dropbox or something?

Steve: It wasn't even Dropbox. It was like a program that it was goes to a different website where you can download the file. So and the reason why he sent me 100 pages.

Charles: It was two ninety seven pages. Yeah. Actually longer.

Steve: Yeah. Two ninety seven pages of HUD. So, you know, if there's a question at all about whether you guys are doing deals, got two ninety seven huds or two ninety seven pages worth of huds in my

Charles: And what I did is I I tried what I what I did, if you ever go in there, I try to break it down for you. Let

Michael: me get a chance. You review it all.

Charles: Because we did.

Steve: I I was going through, I was like, okay, page 30. That's still huds. I keep going. Like, I'm I was waiting for some fluff. I kept going.

Like, no. There

Charles: were Yeah.

Michael: No fluff.

Steve: There's no fluff. They're all HUDs.

Charles: Yeah. And and there was a lot of other stuff in there. I showed you, like, sub twos. And we had at the time, I think we had, like, eight properties on the market. And I can think we still have, like, 12 properties on the market or not?

Michael: Yeah. We had about 12 properties on the market, El Paso, Laredo, San Antonio. Yeah.

Charles: We don't like to boast or anything. We just wanna hustle, man. You know? No.

Steve: You don't boast. But you send the most highs out of everybody. No big deal. So No cover. So let's go back to what we're talking about beginning.

Right? Like, creative financing or not beginning, but, like, one of the things we'll talk about, for the show, creative financing, and how you guys are using it to build your portfolio. So, I guess, what is your vision? Like, do you have a number as far as, like, passive income or number of properties? Like, what is you guys' end goal?

Michael: I like to answer this question first because I always think everyone's a little different. Right? So Charles has, unfortunately, a couple years on me. Right? Let's say quite a few years on me.

Charles: Two or three.

Michael: Two or three decades. Right? So his goal is gonna be different than my goal. Sure. And we have investors that come to our office that invest with us, And every time I talk to them, because I usually handle the financing part.

So when I'm talking to a private investor, like, your goal is gonna be different than my goal. So when it comes to portfolio properties, I have a portfolio. Charles has a portfolio. And then together, we have a quite decent portfolio. Mhmm.

For me, I don't know if there's a number. It just keeps going. Now, Charles is not so much a fan of rentals. And I have a few rentals. And the reason I have a few rentals is is for my kids.

Right? So when they turn a certain age, I can then take that rental, a tenant's paying it down, that was just sub two, to be honest with you. And we just sell it, we cash out the equity, and we could give it to that one kid Mhmm.

Charles: And they

Michael: could put down payment on the house, whatever the case may be, college, to set them to go on life. Now Charles Uh-huh. Doesn't doesn't have kids. So he has kids but they're older. Right?

So he's in different stage of life. So his portfolio is on a finance, on a finance for the retirement fund.

Charles: So I told my wife, I said, look, you need to let me do this because we don't have four zero one k. I lost all my money. What we need is a bunch of houses so that when we get old, we'll have nice people helping us and not mean people stopping us. You know? Yeah.

But with Michael, yeah, it was like, we come together on everything. Like, for example, he wants to keep a house, he gotta pay me.

Michael: Believe that?

Charles: Yeah. You gotta pay me, man.

Michael: I gotta do that.

Steve: I got the same thing with my partner.

Charles: Yeah. So I gotta pay him. You know, let me let me tell

Michael: you the story. Let me tell you the story. So when he talks about this

Charles: He owes me money.

Michael: No. I don't owe money. Alright. So everything comes to to HPHS. Right?

So every time we do something and he wants, hey, Mike, you know, I wanna buy this 2019 Ford f one fifty. And I'm like, everything comes to HPHS because every time I get a house, then, hey, Charles.

Charles: We

Michael: got about five or six contracts wholesome So

Charles: what happened was Yeah. In the early in the early thing was 2013 or '14, we did this deal. And, we put we both put $7,000 to get the house, and we're negotiating. And and what do you think? And you know what?

I didn't catch it. He came to me. He goes, what do you think we can wholesale this property for? I was like, I don't know, man. Maybe 20, but let's just get rid of it.

Let's just I don't know. 15. And he says, how about 10? You think we do 10? I'm like, yeah.

Let's do 10. He goes, well, you know, I was thinking, you know, like a thousand. So he was trying to hustle me right, for 5,000, you know, like, no. Thousand. I said, I'll do 15.

I ain't doing 10. So mind you, we had already pushed $7,000 a piece. Mhmm. So he gave me back, he gave me back 10,000. Right?

And I didn't think about it for a while. Then I was thinking one day, I was like, I feel like something was wrong with my bank account, you know?

Steve: And I

Charles: was like, I couldn't put my finger on it. He gave me back my 7,000. But he was supposed to pay me 7,000 plus give me my 7,000.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: So owes me 4,000. Yeah. To this day, he won't give.

Michael: There's so many deals he forgets.

Steve: So, but I I we have the same thing. Right? So Max, my partner and I, like, we have in our contract. It's 10,000. But we also give, we have guys that work for us that don't actually need money, and they just want first look on deals.

And so we tell them it's the same thing. If you book the appointment, you have the right to buy that property before even Max and I get to buy it. You said At the contract price

Michael: or the wholesale?

Charles: What if

Michael: the wholesale would have been?

Steve: Whatever the wholesale would have been.

Michael: The split version of it.

Charles: Yeah. Okay.

Steve: And they also get paid their 20% out of that total fee. But we get everyone on our team that right, for first look as well. So it's not just Maxime getting first look. Like, if we get second look, our guys are dialing it first look.

Charles: So we have that set up agreement set up with our people. Like, for example, if we end up keeping a property that one of the, you know, people in the office got. Right? We'll pay them the wholesale fee. Yeah.

You know? Now we'll also give them the option. We'll say, hey. Look. You wanna run this deal with us?

And then, for example, Mario and Eli has done that with us. Well, we if we if they're willing to run dollar for dollar with us, we'll do the flip. Then at the end, you know, we just split. Everybody gets their money back. We'll split.

So we give them the opportunity to do that also because

Steve: That's awesome.

Charles: We want them to grow. You know? And and, they they get to learn too what we do. That's it. The best way to learn is through experience.

I said, you can read books all day long. Yeah. But but you gotta take action. I know a lot of guys that know a lot of stuff, but they never do deals.

Steve: It's, I think one of the the mantras out there, you know, it's like, you know, go ahead and look good luck learning how to swim. Yeah. Reading a book.

Charles: Yeah. That's true.

Michael: Yeah. Without doing it.

Steve: Yeah. So Jump

Michael: it in the water.

Steve: So going back to creative financing, though. So what are some of the ways so we talked about sub two.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: And then

Steve: you guys talked about private money. So raising private money, raising capital. How are you guys raising private capital?

Charles: So right now, actually, we're in the midst. Like, we've actually outgrown, you know, our capital investors. You know? So we're actually, you know, we've been doing a lot of lunch and learns at cost because, of course, you know, to attract people, you have to let people know what you're doing. Mhmm.

And so we do a lot of these lunch and learns because in the midst, of course, we're hoping that we will find those individuals that we need to find that are, you know, looking to make money with HPHS. So we do this with flips, you know, JVs, and we're actually actually right now passive investors on, what, a 152 unit apartment Mhmm. Complex in Dallas. Forward. But we're looking also to, you know, syndicate our own.

So we're always looking for apartments. We have those people in place. But when we're looking to continue to put properties away, you know, at a higher pace instead of, you know, three or four, or maybe we do six, seven, you know, every 40 five days, you know, that's a lot of money, especially when, like, this past month, we had to pay 12 mortgages.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: You know? And and so that comes right out of our pocket. But when you get investors involved, for example, let's just say we pick up a property and there's a reinstatement of, you know, I don't know, let's say 15. And the whole setter wants five. You're already into a 20.

And then you got the closings usually about a thousand dollars here into '21. We usually target newer homes. There's hardly any rehab. Let's just say all in, we're 25. Now the going rate in San Antonio is $20,000 down.

So now we're floating five. But if we bring in an investor who will fund the whole transaction, let's just say we because market's kinda changing right now. So let's just say we end up taking 15 from a down on a down payment, now we're floating 10. But if the investors wouldn't take 10% interest on their money over six over sixteen months or thirty six months, that's great because the passive income on that deal is gonna be anywhere from 4 to five. We take those funds and let our investor just cash it, you know, just just cash flow on that.

We don't have to make money on those two because we're in it for the long haul. Alright. So we we enjoy when we have investors that come in, just wanna make money on their money. Yeah. It doesn't bother us.

Steve: And so lunch and learn, you you said is how you're finding those guys?

Charles: Well, we decided to do lunch and learns because we wanted to share what we do, for one. It gives us the opportunity also to, let our guys meet people. We tell all our people we want each and every one of you guys to have your own identity. Mhmm. You know, you have your own identity, you can be strong.

People will refer you deals. So we do that for them. We do it so we we want, of course, the public to know what we do. In the midst of that, not only will we get deals because we do, but we're also hoping that we can find, you know, you know, some of these capital investors that we need to continue to to continue to grow. Because we've actually kind of outgrown, you know, our investors, you know, at this point.

Charles: And the

Steve: currency outgrowing your investors, what do you

Michael: mean? Capital wise.

Charles: Capital wise, you know, I mean, you know, we're looking to do a lot more, you know, that they're that they can. You know what I'm saying? We have some investors that are, you know, 400,000, you know, 300,000, you know, a 150,000, 500,000. But, you know, we work at at a pace, you know, that we need to do more. And Oh,

Steve: you're saying you you you got more opportunities than your investors can fund?

Michael: Right.

Charles: Gotcha. At this point.

Steve: Okay. You're gonna say something?

Michael: No. Just the they're old buddies, pretty much. Right? Old buddies of Charles for the most part. Social media helps.

Mhmm. Social media helps. We'll get individuals come in. Hey, man. I see you guys are doing this.

How can I make money on my money? You got individuals like Maverick. His wife works for a a doctor's office. She just told us the other day she wants to invest 300 or so. Well, I think $4,400.

Charles: We're we're real selective too.

Charles: I mean Is

Michael: that anybody that

Charles: you want? Like, for example, on the subject tos, unless we're actually contracting directly with the homeowner and meeting with the homeowner and making sure the close disclosures are getting done and disclaimers with the attorney, we won't do the deal. Mhmm. We, you know, we have to feel good about that person.

Steve: Sure.

Charles: And, and and the same thing with our buyers and same thing with our investors, you know. The last thing we want is to have someone not being able to sleep at night.

Michael: Mhmm. If

Charles: that's the worst thing you can do. And that's another reason, for example, all our deals that we do, every single deal that we do, we never collect cash on it. Not that Mike and I would do the wrong thing. But you see, whenever you have your hand in the cookie jar.

Charles: Mhmm.

Charles: Right? It makes anything becomes easy. So what we do is we take that element out. So every single property that we have that's wrapped or or or that are rentals, we have a third party company at Utah that collects those funds.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: You see? So that way, the person who's, buying the property knows that those funds are being allocated correctly Mhmm. And the people that we took the property from knows that's actually happening. And they all get receipts. We get the receipt.

They get their 298. We get our 298.

Steve: Is it service company?

Charles: No. The service company itself.

Steve: In Utah? In Utah. Not Texas,

Michael: Yeah. Yeah. Utah.

Charles: They're good. Is there

Steve: a reason why?

Charles: They're good.

Michael: They're good. Yeah. They're good. We started with them back then and because they have all our files, we just continue to use them.

Charles: They've always done a good job and, If

Michael: we don't get endorsed by them, we should.

Charles: Yeah. We should because we have a lot of names quite a few times. They're really good and, and, they've they've never done this wrong. Right? So Yeah.

Well Yeah. And they've been around since, I think, nineteen eighty eighty eight. Gotcha. So going back

Steve: to the question I was asking earlier, as far as the endgame, so you don't have, like, a specific property account or Me personally? Income.

Michael: I think just let's just My name

Charles: is you know, I told Michael because, you know, when when when me and Michael first decided to create this company, we knew there was a big hurdle coming. And that was that he needed to, make a decision whether he was gonna go, you know, and do his 20 in the army or not reenlist. We I told him, look, at that right around that time, they had changed the rules of, you know, how many years he had to be a real estate agent before he became a broker. I told him, like, look, let's not think about that right now. Let's just ground and pound and put your time in so you can get your broker's license.

Right? Mhmm. And we know right around that time was gonna be his real enlistment. I said, when that day comes, you make use of it. What do you wanna do?

And that day came, it was a struggle for him because he had captains and majors and generals. And then Michael, I don't know if you know this. You don't mind me saying, you know, but Michael was a medic in the army. He saved a lot of lives. Yeah.

So he so he has a lot of friends that, you know, travel from all over to come and just talk to him sometimes. And so it was really hard for him. So I told Michael around that time, I said, look, man. I'm older, but I feel like I got about fifteen years before people will just be not pay attention to me. I said, I will dedicate these fifteen years to this, which are my last this is my last run.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: My last hoorah. You know, I ain't got no I ain't got no other I'm doing something else.

Steve: Mm-mm. No plan B.

Charles: So I'm either I'm I'm I'm all in, right? And you make your decision. What do you wanna do? And then he came to me one day and he said, man, let's do this. And so my my end strategy is at, you know, is putting our properties away so that my wife and I can live comfortably, leave something to my son, leave something to my grandchildren, and and eventually be able to walk away and, you know, just have, you know, residual income and and have him cash me out something big.

Steve: So So And the reason why I'm asking this question is because going back to the title, right, like you're building a portfolio through creative financing. So, I mean, this is a personal question, but, like, what what does your portfolio look like today?

Charles: It's you know, when we tell people, they get a little freaked out, but I don't think it's there's people that are way bigger than us. Mhmm. But, you know, we're we're at 66,000. 66,000? Yeah.

Not a big number, but people

Steve: It's perspective. Right?

Charles: I hope it's I hope it's respectable, you know.

Michael: Yeah. Yeah. You know?

Steve: I was just saying, like, some people look at 66, like, man, that's a ridiculous number. Other people just think that's it. Alright. So it's like it's all

Michael: It just depends. It's all It depends

Steve: on where you are in your career.

Charles: A lot of people will say, when we first started, why are you putting these properties away, you know, making $3,400? And I did it.

Michael: When we first started, like,

Charles: why are

Michael: you doing that for $300? Because I mean, the majority of them are are all 72 reps. Yeah. But I mean, times it by 66.

Steve: You know, but but but Pretty well.

Charles: Our average is around $4.50 to $5.50. Is it? That's something that pays 700, 600.

Michael: Yeah. Our best one pays $7.92.

Charles: Yeah. But that allows us we put a lot of those funds into the company.

Michael: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. You know?

Charles: And and and so and allows us to do what we wanna do also.

Michael: To buy another property.

Charles: But our our our our big scheme is to get into the multifamily and and take down down some apartments, you know. You know, whether we feel that we we'll feel that we're in a position to lead a syndication, you know, with maybe, you know, a 100 units, a 150 units. So that's that's what we're also working on right now.

Steve: So going through some questions here. Guys, again, I apologize. We did a lot of talking. So, Josh Hanks wants to know what loan types can you do a subject to on?

Michael: So what can you do?

Charles: Mhmm. We do them all.

Michael: We do them all. The only

Charles: thing we won't do is, push the one the when the people pass away. Forget.

Michael: Reverse mortgages.

Charles: We won't do reverse mortgages.

Michael: We won't do reverse mortgages, and we won't do a sub two on our owner finance transaction transaction already. Yeah. But conventional FHA, VA, USDA

Charles: How do

Steve: you guys do in FHA?

Charles: We take them into, into Land Trust.

Michael: Land Trust and it would just ramble.

Charles: Got it.

Michael: Now, I mean, the the notes performing shouldn't be shouldn't be no issues, but

Charles: I mean, some things that we talked about this on the on the lunch and learn yesterday. Mhmm. And people will only know this if they've done a lot of subject two and they've been in the business a while. Like, some things you gotta be careful about. For example, the modifications.

You know, you gotta read the paperwork or the modifications, you know, because, you know

Steve: Come on. Where it resets?

Charles: Yeah. Like, when we get when we get a property, sometimes those modifications, you know, we're looking at one. If you're not reading the documents on them, you know, that modification might only be for ten years. Mhmm. Or, for example, this is a big one.

Steve: Love this. This is,

Charles: like, huge. Like, we got caught with our pants down on this one. You know, let's just say somebody had an 8020 from the past, and and the second note was charged off. And here you are paying the modification, you know, for these ten years, and you think everything's gravy. All of a sudden The second comes back.

The lender comes back and says, hey. You need to pay $35,000 on the second note. You're like, what are you talking about? It was charged off. I said, no.

No. No. It wasn't written off. And now you got equity. So now either you pay off this, you know, you pay off this knee, refinance it, or whatever.

We're gonna foreclose. And we didn't realize that because, you know, you gotta do a lot of it's not something people are talking about.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: The other one is having, non performing solid HUD loan where they, you know, you they'll take, you know, that 20, and they'll just put it dormant over here. You don't have to pay it till, like, 1946.

Charles: Mhmm. Pick up

Michael: one of

Charles: those. You think you're catching a good deal, and all of a sudden, you have $46,000 loan you didn't account for. That's the problem. So you don't people don't know that stuff Yeah. Unless you're actually doing a lot of deals.

Some blue

Steve: payments in the future.

Michael: Yeah. We definitely wanna look at all the notes.

Charles: Yeah. We

Michael: wanna look at the notes. You know, we don't I mean, when we do our subject two, we do our due diligence. Look at the notes. We ask, if there's a modification done, we'll look at the the deed records, make sure there wasn't a second deed of trust due to that modification reported. Mhmm.

Because sometimes the sellers won't tell us. They won't tell us about it.

Steve: Sellers are lying. That's weird.

Michael: Sellers are lying. Yeah.

Steve: That's crazy. Lie.

Michael: So when we pull up, hey. We saw your second deal of trusters. Oh, I forgot about that. So when you look at it, oh, that's, like, extra $32,000. Yeah.

That's two or five years. Yeah.

Charles: But we look for everything, HOA, the Water softener, solar panels. You know? You got to because all

Michael: that debt. Yeah.

Steve: Yeah. So a question here, from War Adcock is if you were to start over today, what will you do differently?

Charles: I'd call Steve Trank, man. I would watch Steve Trank show, man. Trust me, man.

Michael: Podcast number one to this podcast.

Charles: Seriously. I'm not I I told you this before. We had a private conversation on the phone. And I and I told you this. I meant it.

And we started watching your show and all the awesome people that you bring on here. And it was like it was like a light bulb, a big light bulb just turning our heads, you know, and we're like, what? We felt like we were like so in ancient times, you know? We knew we had the hustle. We knew we had we had everything, you know, moving forward.

But watching your show and I'm not just saying this. I've told you this before.

Michael: Yeah. Five stars.

Charles: And and and, all the beautiful people you bring in here, man. It just really, really helped, man.

Steve: Yeah. Well, I'm happy to hear that. I think also, though, you have the right people in your organization already to help you make that shift. Right? Like, if you weren't leading them

Charles: Yeah.

Steve: That they weren't there.

Charles: I can't say enough about them people. I love them. I can't I don't know if I if I forgot anybody's name. Just know anybody who's it's an HPHS. I love you guys, man.

Steve: Teng Nguyen says sellers are storytellers. I think that's a

Michael: Seller storytellers. Yeah.

Steve: That's good.

Charles: You know, we we we do some some type of deals. I know we talked about when we're in here. I'm gonna go ahead and drop it if you don't mind.

Steve: Oh, please do.

Charles: That people don't really realize they can get into. Like, for example, the largest HUD that I sent you was an LLC. We call it an LLC capture.

Steve: Yeah. And a

Charles: lot of people really don't know about this, but we actually will hunt for, LLCs who are defunct with the state. And people don't know this, and an LLC who's not active with the state cannot contract.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: But if they hold property, guess what? You can buy that LLC, and now you reinstate the LLC. Now you own the LLC and now you can sell the property. There's a few more tricks that go into it, you know? Yeah.

But those are beautiful deals.

Charles: You can

Michael: also sell it at FHA because it's always been on the same LLC. Yeah. You don't have to wait the 91 day rule for Oh, yeah.

Steve: That's true.

Charles: And you don't have a short term gains because the property doesn't you know, the property never changed title. Another one, for example, this is real patient stuff. I have shown this to some people. Some will do it and some give up. He's real patient stuff.

So for example, we go we Mike and I used to actually live on the on the Lineberger website, which is tax foreclosures. Now we don't have as much time to do that, but everybody's like always going after the tax foreclosures, but there's not enough. So I tell everybody, don't concentrate on just those, because there might be 30 properties, one is good. So you know, look at the rest of the state, it's all online. But I tell everybody, I said, look, you have these at least in Texas, I don't know how it is here.

You have at least three big companies in Texas that is I think it's it's a Propel.

Michael: Propel is one.

Charles: And then f f g m a c, there's another one. And so so what they do, they lend people money

Charles: for

Charles: taxes. Is that it's it's a huge business that is in Texas. So some reason their property, they'll step in and say, hey, I'll lend you 20,000, 30,000 at a high interest rate plus, you know, plus, commissions.

Charles: Point's on.

Michael: I just

Charles: And then what happens is people don't realize now they got a big payment over here. But next year, taxes are coming again. Now they got that payment. And if they don't pay, they'll say, hey, I'll refinance you. And what happens is you you send it, you know, if they they got lend 15,000 and in three years, now they owe 35.

You see, I'm gonna tell you guys something. Stop looking at the tax foreclosures and start looking online for the companies who are doing these deals.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: And guess what? Target those people. You start getting those people the same thing as buying a tax for closures. The only thing now is you're just paying off their note. Mhmm.

You know, we target those, Michael. You know, may owe $30,000 to one of these companies. And, I'll go talk to Michael, and I'll ask him if he wants a fresh start. Now those deals usually have a lot of equity, especially if they're in historic quarters in San Antonio. So let's just say the property is worth 250,000.

He owes 30,000. How about I offer him, you know, 40,000, and I take over the property. All I'm gonna do is pay them off. It would have been the same thing if I

Charles: would have caught them before before he got into that loan. Mhmm. Those are beautiful deals and nobody's going after them. Yeah.

Steve: No. There's not a lot of competition there. I love it. Elizabeth Navarette wants to know, what are you guys' goal for the future?

Charles: To make HBHS a a household name and to have every single one of our player or people become millionaires.

Michael: Yeah. That's very important to us. Everyone on our team, we stress that, you know, that when we when we mentioned when we saw you at a wholesale, our people is very important to us.

Steve: Yeah.

Michael: Now we take them to or no. We took a a select few to, 10 x. Right? We took a select few to wholesale, and as you saw

Charles: We're taking six of them to We're

Michael: taking six of them to Tampa, to Vargas' course. Which is our people is very important to us.

Steve: Yeah. I love it. What are you guys' why?

Michael: Good question. We've been chit chatting about this for the past month or so. I'll let Charles go first.

Charles: You know, everyone has a why. Right?

Michael: Everyone should have a why.

Charles: You know, but I grew up, man, in the the crappiest, you know, you know, bad places, you know, where I don't wanna go into villages back. I made a lot of bad decisions in my life. You know, I grew up with the mentality of, you know, the fist, holding on to stuff, guarding against someone else.

Michael: Mhmm.

Charles: And it took me it took me a long time. You know. You know, I went to school, you know, after making mistakes, and I graduated from University of Texas, and I got to meet a whole other just other people, man, that thought different, you know. Then my son was second generation, you know. He graduated from UT and my my whole mindset started changing.

I started believing in that mindset. I started thinking I actively had to reprogram myself because it's hard growing up one way and then acting a different way. And and and it's giving, man. My why is not only do I want to to leave something to my family. Right?

That's that's a given. But this is what I want. If when the day when I go, this is this is what I want. When the day when I go, I I want I would love to have people say, man, that guy right there, man. That guy.

I hope Michael will say it. That guy right there, man. He started me on a path, and my whole life is different. You know? And that's my why, man.

I believe in that, in giving, sharing. You know, I'm not I'm not gonna if there's water right here, I'm not gonna breathe the water, man. I'm gonna tell you where it's at. I'm not, you know, a soft soft guy. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. But, you know, that's that's my why. It's different from everybody else. Everybody might say, hey. You know, you know, I believe in god or or I wanna, you know, money.

You know, of course, I want money, but that's me, man. I wanna go out. I wanna go out, man, just some people say that guy did the right thing, man.

Steve: Yeah. I love it. What about you? My wife?

Charles: It's a whole different.

Michael: It's a whole different story. No. My wife no. I think everyone's the same. Everyone wants, in my opinion, success.

Right? Where I came from, it was very humble beginnings. My father came here from Mexico. So I'm well, first generation. Right?

First generation. Of course, minimum wage. My mom is hard of hearing. She's, almost deaf. So we used sign language to talk to her growing up.

So when someone is hard of hearing, it's hard for them to, you know, succeed in the in the workforce, right, because of of that disability. So you're talking about too minimum wage, you know, poor beginnings, you know, all the good stuff. The the the normal story you hear. So for me, it's always good to, like, hey. That guy, he made it.

You know? He made something of himself. The success, the portfolios, from high school buddies and just outshining and outgrowing and hustle. I mean, we've been dealing this terminology in the past couple weeks or so. It's turning up the hustle.

Mhmm. Just hustle, hustle, grind, grind, grind. The legacy, you know, when we when we're over and we're done with is, like, man, that dude, same thing with Charleston. That dude, he did something.

Steve: You know?

Michael: Yeah. You know, his his family came from old beginnings, and he just did something different than staying in the system. Right? He he he got out the workforce, which the army, his workforce is five to five. You get paid salary.

You work a hundred hours a week or forty hours a week. You get paid the same. Got out the workforce and did it as an entrepreneur.

Steve: Yeah. So

Michael: that that's my why, and it's doing that. And I'll tell you too. And Charles I'm gonna

Charles: be a

Charles: fan of that.

Michael: Charles don't like me saying this, but, success. Success, money, and a lifestyle.

Charles: What is the

Michael: the The lifestyle. No. Some people like, oh, you know, you shouldn't be that way. I tell you, man. I want a Lamborghini.

I want a Lamborghini. I want the lifestyle.

Steve: We'll talk about it offline.

Michael: But then what offline?

Steve: Well, that's a terrible idea.

Charles: Yeah. Tell her, man. But Please please don't.

Charles: But we

Michael: do have passive income. Right?

Steve: No. I'm all about getting exotic cars. Just not the Lamborghini. I'm a I'm a Ferrari guy. Anyway

Michael: Yeah. To tell you the But you want a Ferrari?

Steve: I'm a Ferrari. I'm gonna get a Tesla, but I'm a Ferrari guy.

Michael: I thought thought you already had

Steve: the Tesla. You can get a second Tesla.

Michael: Anyway So you can get two exotic cars. I can

Steve: get a Lamborghini. So what is your biggest

Michael: struggle right now? The biggest struggle is dealing with this guy, man. You know, because his we're yin and yang. Right? He's firing our mice.

Right? And I say that all the time. Everyone in the office knows this. You know, everyone you guys are seeing on camera, all those dudes, you know, on their podcast. We go on stage or we're on a podcast.

Sometimes there's little bickering here and there. And it's not a it's not a script.

Charles: It's not

Charles: a script.

Charles: It's not

Michael: a script. You know, when you're dealing with this dude, right, for six days of the week Yeah. Twelve hour days. Sometimes when I go at this

Steve: So how do you guys resolve that?

Michael: So let me tell you. His thing is, I see him as the the vision. Right? The vision. Hey.

We're gonna do this. We're gonna do that. And he comes into my office. Mike, now we're gonna start doing this. We're gonna start doing, the boardroom mix right now, 17,000 phone calls.

We're gonna wrap it up to 75,000 phone calls. We did SMS with Alejandra out there. We're gonna wrap that up. Right now, we have nine VAs. We'll get a 15 VAs.

And I'm thinking in my head, woah. Woah. Woah. Woah. I see the bigger person.

You gotta do all this before you get there. So he is the the vision, and he implements, and I feel like I come in and organize. So, you know, for being in the army for twelve years. Right? Military leadership, you know, being in charge of individuals at war, you you wanna see I wanna see see things outlined.

Mhmm. But teach your own, and that's the way he is. And I think that's how we became from where we're at now. I mean, back then to where we're at now because I think we complement each other so well.

Charles: Well, what's the struggle? That's the question.

Michael: The struggle is dealing with them.

Steve: Yeah. Well, I can definitely appreciate that because I'm a visionary. Right? I come in and I make a mess.

Michael: Yeah. I see. And

Charles: Like, his office is so neat. Yeah. And mine I'm like, don't touch him. I know everything's at you.

Steve: Yeah. But the military planning. Right? Military. You gotta have it like, okay.

Here's here's what here's what the operation looks like. Right. If this goes south, this is what we do. Exactly. Yeah.

You have to have that. I am not that guy.

Michael: This is like, hey. We're here. Who cares about this? We gotta get here and let's get

Steve: today. That's where we wanna be. Let's go make it happen.

Michael: Yeah. I'm like, no. You gotta take down this road.

Charles: You know, like, when we started making these changes, you know, it could've took a lot longer. But it's like I told Michael. I said, Michael, we we have to go. Mhmm. You know, we can't, you know, we can't wait two, three months.

We gotta go now. You know what I'm saying? And, as like, was, like, for example, like Mario. You know? You know?

Mario comes in the office. We're there almost nightly, you know? And I was like, Mario, the time is now. HPH's time is now, you know? We have the right people in the right place.

We're making moves. I need you, man, right now. I don't need you two years from now, you know? And catch up tomorrow, and he's jumped in, you know? But, you know, not to get off topic.

My struggle and my struggle is, I tell you what my struggle is, man, the honest truth. And and I recently shared this with my office, little personal. It's two things. I used to be really fit. You know, when the crash came, you know, I just came out of weight and I haven't been able to lose it.

So I'm on a quest to change that. But that's been a struggle for me because, you know, back in the day, you know, I come from a family that are fat people. So back in the day until I was like in my forties, my early forties, I was always very limited with what I ate and always in the gym. And, you know, I know how much of a struggle that was, you know, and it's kinda hard to jump back into that because I know myself, you know, I'm I have to be all the way in or all the way out. And so that's one of my struggles that I deal with, but I need to do it.

And I told my office, as a matter of fact, I just told them a couple days ago, I said, look, moving forward, I said, you guys, I'm telling you, man, you guys telling you, man. You guys have my permission, man, to put me in check. You know? I I drink water, you know, no Cokes, no candy. I mean, I need your help, man.

It was how many months. So The other problem that I have, which is a struggle, is because of the weight, you know, I I I got sleep apnea, which led to, what's it called? I always

Michael: say Necolepsy.

Charles: Necolepsy. So so, you know, it's it's weird, man. And and then because I could be and and I mean, I don't doze off or anything, but it's a struggle because I'm working on something and it's like just fraction of a second, you know. And and and it just happens, you know, and and I struggle with that. And then I had to share that with my office and and, you know, but I'm but it doesn't keep me from doing anything.

It's just something that happens. And, so the objective is lose the weight, see if my brain goes away, and the doctors can treat me for the what do you call it again?

Michael: Lycolepsy.

Charles: Lycolepsy. But they can't do it without, you know, with you still having trouble with the with the apnea. Yeah. So that's my quest, you know. The other the other I guess, guess, if anything else, my other struggle is dealing with this dude, you know.

Michael: Four of the five struggles were with him, so

Charles: Yeah. You know, but, man, you know, right right now

Michael: What what what about the struggles in the office? What do you think?

Charles: The struggles in the office is like is like I share with everybody. Look, not everybody's gonna have success overnight. Not everybody not everybody is going to is is gonna make it. You know what I'm saying? I tell them all the time.

I said, look, I'm not trying to I'm not weighing you down. I'm trying to empower empower you so that you understand that everyone can make it if you're willing to go your distance.

Michael: You

Charles: see, your distance is is different from mine. You know, your distance may be that you gotta work 10 times harder than anyone else. I had this old gentleman in the office that that's working with his name, his name is Clint. Love that guy.

Michael: Contract Clint?

Charles: And, Contract Clint, man. And he came into my office two months ago. He says, Charles, I don't know. I'm not getting it. I don't know what to do.

You know, I said, look, this is what you have to do. Focus on these things and understand one thing, that if you don't if you if you are not as proficient as someone else, they work harder than everybody else. And he gets the most deals now than anybody. Why? Why?

Because he implemented a system, and now he's very, very comfortable with it. He outworks everybody, you know. And then I I share that with everyone, and I mean it if you guys are watching out there. Everybody's everybody's hole that you're gonna dig is gonna be different than anybody else. But if you're not willing to dig it for yourself, you know, you'll never know how close you got.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. Opportunities are for everybody.

Charles: It's there for everybody. It's just different. You know, everybody's you know, some people have stuff going on at the house. Some people got, you know, personal problems. People gotta survive.

I said I get it.

Michael: Different upbringings too. I mean, just different characters,

Charles: you know.

Michael: So, yes, someone like Martin. Yes. Someone like Manny. Yes. Someone like Clint.

Yes. Someone like Charles. It's just opportunities there. Just

Charles: We don't ask everybody, like, for Mike and I, like, when my daughter was having her baby. Like, we're in there. And she's, like, two two hours before she has the baby. This is both babies. We're in their clothing deals.

They're talking to people. And my wife and my daughter are looking at me like, really? You know, I'm getting married. I'm in the limo. I swear to god.

I'm in the limo. And I'm closing a deal. My wife is like, really? You know, but that's that's

Charles: I should

Michael: tell you this one, man. Tell about the

Charles: funeral one. Oh, man. So where the funeral at? I don't even say who because we don't get I don't wanna get people upset. We're at a funeral.

And this is text me. And and we're texting back and forth. I'm like, okay. You go to the bathroom. Talk to him.

He comes out, and then he wants to talk to you. We'll go to the bathroom. So we're closing a deal. I went to Buterol, but it had to it had to be done, you know. But that's that's us, you know.

That's my community, you know. And and,

Steve: That's hustle. That's hustle. Yeah.

Michael: So We always turn up the hustle.

Steve: So last question is, what is your superpower?

Charles: Man, I think for me, it's it's for me, I I really wanted to you know, we thought about this day. We you're gonna ask this question. For me, it's finding out about something. Right? And and and and knowing that I can I can get that done or I can figure it out?

And taking that and then bringing in people that I know is gonna help with that. Okay. Let's get it done. Done. You know what I'm saying?

And and, I've never been afraid of, of not tackling something, you know. And, so of of course, I can do deals. I can talk about all the deals that we do or different stuff with different type of stuff that I know. But I wanna say it's not being afraid, you know, of of of of of taking off, of jumping, you know. I've lost everything in my life three times.

Like, everything. I'm not scared to lose, you know. You can't be. Not to everybody. Don't be scared to lose, man.

You know, you may fall a few times, but you can win. Because that one time that you fall, you may hit pay dirt. You know? And, I wanna say that. You know?

It's probably my my strongest, is you know, the strongest thing about me. To include my wife. Hi, babe. I love you.

Michael: Superpower. I kinda go back to what we talked about earlier, why Charles is the enforcer. I think being in the army for twelve years, having that military leadership,

Charles: a lot

Michael: of people don't know this, Lean Six Sigma. It's, I try to implement that into what we do here at Home and Home Selling. It's breaking down processes into steps on how can this step be better than the next. And we can cut a process or two and still get the same traction. That's that's what I think I like to do.

When Charles comes in and, hey, we're gonna do this, we're gonna do that. Or Manny said, hey, let's do this. I always think about the intrinsics of it, break it down, Mhmm. And fine tune it to make it roll efficiently.

Steve: Efficiency. Efficient. Yeah. I bet he drives you crazy.

Charles: You know, one thing one thing about my Talk about

Michael: the desk, man. There's just two different types of people. Mine? Every time I leave, my desk has to be clean. No papers.

Steve: I love efficiency. I hate feeling it.

Michael: I gotta I gotta do that paper in

Charles: the morning.

Michael: And I go, it's Charles' desk. I'm like, oh.

Charles: You know what? Man. We talked about this. I know we're getting short on time, but I wanted to say this before we, you know, and, you know, know, everybody everybody, you know, is in this business, you know, so that's their hearts. I I love everybody that, you know, that's good hearted people, but, you know, this is not all peaches and cream, man.

No. It's chaos every day, man. It's chaos, changing stuff, this happening, that happening. People, you know, personal problems, and it's complete chaos every day, but it's it's it's it's the chaos that you have to be able to manage, not just at the office, but with people at home, you know. You know, sometimes I get home and my wife's, what's wrong with you?

And I have to remember, you know, take that off, put it to the side. Or sometimes, like, me and him, like, last year, actually in January, when we were talking about his moves, it was like we started having no friction, you know, between us. But we have I sat him down, and I said, Michael. I said, look. If if we continue to go down this path, which we've been at it kinda added to it for the last two weeks, this whole thing's gonna fall apart.

We had to be able to talk to each other. And and and we did that, and it was over. You know? And that's how we conduct ourselves. Souls.

If we have a disagreement or an argument, we'll have the argument. I usually get a little little angry, you know, that he does.

Michael: It's a little fire and ice. He tempered

Charles: But more cool comedy. But, you know, we we make sure that we end it quick. You know? Mhmm. And and so we don't stay angry very

Steve: long. Yep. So I'm gonna let you guys think about one last thought that you guys each wanna leave the listeners with. I'll make a few quick announcements. Guys, it's three weeks away.

Skillathon twenty nineteen, Chris Rusev event in New Orleans, December. If you guys wanna check that out, go to bit.ly/2019skill. That's bit.ly/2019skill. And then, I'm gonna be at Antoine's event in DC, drip twenty twenty, in April. So check keep an eye out for that.

And then Max and I, we we did our workshop. It's blown up. If you guys wanna see if it makes sense for you guys to make 2020 your year, go to disruptors.com, disruptors.com to see if the workshop makes sense for you guys. And coming next Wednesday, we got Nick Perry. He's gonna talk about how to, recruit on autopilot, which I already implemented and has worked amazingly well for me.

And then we got the monthly meetup tomorrow night at Social Hall at 04:30. So in Phoenix, Social Hall 430 off McClintock And University. I look forward to seeing you guys all out there. And with that, last thoughts to start with you. Myself?

Michael: Final thoughts? I don't know, guys. I mean, I was a question you had earlier is what would we do differently? And I said, had a mentor. And I said, do you have a mentor now?

And I said, no, we don't. So don't do as we do. Do as we say.

Charles: Right? And

Michael: get a mentor again. So if you guys are just starting off, maybe done in your first wholesale, or even if you've been doing this for a year or two, get a mentor. Follow the real estate disruptors, and actually go in there and learn from what other people are doing now to make things so much easier for you. I would say, turn up the hustle. Hustle for me, when I come in, I I always tell Charles, hustle and productivity.

You know, if I'm come to the office hour too late for whatever reason, I always say, I came in an hour too late, but I'm the most productive one here. Mhmm. Do I understand that? I say that all the time. If I come in here, except for you.

Honestly. I'm just kidding. Kidding. If I come in two hours late, I'm the most productive one here. Yeah.

I hustle. I hustle. I always turn up the hustle. So, yeah, just turn up the hustle, man. Just follow-up mentors.

Keep the fire going.

Charles: If you

Michael: haven't done a deal deal yet, you gotta do a deal. Trust the system. Trust the process.

Charles: Yeah. I would concur on that. You know, if we had to do it all over again, we would have sought out, you know, real individuals. You know, it's not hard right now to find real people like yourself. You know?

You know, there's a lot of people that are studying a lot of hogs. You know? That's a street term for BS. But you can find good people, man. If you find good people, invest in yourself.

You know, part of the part of the reasons we've been going out to these, you know, seminars and stuff is we find the right ones we wanna go to. Of course, we've been lucky, you know, real lucky that we found really good people and I I would you have to invest in yourself to learn, you know. And of course, you could do it the way Mike and I did, but we, you know, we could probably be a lot further ahead if we would have, embraced, you know, some individuals, you know. That's that's what I say, you know. And, of course, turn up the hustle like Mike says.

And you didn't ask me about the book. I was ready to tell you about the book.

Steve: Please feel free.

Michael: Go ahead.

Charles: My book is I was excited to tell you about this. It's, it's a old book, man. I read it. It it really changed. This is where where my thought process really started changing.

It's how to win friends and influence people by Dale Carnegie. Have you ever read it?

Steve: It's amazing book.

Charles: It's an amazing book. You know, it was written back in the day, you know? Mhmm. But what it taught me was how to be true to everyone you mean to yourself. Have appreciation even for your enemies or people you dislike.

Not to flatter people. Not to flatter yourself. You can find you can find goodness in anyone. I'll give you an example. You know, about five years ago, we had a guy, you know, who's, you know, he's kinda well known, you know, and he has issues, you know.

And and and and we let it go a deal go to him because he called us out and we said, okay, man. I mean, we're actually losing on this deal. But if you said that, we're breaking our word by not giving you this deal, you know, we let him have it. But you know that same guy this past year called me, he said, hey, I know you and I don't get along. I don't like you.

You don't like me. But I got this deal, man, in Dallas. It's a great deal, and I know that I can trust you. And I was like, man, you know, that's beautiful. Even from someone that we really don't connect, you know.

Find appreciation find appreciation in everything you do and everyone you deal with. And what you're gonna find is they're gonna appreciate you.

Michael: You know?

Steve: Love it. Thanks. Great. It's great spot to end it. So thank you guys for watching.

Thank you.

Charles: Yeah. Thanks so much. Thank you.

Michael: Final minutes to give out some shout outs or we're always time's up, man. So I I gotta give a shout out. Right? Everyone are at the Home Automation Solutions team. Charles and I think very highly of you guys, from Contract Clint to Many Cash, Frank, Elon Morrow, everyone who's out there, Maverick.

Our boy JR is here. Alejandro's here, Alejandro is here who runs our SMS. The San Antonio community itself. San Antonio, I think, has really evolved the past year or two, and I think we're coming really big as as an investment city. Does that make sense?

I know Phoenix is on the map. Mhmm. I know Tampa's on the map, and I think San Antonio's on the horizon. I just wanna give a shout out, and of course, shout out to my wife.

Charles: Don't forget Jackie, Vanessa. Jackie. Everyone. Everyone in HPHS. But, you know, I wanna thank you not only for having us here on this podcast.

I know it's been a long time coming. Yeah. We we've had a lot of discussions. I wanna thank you, but I also wanna thank, you know, everyone that that you surround yourself from. Because like I told you, I've told you a couple of times, man, it really changed everything we do.

Yeah. And if you're looking for a change, I'm not just saying this, man. You need to pay attention. Pay attention to good people. You know, like this Nick that's coming.

Mhmm. You know, we talked to him briefly. He was so giving. You know? He sent us his slides, and everyone is just it's it's beautiful.

It's a beautiful time to be in real estate. So Yeah. Shout out to everybody in San Antonio, of course, Q, Marco, and all the players out there. We love you guys, and, thank you so much.

Michael: Don't forget, guys. ITunes, five stars.

Steve: Thank you.

Charles: Yep.

Charles: See

Steve: you guys later.