How I Acquired 1700 Rental Units in 4 Years

Steve Trang: Everybody. Thank you for joining us for today's episode of Real Estate Disruptors. Today, we have Colin Schwartz with Park Avenue Avenue Capital. And Colin flew in from Omaha, Nebraska to talk about how his team has acquired 1,700 units in the last four years. If this is your first time tuning in, I'm Steve Trane, sales trainer for some of the top wholesalers in the country.

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Colin Schwartz: Ready.

Steve: Alright. Cool. So first question is what got you into real estate?

Colin: So I think this is a common theme among investors. It's the purple bible. It was Rich Dad Poor Dad.

Steve: It's amazing how many people have read that book.

Colin: 01/01/2017, it was day before the end of vacation. It was me and my wife. We were expecting our second child, and I was doing what everybody does after New Year's and it's reflecting. Mhmm. Somebody put a book recommendation out of Rich Dad Poor Dad.

I've heard of it. I had never read it. I picked it up that night and I almost got through the entire book and basically banged my headache against the wall realizing that I had missed out on so much. I was 32 at the time. I had my master's degree.

I was working a job in IT as a project manager. And every day, I was looking at my four zero one k going up incrementally until the age I hit 65 Mhmm. To be able to retire. Yeah. It it it it dawned on me right then that I did not need to do that.

I got back to work, which was two days later, which happened to be my birthday, and they got rid of our, or at least me personally, our nonpaid PTO. So I needed, nonpaid time off. I ran another business on the side. I realized that I was, like, handcuffed with this job.

Steve: So you were no longer allowed to take time off?

Colin: No longer allowed to take time off, which I wasn't getting paid for. Yeah. Yeah. So there there was kind of a moment right there. And at the same time, I was sitting across from a gentleman.

He'd been working with the company for about thirty years. He had a countdown timer on his desk of a thousand plus days to go. He was looking forward to skipping over a thousand days to be retired.

Steve: This is like, you know, that job that you hate and you keep staring at the clock. Yes. And that minute hand, not only doesn't move forward, but sometimes it feels like it goes backwards.

Colin: It it was. The, I just remember that elevators were packed everyday at 03:00, 04:00, and 05:00. Not like 05:15, not 05:30. Everybody got up and left. It was a great job.

I I, you know, I was making $80,000 a year. I thought I hit, you know, the absolute gold mine. But after reading that book and kind of those situations, I realized that there was something that needed to change. I began diving into all sorts of different education, reading as much as I could, networking. What I quickly realized is that being a new investor, you're not really getting taken serious by a lot of brokers.

Mhmm. Everybody wants a seven and a half cap with 12 to 15% cash on cash returns. But if you're not proven, you're not gonna be sent the deals. Mhmm. So I went through ListSource.

I found listsource.com, created a list of properties. Well, hang on.

Steve: You're jumping right into the real estate component.

Colin: I am. I am.

Steve: In this time, you're kinda go through not an existential crisis, but, like, an epiphany. Right?

Colin: Yes.

Steve: Your eyes are open.

Colin: Midlife crisis.

Steve: Yeah. A little early midlife crisis. And your job then reinforces that. And then you start looking at data. So you're still working your job while you're looking at apartments.

Colin: Yes. So what what I also realized is that although I'm at work for eight, nine hours a day, there's a lot I can get done because I can get my job done in probably an hour and a half and still be very effective at it. Mhmm. Because they wanted butts in seats. So you sit there and that's where you are.

So I realized I'm not gonna take lunch breaks anymore. On my lunch breaks, I'm gonna work. I'm gonna work on what I have a passion for, which is real estate. So through podcasts, every morning I would wake up, listen to BiggerPockets, get on biggerpockets.com, listen to books, read books. And then quickly, I got to where List Source is a Did you

Steve: say Bigger Pockets or Real Estate Disrupters? I wasn't sure.

Colin: Real Estate Disrupters. Of course. Of course. I said, I I don't think you were out then. So I was not.

Yeah. See? See, you caught me. Almost did. But got onto ListSource.

I found I'd identified a 191 properties that were within three ZIP codes. The reason I chose those three ZIP codes is they were between my home and my work. So that means that I could effectively go see them during my lunch breaks, on the way to work, on the way out to work.

Steve: So kinda like driving for dollars for apartments.

Colin: Yes. Yep. And being very stubborn, I sat at home one weekend and hand wrote all the letters. And I sent them out I sent them out on Friday because I heard that was the best time. I think

Steve: How many letters?

Colin: A 191.

Steve: 191 letters.

Colin: 191 letters. I got, I think, 13 or 14 calls.

Steve: That's pretty good. That's, almost a 10%. That's a 7% response rate. Yes. That's incredible.

Colin: And I got six deals from it. Even better. And I had no clue what I was doing. My phone started ringing off the hook. When I say ringing off the hook, it started ringing on that Monday during meetings of these random people.

Steve: Okay. So not only were you getting responses, you're getting responses Monday? Yes. Wow.

Colin: Yeah. So so I think the key with the letter and this is something that I think is so, important. It was very personable. I actually so it was handwritten. I put a real stamp on the letter.

I handwrote the person's address on there, and then I handwrote my return address.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: How many times do you get a piece of personal mail that you don't open? If it's written to you directly and it seems like it's actually like a personal letter, you're gonna open it every single time.

Steve: It's gonna open it's gonna catch your eye.

Colin: It's gonna catch your eye versus the one that has, you know, the the postage prepaid postage, etcetera, where you know somebody's trying to sell you something. Mhmm. So, yeah, that that really helped and that really helped me get started. So currently Are you

Steve: still doing that?

Colin: I don't do that. That was no. No. Now we have more deal flow than we know what to do with, which is a good which is a good problem. We have eight different businesses.

We vertically integrated into multifamily. My first project being a three plex, We're closing a 180 unit on in a week from now.

Steve: Alright. So we'll get to that in a second. Okay. So alright. So you're you got six deals from it, but you didn't contract those all all those immediately.

Right? So you got six people that were real sellers.

Colin: Correct.

Steve: Right? So what was the first one that turned into an actual transaction?

Colin: So it was a duplex. The guy was, you know, I'm not in a rush to sell, but just keep reaching out to me, keep reaching out to me. So every two weeks I would reach out to him. I didn't wanna do the six month game. I need to get out of my job.

I I I was on a mission then. I met with him at his house multiple times, signed it over, got the project under contract for a $100,000. It was cool. We and I use a home equity line of credit. So where I got my capital from, I realized I had debt equity in my house, which I didn't realize was anything.

Everybody talks about paying off your house. I was like, oh, there's money there I can utilize and actually make gains from. That that was also a big pivotal moment for me. But, yeah, that was the first one. Sat in his living room.

At closing, he gave me one of his, samurai swords that he'd been collecting and, we we parted ways. That that, that house I did end up or duplex I did end up selling, though, eventually, just recently.

Steve: So I think there's a good point here, though. Right? I mean, because you were transitioning from a w two job. You had a line of credit, or you had equity in your home. Right?

And use that line of credit to get your business started. So I did the same thing too. Now I trashed my whole line of credit, you know, because I got my line of credit in o six or o five, and it was just downhill from there. But I used it to get started. So I think right now, everyone pretty much has equity in their home.

So they own a home, use that line of credit because that's some equity that they can apply for their business.

Colin: Yeah. I mean, if you have if you're at 80% loan to value, there's lots of banks that'll give you up to 95% on that line of credit. So Yeah. I mean, really, that is money that is just sitting there. And if you're paying 4% interest or 5% interest, on your mortgage, why not use that 10 to 15% of equity to make 10%, a 100%, whatever it is.

Mhmm. But you can arbitrage that and make it significantly more than it just sitting there as your safety net.

Steve: Absolutely. Okay. So your first deal was duplex, but that was not enough to quit your job?

Colin: No. Okay.

Steve: So what was next after that?

Colin: So my my first deal, it closed 04/24/2017. So that was pretty soon after I read Rich Dad Poor Dad. Since that date, I've had a project under contract. I've never I went about eighteen hours and then got another project under contract. That was in 2019.

But just continued. So bought a duplex, a three plex, a seven plex, a four plex, and then I started meeting partners. And I think that's when my business really, really starts skyrocketing. I when I first started, I got into property management Mhmm. Because I realized that my four zero one k was being managed by people whose goal was to get fees and to make their own living, not to protect my living.

Steve: Right.

Colin: So I needed to take control of it. So I began the property management side of it. This is while working full time. This is while now having two children, and continued with that. And I started partnering with individuals.

Steve: So you're managing your properties plus other people's property?

Colin: Just my properties.

Steve: Okay.

Colin: Just my properties. So currently, we only manage myself. Now I have partners in the property management side. But just manage properties in which I have ownership equity in.

Steve: Got it. Okay. And then partners. You're partnering with people pretty early.

Colin: From the first deal.

Steve: Oh, from the first deal. Yep. Okay. What prompted you, the partner?

Colin: Because I didn't know what I didn't know. Mhmm. And I found somebody that owned or had owned and managed 50 units. His name is Steven Sykes. And now I have another partner, Chris Palmerlou.

But he was well beyond where I was, where I thought was even possible, and he helped guide me through the process. I I would you know, one of my biggest takeaways is get a mentor, get get a get a partner, show them value as soon as possible. Mhmm. I don't know if I'd be anywhere if it wasn't for for those two individuals.

Steve: Got it.

Colin: I I would be stuck. I'm good at a couple things. I'm really bad at a lot of things. Yeah. These individuals kinda fill in the gap.

Steve: Perfect. So alright. You're closing a bunch of deals. Start property management company. What happened after that?

Colin: So it was in February I decided to actually quit my job of next year of 2018. I was at 42 rental units. I I had an epiphany again and also my with my wife's blessing and she actually kind of encouraged it. She saw that I really wasn't satisfied at my job and also I was seeing some success in real estate. Mhmm.

Steve: And I

Colin: also got a $25,000 wholesale fee Mhmm. And $12,000 worth of acquisition fees, from an off market package I found.

Steve: Right.

Colin: So really that was when you're making 84,000 a year and all of a sudden you can get $37,000 of fees with one transaction Mhmm. And you realize it would take you close to six months to make that, light bulb goes off. It's like, okay. Alright. Let let's let's focus my time on this.

Steve: So it was the income the transactional income. It wasn't the the passive number. So, like, you know, a lot of people when they're looking at acquiring rental properties, right, you go the rich dad, poor dad route. And we all, in a way, go through it, but, you mean, you really went hard on that rich dad, poor dad route to get passive income.

Colin: Mhmm. And

Steve: then you kinda look for this freedom number. Right? So you didn't necessarily hit your freedom number and then quit your job. You quit your job because you saw

Colin: the active income would, on pace, far out far outperform your w two job. Correct. You know, the passive income, it is it takes a little bit longer. It's one thing if you have, you know, capital to invest. You're investing in the syndications that's a little bit more, it's a little bit more predictable when you're doing what I was doing, the smaller properties.

There's a lot more CapEx that can occur. You know, a furnace goes out. I mean, some of these buildings I was buying were, like, 1910, 1920. You have a furnace go out. That's $3,500.

There there goes your year's worth of cash flow. Right. However, the equity build up, some of the fees, some of the active income that you can take, it was kind of the light bulb. Once these properties get stabilized, okay, then you can start better projecting what the passive income is or at scale. Hence, why we've scaled to larger projects.

Steve: Stabilize. It's not a term we use a lot on this show. So does elaborate on what that

Colin: is. Okay. So stabilize is so when we take over a property, it's from, you know, typically great landlords. But they don't run the property as if it's a business. Mhmm.

They forget to raise rents. They're not billing back for utilities. They're also not taking care of the property. So when I say stabilized, we're going in. Sometimes we're keeping the same residence, sometimes we're not.

But we're getting these properties up to market rate. We're providing the correct fees. We're also improving the properties to where they need to be. There's no leaky faucets. There's no holes in the ceiling.

We're taking care of the properties to get them to their maximum and optimal value. And once that we are there, then I would consider it stabilized. And then at that point, we look at refinancing the property to recoup our capital that was initially invested.

Steve: Yeah. So I I guess if I were to picture it, it's kinda like you buy a property that is a little little older, little deferred maintenance, not quite kept up, and you're just coming in making it fully rent ready so you can maximize your returns.

Colin: Correct. I mean, for example, for that duplex, the rents were $500 a month. When I sold the property, they're at $1,200 a month per unit. So, I mean, that's just that's just a prime example of somebody who didn't wanna run it as a business.

Steve: Mhmm. Alright. So in your first year, you say you acquired how many units?

Colin: 42.

Steve: That's a pretty good first year while especially while running a full time job. So how was the second year?

Colin: So every year we've about tripled, you know. I think by the end of the second year, I was about at 200 units or so. It was kind of a whirlwind. It's been kind of a whirlwind for a long time.

Steve: A lot of lessons learned going from 40 to 200.

Colin: Yeah. So I was it was another pivotal moment. I was at 90 or a 100 units and I remember sitting down at a restaurant and I didn't leave for eight hours because my phone didn't stop ringing. I had over a 100 phone calls

Steve: Wow.

Colin: And hundreds and hundreds of text messages. Remember, I'm managing this. I'm also trying to acquire. I'm also networking. During that time, I started a meetup group in Omaha.

So the lesson learned was I needed to hire somebody pretty quickly. Otherwise, I was never gonna leave that chair, and I just bought myself another job.

Steve: Right.

Colin: A a a better job where I could, you know, go drive around, move where I wanted to be, but I was glued to that phone and had a lot of people needing a lot of things. I remember I would, I had a mobile printer. So first 24 unit that we bought, this was, you know, maybe I was hitting 60 or 70 units. I would go into the apartments, hook up my mobile printer, print out leases Mhmm. To sign with the residents right there.

Yeah. So I was doing I was rekeying. I was spraying for pests. I I was

Steve: doing everything. You were a one person property management company? Absolutely. Managing a 100 200 units? Or you're there's a At a 100.

Colin: At a 100.

Steve: Yep. That does not sound pleasant.

Colin: It was exhilarating. Sure. But no. It was exhausting.

Steve: And I think this is kinda you had that epiphany or you gotta hire. But there's so many people, like, we would rather entrepreneurs, we would rather work for ourselves a hundred hours a week, maybe even make less than worth thirty hours a week for someone else.

Colin: I was definitely making less. I mean, obviously, there's income coming in. There's a lot of net worth that was being built up. Yeah. But at the time, you don't see it because, I mean, you're just stuck in the trenches.

Steve: And you're in the weeds.

Colin: Yeah. I hadn't done any refinances at that point. I I was really just starting to understand that process. Yeah. So definitely hiring.

Hiring. Outsourcing. Delegating.

Steve: Were your partners helping you with this component? Because you were saying, like, you know, they filled in a lot of the weaknesses. Were they helping you as far as, like, eye opening, hiring process, and so on?

Colin: So I I did most of that. So they would focus on on acquisition. So at this point, I had already quit my job. Mhmm. They were still in their full time w two jobs.

Got it. So and I also received a fee for the management. So this is, you know, something that did help me get out of my job is I charge, you know, an eight to 10% management fee. So So even if we were partnered fifty fifty, I would get, you know, a cut off the top. That was kind of like living salary.

So I know lots of partnerships start with who does what and I think partnerships dissolve because somebody's not pulling their weight. Mhmm. Well, I said I'm taking a fee for this so we know who the onus belongs to. Belongs to

Steve: me. Yeah.

Colin: I'm the one that's gotta do it, but I'm getting paid for it.

Steve: Right. Got it. So hiring. How is that journey?

Colin: Hiring? And Your

Steve: first hire.

Colin: My first hire, his name's Irvin. He still works for me. He's great. He does our leasing.

Steve: That's awesome. Normally, it's not a good situation when you're first hire.

Colin: I knew he was, so he's actually I met his mom. She was looking for a property. She actually now cleans hundreds of our apartments for us. It's, like, flourished her company. Young kid, I saw him.

He was painting one of our apartments. He was helping his mom. And I just saw his work ethic and his ability to just, you know, positive attitude. And then I remember I was in a bind. I was out of town.

First time I went out of town in, like, two years. It was for a conference. I was out for two days. It was December or January. It's freezing in Omaha.

I get a call from a resident. Furnace is out. I mean, it's like it's like zero or negative 20. It's freezing. Yeah.

I call him at midnight. I said, can you please go look at this? He gets up, drives to my house, goes and picks up the set of keys, then goes drives to the property and fixes the issue. Wow. I was like, okay.

You're hired. Like, I I don't know what I need to do, but if I can get you on a retainer Mhmm. Because I never hired. I don't I mean, this is all brand new to me. So that that was the first hire.

Now we're, I think, 18 employees. And almost every single person actually, every single person has been, like, through a mutual relationship. Yeah. I've tried Indeed. I've tried a lot of other routes, but really it's always recommendations from other people.

And we don't look for experience, we look for talent. Yeah. That that's it. Somebody that's willing to work and really gets it and takes ownership.

Steve: So when you hired him, he was kinda like, I don't know, emergency. He's all

Colin: I said, if there's something that I can't do, can you run around for me? I mean, it was very nondescript.

Steve: And what does he do now?

Colin: So now he does all of our leasing. He does lots of our leasing, lease renewals, schedules our cleaning, handles so he's bilingual, so he handles a lot of, lot of resident communication in that manner. But, I mean, he probably has 10 different hats. At the beginning, he had a 100.

Steve: Yeah. Alright. So going from your second year, a couple 100 units, to now, you know, was I I said 1,700, but you you said that it's it's even updated further. Yeah.

Colin: So it's at about nineteen fifty right now. Mhmm.

Steve: So just shy of 2,000 units Yep. In four years. Mhmm. It's pretty impressive. Because this is the end of your fourth year.

Right?

Colin: Correct.

Steve: So you started January '17.

Colin: Correct.

Steve: So it's not it's not even four full years here. And you're just shy of 2,000 units. So what were some things that helped you get there? Partnerships. Partnerships, mentorships,

Colin: coaching groups. So I have a business coach. Mhmm. I'm also involved in some masterminds. That's why I'm in town right now.

And I created a meetup group, which I I think there was already a meetup group in town. But for anybody out there, create a meetup group. If you have an idea and you think you can provide value, I don't care if there's 50 meetup groups meetup groups out there in your city. Build your own meetup group. Our our started with six people touring my fourplex with a 12 pack of beer.

The next one was 30 people. Now we have a 150 people that show up and 3,300 members.

Steve: Yeah.

Colin: So that really helped. Just the networking and the giving back mentality. I don't charge for the meetup, you know, with Wolf I I do coach, and I I am a paid coach. But the meetup was really brought together to find people smarter than me

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: And extract some of their knowledge, and hopefully, I could provide something back to them.

Steve: Gotcha. Cool. So, for someone wanting to go down this route, right, to start a meetup, how we wanna go about starting a meetup?

Colin: I mean, focus on the on the value that you can bring and focus on what what you wanna do. I said I wanted to start a meetup that's focused on multifamily, and I wanted to bring together people that wanted to help each other. Mhmm. That was it. I mean, we found projects.

Make it interesting. Make it fun. So the reason one of the biggest reasons why I wanna start it is the Ria that we had in town, which has totally changed and is now amazing. But the Ria that was in town was hosted at a middle school gymnasium. They served cookies and just stale bread, and it was on a Monday evening.

Mhmm. And it was just one of those things nobody wanted to go to. It was very bland. It was run by a person that was very authoritarian, that didn't wanna let anybody speak, that wanted to promote his products.

Steve: Oh, wow.

Colin: So it was just kind of, it's like, okay. There's a better way to do this. Let's let's provide some fun. Let's, you know, let's go to a bar. Let's have some interesting speakers.

Let's allow people to promote their products. Yeah. So yeah. I I I think, you know, give the people what they want.

Steve: I will say though. There's nothing wrong with cookies.

Colin: No. The cookies are good.

Steve: Milk and cookies is is is will always be a classic.

Colin: No. You're right.

Steve: So okay. You're you're you said you were in town for a mastermind. What mastermind is that?

Colin: I went Multipliers. Multipliers?

Steve: Yep. Cool. Alright. So what are some other masterminds that helped you kinda get here?

Colin: So I joined do you know Jake and Gino? Wheelbarrow Profits. I don't. Okay. So they're a multifamily group.

That's who I actually coach for, but I was originally a student. Mhmm. So they have a great group of individuals. They have helped tremendously. They're doing something similar to me.

They're vertically integrating. They just started a few years earlier and, you know, they've built out a large large company based on people. Another group is Vistage. It's It's a great program. It's it's amazing.

So I've been a part of it for three years. I was there before I had an employee. One one of my mentors, he he recommended it to me. And when I went in there, you know, I I was surrounded by big CEOs, guys that own law firms with, you know, 80 attorneys or so that are making millions. And I, you know, showed up with, like I had my first t shirt, I think, with my company logo.

Yeah. And that that has been influential.

Steve: And I think for a lot of people that are listening to this show. Right? I mean, networking it's key to network inside of real estate, but it's also key to network with people outside of real estate. And Vistage is great for that. Right?

Because it's It's huge.

Colin: It is huge.

Steve: Correct me if I'm wrong. It's it's local people that are business owners. And it's invite only, if I remember correctly.

Colin: Correct. And it's basically you get with different business owners. So some are you know, everybody has to be a CEO or a business owner. You know, there's people that can own IT companies, cleaning companies, construction companies. Mhmm.

You get a group of non like kind of businesses to act as each other's board. Yeah. And and the the problems that you can solve, especially I mean, in real estate, oftentimes it says, where's the next deal? What what are you finding? Where are you raising capital?

Lots of the issues I find does come down, I think you touched on this, is people. Mhmm. And lots of what we talk about is finding the right people.

Steve: Yeah. Absolutely. So that's cool. And then I'm seeing here in the notes that limiting beliefs is something that's important to you. What can we talk about, you know, limiting beliefs?

Colin: Yeah. So at the beginning, I think always, you know, I had a lot of doubt that I could do this. Every morning, I I doubted that I could do this, you know. I said, hey, Colin. Why do you think you can go out and, you know, be a millionaire and start this when you have a really good job?

You should be thankful for it. You should be thankful. You got your masters, you know. You you you hit the you hit the good years, you know. You got thirty more years till retirement.

I I really think that, you know, getting up, exercising in the morning, and then just knowing that you can accomplish anything as long as you work for it. Mhmm. I mean, that is but I had those limiting beliefs forever. As I said, I was 32. I've got a kid working for me now.

He's 18 years old. He's just invested in our properties and owns his own real estate. And and when I see that, that is just, like, that is super inspiring.

Steve: Yeah. So I think, you're offering, like, who am I? Who am I to go challenge status quo? Who am I like, why would I deserve this? Right?

To eventually I don't know. Correct me if I'm wrong here. Alright. To eventually, like, why not me? Absolutely.

Right. Why shouldn't I succeed?

Colin: Yes.

Steve: What like, what what what are the reasons for me not to go out and get what I feel I can do?

Colin: And and the the end part of that is that you can help people.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: I mean, what I've noticed more I mean, one of my big goals, and I'm I'm a big fan of your goal, but I want, if my employees want it, to make them millionaires in five years. Yeah. Lots of our employees invest in our real estate. We partner on deals together. Mhmm.

And just being able to see their net worth grow is phenomenal. Property management, I can only pay so much, you know, at a w two salary job. There is a cap based on the income of the actual company itself. You can't pay somebody a million dollars a year in a property management company. But if they can find the skills and gain the skills and be able to network, partner with myself, partner with my partners, and gain, you know, $10.20, 50, hundreds of thousands of dollars in equity Mhmm.

That that's the real win right there.

Steve: Yeah. So let's talk about that. Because that's something I think is is really important. Right? Like because I'm I'm just as passionate.

I want everyone around me to succeed at a very, very high level. So how do you as a business owner help someone succeed? Right? Because there's there's only so much income that we can pay, but there's other ways that we can help them grow. So how can what are some strategies for other people listening to find a way to compensate our our our people well, I guess the way that you do it.

Colin: Yeah. I mean, so there's the abundance and scarcity mentality. I feel that lots of people don't wanna share a lot of the information. I'm an open book with my employees. Mhmm.

You know, there's a certain level you have to get to before I start, you know, telling all the details, obviously. But I provide them all the details of this is how a deal works. If you can go find a deal, you you've have additional time and you really want this, use the skills that you learn learn here. Also, utilize our system. One of our individuals, he announced at a meetup.

He said, hey. You know, I have experience property managing. If you want wanna get in a deal and you have capital, let's do it. Somebody approached him right then and gave him a $100,000. He got into the deal.

I got onto the deal with them because they needed help guiding.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: And now he owns 30 or 40 units. Yeah. That's within, you know, two and a half, three years.

Steve: Right.

Colin: So really being an open book and providing them value and allowing some partnerships to come in.

Steve: Yeah. That's fascinating. That's awesome.

Colin: And it creates a lot of loyalty too. I mean, once again, as you said, you can only pay so much. But if you can see somebody's income growing, them actually building wealth, that that is one of the most impactful things anybody can do.

Steve: Well, I think there's two different ways to compensate. Right? One's income and the other is creating wealth.

Colin: Correct.

Steve: And I think that's awesome. That's awesome that you're doing that. So now that you're at this level, again, just shy of 2,000 units, you have the same exact partners?

Colin: So I've probably had I've had a lot of partners, but I have two main business partners. Correct?

Steve: Okay. So, let's talk about those partnerships. How how have the partnerships evolved?

Colin: So we all had to learn about each other. So Steven was my first partner. Chris was my second partner. Really, I mean, it's it's it's like dating. You know, it's like a marriage.

You don't know right away, so you're kind of, you know, testing the waters, seeing where this goes, seeing the the work ethic of the other individual, what what they're what they're putting in. Also, their passion. Mhmm. I think both these individuals and why we're this trio is because we all have a certain level of passion, but we all have a very select set of skills. I work on the operations side.

Steven's on the brokerage side. Chris is on the acquisition side. Yeah. So we all kind of have our roles. We're basically a Venn diagram.

So, you know, capital raising, we all may touch on it. Asset management, we all may touch on it. But together, we've kind of filled in kind of this void. I mean, we we as I said, we do own a title company, a hard money lending company, and a company.

Steve: We're gonna get into that vertical integration component in

Colin: a second. Okay.

Steve: So one thing about partnerships is the waters can get a little choppy. Oh, yeah. Right? So what are some things that you can share to ensure that the partnerships are are sturdy, you know, make sure everyone's happy? Because kinda like you you touched on a moment ago.

One reason why a lot of partnerships fail is that one person thinks they're doing more than the other. And it's not even true. Right? Like, even you're carrying a full fifty fifty, just the way human psychology works. We know what's in front of us.

We see the work we do. We can't see the work that they're doing. So just naturally, we feel like we're doing more than the other person if it's a true fifty fifty. So what are some things that you've done to ensure a successful, coexistence isn't the right word, but, you know, where everyone's happy?

Colin: The more we communicate, the better our partnership gets.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: Daily communication is absolutely critical. I mean, there's been some periods where we've gone maybe like a week or two without this daily communication. And you can tell the partnership does start shifting a bit because we are I mean, you you said it correctly. We could all be doing the same amount of work but in the back of my mind, you know, I'm dealing with property management. Things are blowing up.

I'm dealing with all these contractors, 80 different projects going on. I'm like, well, what are these guys doing? Yeah. Because I'm stuck in my own head. Daily communication because then you know what what each other are doing.

You can hold each other not not just accountable, but you can ask ask help from them. You know, early on in our partnerships, we would structure it a little differently. It'd be like, okay. If I found the deal, I get this much of a fee. You get that much of a fee.

If I bring the money, you get this much. I get that much. We realized that was creating unhealthy competition where we weren't working together. We we realized we were actually competing on the same deals with each other even after we were partners because we were still looking for that. Okay.

You know, I wanna get this additional fee. So he said, whatever it is, we're splitting it. So property management, everybody splits in that. Brokerage, everybody splits in that. You know?

Syndication side, everybody splits in that equally so we can all focus on our strengths.

Steve: So, let's talk about syndications. This is something that, if you never heard of it, it's mind boggling. Right? As you get more seasoned, it's interesting. So let's talk about syndication.

I'm brand new. I don't know anything about it. How would you explain syndication?

Colin: So syndication is basically pulling investors' capital. It's SEC regulated. You know, you're filing a five zero six b, five zero six c. So once again, that's that's maybe not the the new terminology, but you're pulling investors' capital to invest passively in deals that myself as the general partner, you as the investor, the limited partner, are putting together to receive passive income from. So it allows for individuals that have additional capital to invest in multifamily real estate without having to do the property management and be the operator.

While we operate it, we find the deal. We do all the sourcing. We run the property management. We're either the property managers or we're the asset managers for that project.

Steve: How many of these do you have to do? Like, if, you you raise some funds to by an apartment complex. You have to do raise capital for that project. Can you use the same syndication by the next one, or you have to do a new syndication every single time?

Colin: You have to do a new syndication every time.

Steve: And this funds does that cost for every syndication?

Colin: So legal fees are between, like, 13 and 17,000. Obviously, then there's closing fees and everything. So what we've started doing is we've actually been packaging deals together. So most recently, we had a portfolio of four different buildings we packaged together. One reason we did that is because of the fees and not having to do that multiple times.

There's a

Steve: lot It is kinda irritating to have to do a new syndication for every single property.

Colin: It is. You know, with with these portfolios, we're able to get some risk mitigation because we have multiple different projects. So if one doesn't perform as well, we have another one to bring it up. But, yeah, every every project is a is a new syndication.

Steve: Yeah. And then vertical integration. Right? Like, you're talking about all these different things. So let's go all the way back to the beginning.

Your first year you started project management company. Mhmm. What was the next company after that?

Colin: The next company was a syndication company, which is Park Ave Capital, investment company.

Steve: Alright. And then after that?

Colin: That was the, we've started a lot recently. So that was the Hard Money Lending Company.

Steve: Alright. So Hard Money Lending. Yes. Who do you service? Who's a good who's a good client for you?

Colin: Flippers.

Steve: Okay.

Colin: Flippers and, we honestly borrow money from the Hard Money Lending Company too for smaller buy and hold projects, but, anybody wanting to buy it, buy a project, get in rehab and then get out of it. It's, you know, six month periods, 18% interest only.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: And some consider that really high, which obviously if you're paying 18% for thirty years, that's really high. But if you're holding on to this property for three months and you're avoiding all these additional closing costs, additional fees that a bank would charge and you're able to, you know, recoup your capital and you build it into the project, it makes perfect sense.

Steve: Yeah. So is that if you're flipping in Omaha or you're flipping in general?

Colin: We service a couple states, but Kansas City, Missouri, Omaha, and Iowa.

Steve: Got it. Alright. So hard money and then?

Colin: Brokerage. So I I do not have my brokerage license, but my partner, Steven, we're brokered in six states, I believe, right now.

Steve: Oh, really?

Colin: Yes. Yep. So we have CCIM designated brokers on staff. This really is a tool for us to both sell our properties, but also in acquiring. What's the name of your, Cascade Commercial.

Steve: Cascade Commercial. Okay. I like that. So you got CCIMs in every single state.

Colin: Correct. For

Steve: everyone that doesn't know what CCIM is?

Colin: I would ask you. It's not not the broker.

Steve: So I don't I don't remember

Colin: what it's It's a it's a designation of, like, the highest level of, like, commercial, commercial real estate brokerage, designation.

Steve: Yeah. So it's it's, I don't know. I wanna say four to six weeks of training. Right? Like, all these classes.

Mhmm. You can do it online. You can go travel somewhere else. But, yeah, if you get you're not taken seriously in commercial real estate if you don't have a CCIM. Correct.

So alright. So, you'll get this, you got six different commercial brokerages. So no one's a licensed realtor. They're just doing commercial.

Colin: Just just commercial.

Steve: That's correct. Alright. And then after that?

Colin: We recently started a construction company, which just services, projects in house for now. Mhmm.

Steve: But we

Colin: realized we're subbing things out. We're doing so much work, and it was kind of nobody was really the point person. I was helped GC ing. Brad on my team was helped GC ing. We were all kind of doing that, so we started the construction company.

And then next, which we just recently started, was the third party property management. Now this we teamed up with another company that manages our properties in Kansas City, Atlas Property Management. My company is Bricktown. We came up with Bratless, that took that took thirty seconds to to come

Steve: up with.

Colin: So those are servicing our properties that are now out of state. We're starting to transition to that. We will pick up third party clients. So we're really on the business development side, at least mine me and my team. The other team with Atlas is really on kind of the operations, but we kind of oversee the hiring and kind of building out of that because the the more and more that we do this, operations are the most important thing in this business.

Mhmm. People talk about the deal, getting the deal, getting the money. No. It's operations. If you if you don't operate well, you're gonna go down.

You're you're gonna extend your timeline on projects. I think the reason we've been able to move so quickly and grow so quickly is we understand the time value of money. And having solid operations allows us to, like, tighten up those efficiencies.

Steve: Right. So third party private management and then?

Colin: Oh, title company. We did just start a title company. So and the reason I say, oh, is because we actually partnered with, it's platinum title out of Nebraska. So they handle all the back end work. We're the lead generation.

So So all of our hard money hard money lending clients, all the projects we're acquiring, there are quite a few partners on that that are in Nebraska, some that have flipping businesses, wholesaling businesses, and then we push it all to the title company.

Steve: Gotcha. Alright. So there was a time when you had a 100 properties where you were working nonstop, working crazy hours, and you weren't making as much as you're expecting to make. Mhmm. Are you finding, as you build all these different companies, that sometimes you feel like it's going back to that those days?

Colin: How does it feel for you, Steve?

Steve: Sometimes it feels like those days.

Colin: Yeah. I work a lot. I just recently hired an executive assistant because I was not able to check my emails. I mean, I got off the plane yesterday with a 158 missed text messages. And that's three hours.

Yeah. So yeah. But I will say the pay has increased substantially. So that that that then is kind of the causation of it. Mhmm.

And I really enjoy it. Yeah. It's that that's a that's a good problem to have. I love what I do.

Steve: And it's a great problem to have. So I was actually, I was at the IMN conference, for the last couple of days. And I bumped into Terry Summers. He's up in, Ohio. And we were talking, like he was asking me what was I gonna be there all three days.

I was like, no. I already committed to so many different things. It's like, but, like, you should be here. I was like, I know I should be here. But I've committed to all these different things.

And basically, what it is is that as we build our own businesses and because we understand sales and marketing. Right? And all our businesses are initially sales and marketing. So we built out our businesses, and then we built out the we hired the right people to get it running. Once we get the right people to run it correctly, then we go start another business.

That bogs out all our time. And then eventually, we hire the right people to get it so we have some more free time. And then we start another business. It's this it's this vicious cycle that we can't help ourselves, but we also love

Colin: You're absolutely correct because, you know, on the property management side, it's starting to get, at least for our company Bricktown in Omaha, it's starting to get a lot more automated. I have a really good team there. They're running the staff meetings. You know, we have KPIs all set up. I mean, it's very self sufficient.

There's a lot of things going on that I don't know what's going on, you know. I can see it all, but they're taking care of it. Then we go start something out of state. Then we start a construction company. Mhmm.

And it's just yes. You're a 100% correct. And it's eighty twenty rule, you know. And I start putting 80% of my time over there.

Steve: And another thing that you and I talked about, right before we started recording was, as you start other other businesses, the challenges that we face are no longer really have almost nothing to do with the industry. Right? Like, it's not necessarily finding the right contractors. It's not necessarily or, you know, how do you solve this particular issue? It's we're all fighting for the same valuable resource, which is human capital.

Time. Yeah. And right now, it's really hard to find good people. Yes. How are you solving that problem as you're continuing to grow all these different ventures?

I mean, that

Colin: that is one of the most difficult, but I think it's, I'm sure you get a lot of people that wanna come work with you, Steve.

Steve: Oh, yeah.

Colin: You know why? Because you're great at what you do. You have a great personality. You are building a business that people can see Mhmm. Are passionate about.

That that's the way you find good people. I have unstoppable passion about my business and wanting to help people and valuing people. Now it's still really hard to find people, but I I do get approached by a lot of individuals that see the opportunity, and it's not so much everybody wants to get paid, but more than that, people wanna be valued. And they wanna find they wanna find value in what they're doing. Mhmm.

They they wanna enjoy what they're doing, and they wanna see growth. People like the ability to see something grow and actually be impactful on it. So when finding somebody good, don't put them into a square peg. Don't just put them into a box. Let them be who they're gonna be and find their strengths.

If their strengths fit with your organization, let them grow their strengths. Mhmm. I mean, we regularly sit down with our team. You mean, right? What do you think what are the top three things you do to increase income of this company?

K. So what are the three things that you do daily, weekly that make money for this company? On the other side, what do you like to do and what do you don't? What do you not like to do? All of a sudden, we find this kind of cross pollination of things that some people hate doing while somebody else may love to do it.

Yeah. And then it's like, okay. Well, you can start filling that role. We'll pull you out of this role because you're gonna be more effective here, and you're gonna produce more income for the company doing that. So having people allowing them to find their passions, within what they're doing, because that's what we're doing.

Yeah. Building mini budding entrepreneurs, I guess.

Steve: Absolutely. And so, I just read the book or not just read. Just started reading the book, Multipliers. Have you read that book? I have not.

So what they talk about in that book is basically what you just mentioned here, which is something that I've done because, you know, I've gone through a strategic coach, the guy at Dan Sullivan who wrote the book Who Not How. But Great book. Yeah. So I went through his coaching program, many, many years ago. And that's what it was all it was always talking about.

Like, how to hire the right people, how to how to hire the best people. Right? And so I kinda went on this rant for a little bit, some time ago, which basically I thought the e myth is overrated. Because the e myth is talking about you gotta hire everyone that's like 15 year that a 15 year old can do this job. Right?

In reality, you have to high you have to hire people that have passion. And then once you've identified that passion, their zone of genius, and figure out where their zone of genius, how it applies to your company, and put them in that seat. And then let them leave them alone. Let them flourish. And if you can do that, you can create amazing business.

Right? But I think so many people are focused on like years and early. You don't look for experience. You look for talent.

Colin: That's it.

Steve: A lot of people are looking for experience. Right? Who can I plug and play? Right? Put them in the seat.

Leave them alone. Because they know how to do a job. No. You gotta find someone that's passionate about it and then leave them alone.

Colin: I I couldn't agree more. I mean our construction company started because one of our employees just started flourishing in that direction. Mhmm. I mean he was a coach before that, CrossFit coach and did a bunch of different things. But he he became really good at that.

Like he was all of a sudden just running projects. That's where he fell into you know Irvin with the leasing. You know, we've just found people that really find passions that fit fit these niches. So So I couldn't agree more. I mean, experience is great.

Experience may be able to start the job quicker, but also sometimes it comes with some bad habits. Experience isn't always good experience.

Steve: No. It's not. Well, sometimes you learn what what never what to do again. Exactly. So Alex on Instagram wants to know what is your Instagram?

Colin: Colin c Schwartz. There's an underscore between the Colin underscore c underscore Schwartz.

Steve: Perfect. So there's a few Colin Schwartz out there. So one thing we talked about here, is you've done 52 full cycle transactions. Can you explain, again, as if I've never done this before? Yep.

By the way, I'm investing in my first apartment complex. So Congratulations. Thank you. So can you explain what is a full cycle transaction?

Colin: You know, I actually had an a question to ask, Steve, is why aren't you in multifamily? So I I do kinda wanna dive into that why it's why you just started getting into it. But, no, that's great. So a full cycle transaction, how we define it is you invest a $100,000 into a project, say it's a $500,000 building, you know, 80% LTV. After a year, year and a half, we rehab the building.

We get it stabilized. We then refinance, and we pull back a $100,000 back out Mhmm. Thus returning a 100% of the capital. We've done that 52 times, with deals up to 87 units. The 52 also includes duplexes as well.

Yeah. We've pulled out anywhere. I mean, our goal is always at least 80%, but we have pulled out a 100% for 52 buildings.

Steve: Yeah. So what people talk about was BRRRR.

Colin: Exactly.

Steve: You're doing the BRRRR Yep. On apartments, but we don't call it BRRRR as we call it full cycle transactions.

Colin: That that that's what we call it. And, I I think the really powerful thing of this is when you're pulling out that capital, there it's not taxed. Remember, it's still debt. Mhmm. So you shouldn't go buy a Ferrari with it.

You should reinvest that capital Mhmm. And make sure the property still cash flows. But then you still own the asset, which is still cash flowing Mhmm. Which should still be appreciating, which At

Steve: a lower interest rate.

Colin: At a lower interest rate, lots of times better debt terms.

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: Because typically we start off with community banks, then we'll go to, you know, Freddie Mac, which has longer term debt. But, yeah, better interest rates, which increases our cash flow. So even though we're increasing our debt, we're getting a 100% of our capital back out. We're improving our cash flow and typically it's a nonrecourse debt. So that is that that is the game.

So, I mean, burning houses sounds fun. Multifamily, I feel like, is just less risky.

Steve: But what if I really want a Ferrari?

Colin: You can buy a you can do whatever you want with money. Just know that it's still debt. So anything I've ever, purchased that's been, like, an extravagant or or luxury, it's been because I've sold something. Mhmm. I worry that, you know, if you start getting too, reckless with your capital on the refinance Mhmm.

It's still debt. Yeah. You still owe it to somebody. Right.

Steve: It's not free and

Colin: clear. It's not free and clear. So, I mean, it's okay if you hold on to the asset. It's still cash flowing. You know, my cash flow, I can do that.

I mean, you can spend it on whatever you want, but I I just do wanna point that out is Yeah. That it's still debt.

Steve: On a side note, I also just invested in a community bank. So

Colin: Really?

Steve: So that's gonna be, exciting too.

Colin: So how many businesses do you have? Do you know?

Steve: See. So we have the wholesaling company, a real estate team, real estate brokerage, title company. Just partner up with investor lift. We have the sales training program. Just started investing in apartments, investing at a bank.

I think that's everything. There's probably more out there.

Colin: That's awesome. That's awesome. Where do you focus most of your time?

Steve: Title company.

Colin: Nice. Yeah. Where do you focus most of your time?

Steve: The sales training.

Colin: Okay. Sales training.

Steve: Because that's where I get to teach. And that's the part where it's it's interesting. Like, I wanted to be a school teacher. And it sounds crazy. But I wanted to be a school teacher and tell us how much they made.

Right? Like, I mean, I was I had this, physics teacher, freshman year of high school. So inspiring. Loved the guy. And he was so passionate about teaching.

I was like, man, like, that's so cool. He's, you know, he's changing the younger generation. Then I saw how much teachers made. I was like, well, I'm not doing that. But now I get to teach.

And I get paid very, very well

Colin: Yeah.

Steve: To teach. So on TikTok, Bergen wants to know, what's your advice for an individual who's just starting to invest in real estate?

Colin: So the the biggest thing is to to educate yourself. There's no easy button in this industry. Identify what what you have right now. Do you have time? Do you have skills?

Do you have capital? You have to have one of those three. If you don't have any of those three, you gotta find one of them. You gotta find one of them. That that that's it.

You know, for me, I had a little bit of capital, but I had a lot of drive so I found time. Mhmm. I found time. I woke up earlier. Educate yourself and then network.

So, I mean, some actionable steps is create your personal financial statement right now, then go talk to three bankers. Then you're gonna know how much you can borrow. You you're gonna know what you can buy. They say you can buy zero? Okay.

Now you know you have to go find somebody with capital. You're gonna find a hard money lender. You're gonna find a private investor. But I found doing that first, I knew what my limits were on what I could purchase realistically. I'm not saying there's no limits.

You can't not go buy a $100,000,000 apartment complex your day one. But to have a realistic limit, because then that identified my criteria of properties I was looking at. I was like, okay. I can afford up to $500,000 of properties. Well, I'm not gonna be looking at $10,000,000 properties.

Mhmm. Not yet. Go to every networking event in town. Go. Even if you don't know anything.

Yeah. Everyday also, one of the biggest things I did, I wish I still did it, was I journaled when I first started and I had to make one actionable step every day. An actionable step is not, you know, plugging in an audible and falling asleep to it. Mhmm. An actionable step is meeting with that lender, filling out my PFS, and finding out what I can purchase.

It was going to a networking event and not just sitting in the back, but it was having a meaningful conversation with somebody and a contact. You can do that every day. I mean, it's a a Darren Hardy compound effect.

Steve: Absolutely.

Colin: 1% better every day. That's it. You you you're not you're not gonna go out and just hit home runs, but just 1% better every day. Get up early. Don't waste time.

Educate. Educate. Educate. Educate.

Steve: Yeah. I was at, I went to the IMN conference here. It's here right now. And it actually I enjoyed it because it took me back to the early days of where I was small fish in a big pond. Right?

These guys are doing thousand plus transactions a month, right, of houses a month. So the conversations you have in that room are very different than your day to day conversations. So I think to your point, like go out and network. Your your language will change. The way you think will change.

If you're connecting with other people that are doing the kind of things that you wanna do. You're not that person today that can buy an apartment complex, if you haven't started yet. But you hang it you hang around with enough people that either own apartment complexes, fund fund apartment complexes, or looking at them, your vocabulary changes. Your thinking process changes.

Colin: I I couldn't agree more. I mean, when I started, my goal was 16 rental units.

Steve: Yeah.

Colin: That was it. That was that was it. I thought I'd hit, you know, the gold mine then. But you start hanging out with people and as I said, you know, met somebody that had 50 units. And now we're developing a 130 units, you know, in Omaha.

We're doing ground up development. We bought, you know, 260 units in Fort Worth, Texas. None of that would have been possible if I just sat at home by myself thinking I could maybe do it or not do it. It's impossible. To your point, you have to get out.

You have to network because somebody's gonna tell you something and you're gonna realize that it's possible.

Steve: Right. Well, and that's exactly it. You know, I go to Collective Genius. So I go there. Actually, I'm going next week.

And, like, it can become a game of like, wow. They're doing this. They're doing that. I'm inadequate. Right?

And I think for some people, a good amount of people, you hear that, you feel inadequate, and you feel like you're not doing enough. For me, every time I hear someone's kicking my butt, I get excited. I know what's possible. Not only do I know what's possible, I know how to get there because we're friends. I can call them up and ask these questions.

Here's where I'm stuck. How did you accomplish this? Right? And you kinda talk about you're a coach. So that's the value in coaching.

But on top of that, joining the right mastermind network with the right people, you don't have to do this all yourself. No. The information's all You

Colin: shouldn't you shouldn't do it all yourself. I mean, you you need to take, I guess, initially, like, do it yourself by picking up a book Mhmm. And don't go and ask, you know, don't reach out to picking up a book Mhmm. And don't go and ask, you know, don't reach out to the most successful person. If you're just starting, don't text Grant Cardone or reach out, hey, how do I become rich like you?

That's that's a poor question. Get the base knowledge of what real estate is and what you wanna do, But then, yeah, network and listen.

Steve: Yeah. It's incredibly powerful. So a follow-up question by Alex on Instagram. What will be better for more cash flow, Airbnb or apartment complexes?

Colin: I'm gonna say it. I hate Airbnb. I've sure it can be better. I don't know. I've had a couple Airbnbs, and there's there's a couple ways I've lost money in real estate.

Airbnbs and flipping houses. There are there's a lot of market inconsistencies that can cause issues with those that I don't understand. Plenty of people do really well at flipping houses, plenty of people do well at Airbnbs. That's not my niche. Multifamily, there's a lot of, what I call it, safety nets, because you can prolong it.

You get residents in there. Sure. You may not get as much cash flow, but if a COVID nineteen hits, COVID twenty sixteen or whatever, and all of a sudden nobody's traveling and there's nobody in your Airbnb, k, well, you're not getting any cash flow from it. There are

Steve: people that I thought were gonna struggle with COVID with Airbnb.

Colin: They did better.

Steve: And they did better. They did. Right? Shocking.

Colin: Yes.

Steve: But for me, you know, I do plenty of risky things. All these different business ventures, there's plenty of risk and variety for me. But Airbnbs, I know that people are killing it, crushing it. Right? You know, 5 figure cash flow every single month.

But for me, that is still an early venture. Yeah. Right? Even like, you know, at IIMend, they're talking about, you know, these hedge funds. They're buying these houses houses every single month.

You know? One company owns, like, 86,000 houses across the country. The things that they are running into right now, and it's not necessarily a challenge, but it's kinda like a yellow flag, is that now that they're buying so many houses, congress is like, hey. Is this the right thing for the American dream? Is this the best thing for the American public to have all this Wall Street money owning all this real estate?

Right? Multifamily has been multifamily

Colin: Mhmm.

Steve: For decades. Yes. Right? No one's gonna be like, hey. Colin's making a little bit too much money.

We need to change how things work. Now they might change the tax laws, which would really suck. Yes. But beyond that, it's not that's gonna be that's gonna affect everybody. That's not gonna be multifamily specific.

So

Colin: Yeah. And one thing to add for the Airbnb. So I I had been asked this question before. So say if, you know, an Airbnb, it's rented out for 365 days a year with a new person, that's 365 transactions. That's 365 pieces of work Mhmm.

That go on with it. That's a cleaner. That's coordination of 365 different pieces. I lease out an apartment to one person. That's one piece of work.

Sure. There's gonna be maintenance requests. But if you looked at that, I could go rent out 365 apartments

Steve: Mhmm.

Colin: And have a lot more scalability.

Steve: Right.

Colin: So I I think Airbnb makes sense if you can find good systems and if you do scale it. But, gosh, the amount of work that goes into it, and, I mean, there's a lot of ways to lose money in it.

Steve: The thing that scares me about it is the urgency component.

Colin: Yes.

Steve: Right? Because the the the reviews are so important. And I'm speaking this completely as an idiot because I'm I don't do Airbnbs. Right? But the things that scare me is that, you know, since the reviews are so important, that if you're not responsive, you know, you're getting a four star review, three star review, and now, like, you're no longer in the algorithms.

Colin: Yes. No. Thank you. It's just

Steve: This whole other thing.

Colin: It sounds fun.

Steve: It really is. Sounds really sexy.

Colin: Yes. Yeah. And as I said, I've done three of them. And all of them have failed. And now I have furniture for sale.

Steve: So now that you've got, you know, this many doors. Right? Close to 2,000 doors. I'm curious. What does your marketing budget look like?

And what does your overhead look like?

Colin: So that that's a good question. So on the property management side, as I said, we've we started the year with, like, three employees and now we're at 18. So I'd actually have to go look at that marketing. I mean, we I didn't get my first website until this year. Mhmm.

So most people start off with a business card, a website, kind of the opposite. Yeah.

Steve: So we There's there's wisdom in that.

Colin: I I think, you know, I get asked a lot, you know, hey. When do I form my entity? I'm gonna start this business. I I formed it right before the property closed. Mhmm.

I need to find the property. I need to find something that actually created business and value. As far as marketing, we we don't do a lot of marketing. We have started I mean, this is marketing. Getting on bigger pockets, that's marketing.

Getting on social media, you know, I pay some money for the meetup to to host that. We we are now building out new websites. We are gonna rebrand, but maybe it's, like, $40 a year or so Yeah. On that. Overhead, though, it it's it's quickly changing.

Steve: Yeah. Well, labor, for most companies, is the single largest expense on the p and l.

Colin: Yeah. I mean, we're we're approaching, you know, probably by next year, it'll be 7 figures for sure.

Steve: Yeah. So what's what's your biggest struggle right now?

Colin: You know, probably a similar struggle to you. You know, we have a lot of opportunities and how do I prioritize my time and and, yeah. It's it's always time. It's always where do I best put my time. That's the biggest struggle.

We are finding great people. We are growing. We are seeing success. But, yeah, personally, it's just, you know, finding time and and juggle juggling it all at once.

Steve: We find the time and then we screw it up. Yes. At least that's what I do.

Colin: Yes. You are correct. Yeah. 100%.

Steve: What is your superpower?

Colin: You know, it's it's funny because I I asked a couple people knowing I was gonna come on here, because it it feels weird to say, hey, I'm great at this. You know, and some of the answers I got back is, you know, valuing people but valuing their time. And valuing their time also correlates to money. Mhmm. One of the people I asked, they said, when you get an investor in, you know that their dollar that they're investing is their time.

That they may have spent, you know, a year at a job to invest a $100,000 with you and you respect that. So it's really valuing people. Mhmm. It's it's the most important thing. It's the most important thing in business.

Treat people like they walk on water.

Steve: Yeah. Well, I think it's it's it's so important to business, and so many people miss it. But it's one of the most valuable leadership principles. Right? Like, if you don't value people, why would they stick with you?

It's, you know, number one cause of of divorce is financial. Right? But the number one cause of infidelity is not financial. Right? It's appreciation.

Colin: Mhmm.

Steve: And so there's a lot of of wisdom in appreciating people. So that's your superpower. That's that's awesome. What's the greatest lesson you've learned?

Colin: Gosh. Always always ask the question you're thinking. Like, and what what I mean by that is find a mentor as soon as possible Mhmm. And invest in your education for what you're interested in. If I could go back you know, I'm very fortunate 32 I figured this out at the age of 32.

And then I look at people that are 18 and they start finding mentors and are educating themselves and it's like, gosh, you know, if I could just go back and do that. I am

Steve: a little envious of that.

Colin: Very envious, very envious of, you know, you know, I love it. I've got three beautiful children married. It's a little different than the 25 year old that owns 50 rental units and is traveling across the country. That's, you know, kind of experience.

Steve: But it's Fast fan.

Colin: Yep. Yep. Fast fan.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. What is your favorite, best, or most interesting failure?

Colin: Most interesting failure. That's a that's a good question. Most interesting failure is it's turned into a strength, but it was having loyalty to my previous job. So, you know, working in IT before that I worked at a grocery chain for seven years. And when I left I was making 38,000 a year working seventy five to eighty hours a week, managing two three hundred people.

Wow. So wasting that time when I probably could have been doing something else, you know. Yeah. But I got something out of it. So I mean, what what do they say?

Education, you know, is experience or you know, a failure becomes experience. Mhmm. And that that's what it was.

Steve: Yeah. And then what book have you given more than any other?

Colin: I mean, Rich Dad Poor Dad. But two of my favorite books are Shoe Dog, by Phil Knight. That that's an incredible book. I love the quote in there. The cowards never started.

The week died along the way. And that leaves us. I I feel like that's a perfect exemplification of, like, what a entrepreneur is.

Steve: Yeah.

Colin: You know, there's so many people that don't start. There's so many people that get scared. And then that leaves us. Right. We're sitting right here.

Steve: Yeah. People say, like, you know, aren't you afraid to share those all this information? Like, most people aren't gonna do anything with it.

Colin: No. And and if they do, they'll likely become our friends and we can do deals together.

Steve: Exactly.

Colin: I have found that more than anything.

Steve: Yeah. You know, when I was on the way up, right, like, you know, as a struggling entrepreneur, I would reach out to people that are more successful. And they were so happy to share their wisdom with me. Like, basically, what we do here on this podcast was a lunch I would have with them. And they were so happy to share because they were hoping someone would actually do something with it.

Colin: Yes.

Steve: Right? Like, please, will you be the one that I'm sharing this imparting this information with and will do something with it. And what people don't really talk about, there are a lot of people that are happy to mentor that lose interest in it. Because there have been so many people that have come along to ask them questions, pick their brains

Colin: Picked their brains.

Steve: And done absolutely nothing with it.

Colin: Yes.

Steve: And it's like, what's the point in like, what's the point of having coffee with this person? Like, the odds of this person succeeding if I have coffee with them is near zero, so why would I waste my time?

Colin: It's, you know, and I and I'm sure you find that all the time. Everybody wants to pick your brain. Everybody wants to take you to coffee. I know I ask anybody that does that, have you read these books and do you know this simple terminology? Because then that proves like the work ethic.

Out of a 100 people, you know, hundreds of people that have done it, there's been three or four and now they're doing deals. But, you know, you give that and that's worth your time. But I agree with you that that can be frustrating, but every entrepreneur wants to share their knowledge with somebody that's gonna do something with it.

Steve: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we're creating more more millionaires. So Tammy on Instagram wants to know, how do you train your cold callers? Do you have cold callers?

Colin: I don't have cold callers.

Steve: Yeah. Well, if you want to train your cold callers, Tammy, we actually have a sales training program. So you can check that out. I want you to think about something you wanna deal with the services with while I make just a couple of quick announcements. Guys, as you just heard, OfferFast got acquired by InvestorLift.

So if you guys want to get involved with InvestorLift, it's what we're using now to dispo our properties. We're making more money now using, InvestorLift than we were making, on our own without it. If you guys got value today, please like, subscribe, share, and comment. It really does help us reach more people in the algorithms. And, we do have our all day sales training coming up on December 10.

Might be too short of notice a week for you guys, but all day sales training in our office. If you guys do sign up during the podcast, you guys get $500 off. And joining us next week, we got Nate Hirschberg and Brian Sigman. Alright. So what are the last thoughts you wanna leave the listeners with?

Colin: It's all people. At the end of the day, it's all people. So often we think about things as widgets or deals or margins or cash flow. Mhmm. It's all people.

Mhmm. People wanna help people that wanna help people.

Steve: Yeah.

Colin: It's it's really simple. I mean

Steve: It's really simple, but it's one of those things that takes so many years of trial and error to figure out. Right? Because you start if I could just find a deal.

Colin: Yes. That's

Steve: it. You just start if I could just find a deal. Right? If I could just find a deal, everything would be fine. And then you come to a point where the deals are easy.

It's it's not hard to find deals anymore. No. Now it's like, well, how can I get someone to talk to these people? Right? You gotta hire people.

Yep. And then you got these people and they're working. They're bringing in more deals. Okay. Now we got to deal with all these transactions.

How How can I how can I, you know, get these transactions done? Hire more people. Hire more people. Right.

Colin: And the people need to treat people well. Yeah. Yeah. And invest in multifamily. I I I truly believe it it it is made such a compound effect on my life Yeah.

Of wealth building. You know, I've hit my retirement goal number. I used to run this number, you know, when I worked at the grocery chain of the dollar amount of net worth I wanna hit. And I surpassed that thirty years earlier. Mhmm.

And multifamily, I I know lots of people listen, flip wholesale, etcetera. I would encourage people to invest in multifamily. The wealth building aspect of it is tremendous.

Steve: Well, you were asking me earlier, why am I not investing in whole in in multifamily? And I just, I'm just trying to stay in my lane, just try to focus on one thing. Right? Like, that's the reason why I haven't looked at it. Really, it's just another friend.

Right? She's like, hey. She posted like, hey. You know, we just bought this apartment complex. Alright.

Look. I got some extra money. Let's go ahead and, you know, see what this can do. Right? So let's dabble.

And so I got my first call last night. I don't know, like, because there's this whole process, right, for raising money.

Colin: Yep.

Steve: So they have to do these things to be complying with the SEC. So I was on that call. So now I'm qualified to fill out this next form to do this next thing, whatever it is. PM. There you go.

Colin: Yeah. Congrats.

Steve: Thank you, Peter.

Colin: No. It's exciting. Buy more.

Steve: Well, yeah. I think, that that the key here, right, is to to keep more of our own capital so that uncle Joe doesn't take it.

Colin: That's do do you pay taxes every year? So now now we're getting to the end of the show. But do you pay income taxes?

Steve: This is the reason why I'm investing in multifamily. Right? Yeah. Is that it's, the the these checks I had to write to uncle Joe are are not what I wanna pay.

Colin: Mhmm.

Steve: It's not a Ferrari, but it's a nice car.

Colin: Yeah. Right? It's it's something. Yeah. And you don't have to pay that.

Right.

Steve: What is

Colin: You invest in multifamily. Yeah.

Steve: That's the reason why we're investing in multifamily.

Colin: Invest in more multifamily so you

Steve: don't have

Colin: to pay income taxes. Alright. Kick it down the road.

Steve: Absolutely. Alright. Well, thank you. This was a whole lot of fun.

Colin: Appreciate it, buddy.

Steve: Coming in. Thank you guys for watching.

Colin: Thank you.

Steve: See you guys next week. Thank you.